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Ian F
Ian F MegaDork
5/4/18 3:53 a.m.

In reply to Crackers :

The 3 spd and 4 spd have the same pattern, but with with one more gear. 

R-1-3

    2-(4)

The only difference is the whole thing is rