1 2
nocones
nocones UltraDork
10/28/19 12:35 p.m.

Oh look another slow moving 202X build thread. 

TLDR: Nocones is building a challenge car.  Expect it to fail spectacularly.  Don't expect rapid progress for a few months.   If you're in Central IL and want to help let me know.

 

I’ve been watching the 20XX challenge coverage from afar for a number of years.  It has always looked like fun and the low budget approach has always appealed to me. 

I’ve “Started” several builds over the years and never managed to get to the big event.   The MG (Before I changed to Miata uprights and the 13B and cost ballooned to $7k), a 1991 turbo Miata I bought for $436 (It’s Towing/impound bill), a $1 Subaru 360 Shell bought from SVreX, a $150 Geo Metro (Still  have the Engine/trans for some future silliness).  Now that the MG is “done”, the kids are a little older and I’m not planning on moving any time soon it’s time to try again. 

My goals for the build are pretty simple.  Build something dumber than the MG is.   Also I want it to have a roof.  And with the new “tube frame” rules in the challenge my particular brand of creativity is encouraged. 

A few months back I was surfing the instaface and saw this image. 

Credit to Vanuf Art Design.

I was enthralled.   I loved the juxtaposition of the classic 60s lines with the current bulbous insanity that is LMP cars.  It tugged at the same part of my lizard brain that thought I needed to mash together a 1978 MG midget and a DTM car.

I Google Image searched endlessly and was able to determine that this was in fact just a photoshop celebration of what could be.  In fact it appears it’s creators did not even bless the internet with a rear view and the side view I located is incomplete. 

I could not tolerate this I must make such a beast reality.   As an added bonus it will make a better track car then the MG.  It has a Roof and can be built with a full W2W cage from the beginning. 

So a plan was hatched.  I started searching craigslist for VW’s and started to do some preliminary design work.  That’s when the first hurdle was encountered.  It’s Too big!  The rendering looks the business but using a standard Bug windshield to keep the aesthetic close the finished vehicle would approach 7.5’ wide.  That’s too wide for my trailer, and just too wide overall.   I also started looking at weights and building with a  Bug as a base even using just the external sheetmetal the finished car would likely be 2400+ lbs.   Cost was also looking challenging as Bugs in my area tend to be $1k and the drivetrain would not be cheap.   At this point I became discouraged and pushed it all to the back of my mind. 

A few weeks later at work some coworkers were giving me a hard time about how many cars I own and one of them asked if I still had that old car hanging from my ceiling.  I said yeah I still had the old Subaru.  Someone unfamiliar with the 360 asked me what it was and I described it to them in my usual way..  Oh a Subaru 360 is a Japanese microcar that looks just like a ¾ scale VW Bug…  and that’s when it hit me.  The answer has been hanging in my garage for 10 years. 

Scaling the concept around a Subaru 360 works.  The shell is really close in width to a actual LMP car center section.  Weight can be very small as the 360 body with it’s sardine can sheetmetal is only 200lbs total.  Plus it will have suicide doors.

And the best part is I will actually be able to build it from 1 manufacture.  Desired power level will be ~200 WHP which is well within the limits of affordable Subaru engines.  A 2WD converted Subaru trans is fully capable of the power requirements. 

I was back on the hunt for parts and the GRM forum delivered a winner.  TheJed had listed a $300 Subaru Brighton for sale that came with a spare transmission and tons of spare parts.  I picked it up after a LONG delay (All on my end due to work) this Saturday while the $2019 challenge was doing concourse.  

It has everything I need but it’s entirely in too good of shape.   As GC8 coupe chassis are getting thin on the ground especially rust free ones I may be using it for a separate build but I have a transmission.    I also bought the engine from the Wartburg so I really already have an engine and trans for the LMP360.

 

So what do I have and what do I need?

Subaru 360 $1

Subaru Brighton $300 (Could FMV spare outback Trans)

Subaru 2.2L from Wartburg $700 (Could recoup VW swap parts)

Chassis worth of scrap metal from Driven5’s failed Fiero project $50

 

Current total: $1051

 

I’m debating using Miata uprights for this build.  The MG uses them and they work great.  The Subaru trans can easily be adapted to flange drive to be able to use the Miata halfshafts.  This would allow access to cheap Miata wheels and for practicality enable me to use common wheels and brakes with the MG.   I would be very interested in a set of Miata Subframes complete with brakes if anyone has them. 

So that’s that.  Progress will be slow for the next month or so as I get the garage straightened up and ready for the build to begin

mazdeuce - Seth
mazdeuce - Seth Mod Squad
10/28/19 12:40 p.m.

I've been thinking of the Beetle LMP car for a few years. Even drawn it out on paper a few times. I'm glad it's going to be done, and even happier that you figured out the width issue by going with the Subaru. That always stumped me. This should be cool. 

Dusterbd13-michael
Dusterbd13-michael MegaDork
10/28/19 12:41 p.m.

More pictures of the parts listed please. I need to build this in my brain....

Circuit_Motorsports
Circuit_Motorsports New Reader
10/28/19 12:44 p.m.

In reply to nocones :

Dude - this would be EPIC - please do this. Please.

Patrick
Patrick MegaDork
10/28/19 1:31 p.m.

Dude, number 1 i can write you receipts for the 2.2 and kennedy parts.  Number 2 berkeley yeah

sleepyhead the buffalo
sleepyhead the buffalo Mod Squad
10/28/19 1:46 p.m.

surprise

java230
java230 UberDork
10/28/19 4:30 p.m.

Ohh Following!!!

evildky
evildky SuperDork
10/29/19 8:59 a.m.

This reminds me of the isetta

AngryCorvair
AngryCorvair MegaDork
10/29/19 12:59 p.m.
Patrick said:

Dude, number 1 i can write you receipts for the 2.2 and kennedy parts.  Number 2 berkeley yeah

don't call them "kennedy parts".  those are expensive even on the used market.

nocones
nocones UltraDork
10/29/19 3:45 p.m.

In reply to AngryCorvair :

They are Kennedy parts and they were included in what I bought for $700.  But I only need to use the engine.  The Kennedy parts are not part of this project.  For this project I would be connecting the Wartburg 2.2L (value  $200?) Back to a Subaru trans.  The Kennedy parts are basically an entire VW swap kit (Clutch, Flywheel, Starter, belhousing plate).  

Need a line on a local pair of Miata subframes less a diff.  Anyone have anything in the MW?

 

Glad to see interest is high. I hope I can deliver.  I'm going to try to just do something every day and hopefully will have some great progress to show.  I could really use some teammates...  Mahomet Il is build location.

nocones
nocones UltraDork
12/1/19 1:22 a.m.

I haven't had a chance to really hit the garage yet.  I'm changing jobs in about a month but for now I'm still pretty busy with my current job.  The new one should give me more time to hang out with family and do garage stuff.  I have had a few evenings to remind myself how to poorly use sketchup and I'm working on the aesthetic a little.  Obviously it's a bit polygonny and isn't finished but it gives a reasonable approximation of what trying to match the look with a Subaru 360 would do.  Width is +2.5" for the stock 96 Subaru brighton track width.  

I think once I add the Aero stuff it will achieve the look I was wanting.  

I will keep tweaking on it.  Apparently you can do some good rendering with Sketchup so once I get it "done" I will try to make some better pictures.  

I'm getting excited to start making sparks.  

sleepyhead the buffalo
sleepyhead the buffalo Mod Squad
12/1/19 5:37 a.m.

I can see why Vanuf Art Design worked to avoid actually displaying a rearend rendering... that's going to take some noodling... even though it 'should' be relatively simple with a diffuser and some kind of 'deck'. 

Although, the subie engine will complicate the diffusers a little... unlike the A/C VW's, you can't really turn it into a two-sided blown diffuser setup using a fan to pull air up through the cooling fins. and then out the back.  So, the heads are probably going to limit how far forward you can bring the diffuser tunnel front edge.

wheelsmithy
wheelsmithy SuperDork
12/1/19 7:24 a.m.

Wow, radical!

 

RossD
RossD MegaDork
12/1/19 9:35 a.m.

This is awesome! 

Robbie
Robbie MegaDork
12/1/19 10:11 a.m.

Frickin awesome. I love this. 

I'll come help you if you come help me - I'm in very southern Chicagoland. And I'll be posting soon but I may have just got in over my head on a challenge build...

Also, I should have bought that Brighton (of course I didn't know I needed it until now, but oh well). If you decide not to use it or not to use some parts let me know.

vwcorvette
vwcorvette UltraDork
12/1/19 8:44 p.m.

Did you "draw" the 360 body or import it somehow from a file?

nocones
nocones UltraDork
12/2/19 6:03 a.m.

In reply to Robbie :

We may be able to work something out.  Honestly if someone found me a Outback, Legacy or Forester (slightly wider)with a  5 speed rusted to all hell for a trade for the Brighton I'd be down.  It would really be a shame to scrap this chassis after I take what I need off. 

nocones
nocones UltraDork
12/2/19 6:09 a.m.

I downloaded the Subaru model from the SketchUp library.  SketchUp is primarily an architectural tool however many people use it for other stuff.  They maintain a library of tens of thousands of 3D models people created.  It's user generated so some models are really really good others terrible.  

I actually downloaded the 360, and a 919 Hybrid for dimensional checks.  

I deconstructed the Subaru much like I will in reality.  I cut the fenders off at the body along the curve that Subaru 360s have.  I then positioned everything where I wanted and started filling in the gaps and extending the body back to the ground.

 

I've tweaked the rear, got the bottom aero done and am much happier with the look.  More pictures tonight.

vwcorvette
vwcorvette UltraDork
12/2/19 8:51 p.m.
nocones said:

I downloaded the Subaru model from the SketchUp library.  SketchUp is primarily an architectural tool however many people use it for other stuff.  They maintain a library of tens of thousands of 3D models people created.  It's user generated so some models are really really good others terrible.  

I actually downloaded the 360, and a 919 Hybrid for dimensional checks.  

I deconstructed the Subaru much like I will in reality.  I cut the fenders off at the body along the curve that Subaru 360s have.  I then positioned everything where I wanted and started filling in the gaps and extending the body back to the ground.

 

I've tweaked the rear, got the bottom aero done and am much happier with the look.  More pictures tonight.

Thanks.

AxeHealey
AxeHealey HalfDork
12/3/19 10:10 a.m.

I saw that same Beetle rendering on insta. This is such an awesome project.

tuna55
tuna55 MegaDork
12/3/19 10:19 a.m.

Wow. Wow.

 

 

So, wow.

 

Wow

Thinkkker
Thinkkker UltraDork
12/3/19 12:24 p.m.

With the rear "stays" extended behind the tires like that, it leaves a nice center opening just begging for a sweet diffuser to go in.  You can either center exit the exhaust there or just run the exhaust to the edges of the "stays".

Looks good, I gotta say, the MG was one that caught my eye when you first did the fenders way back.

nocones
nocones UltraDork
12/3/19 11:50 p.m.

Glad to see people are excited by this concept.  I am hopeful I can deliver.  I'm going to try to take what I learned from the MG and step it up a notch in the overall quality department to build something really special.

A day late but I got the V2.0 concept done.  Aero is more like LMP Themed at this point.  I am pretty happy with how the back looks.  I mean it's not perfect but it is substantially better then v1.0.  I threw some color on it just to see.  This one will for sure get painted.  Likely in some kind of Subaru themed Livery.  Probably Stars but in period correct colors.  Kinda this blue but with maybe offwhite for the stars.  The idea is to imagine that 1960's Subaru decided domination at LeMans was the way to expand.  

I also downloaded an EJ20R from sketchup.  I was excited to see that it *mostly* fits within the body.  The trans will definitely stick out however the model has the trans about 4" longer then reality and that's before 2WD conversion so it may not be as much as this image.  Although it looks all buisiness with a trans sticking out the back of the boot.  

nocones
nocones UltraDork
12/4/19 12:00 a.m.

And because I had too I did a "photoshoot" with it next to a stock 360.  It's in a word..  Different.    

That's all for now.  I'm going to start on a little bit of chassis work in Sketchup more for conceptualizing then anything.  If anything major changes with the design I will post some pictures.  I have about 8 days of vacation in the next Month so I hope there may be some real world progress to show.  

I really love the new forum upload photo feature.  It will make documenting this build way cool.  I'm probably going to play a little with Vloging during the build.  Or at least set the GoPro up for some interval pictures.   So expect some sweet liscense free trap/dubstep musiced build videos at a minimum.  

Javelin
Javelin MegaDork
12/4/19 1:01 a.m.

Holy. Berking. Crap. surprise

 

This thing is AMAZING! I remember the Beetle doodle and thinking that it would be really big compared to an LMP car but my goodness, the 360 is perfect for this. 

1 2
Our Preferred Partners
Q4HKsg3McdNQ9o3f26yV09w12rKUeM7ks89RAiZpGL9II4xWKb38Sf9eQbEouqEa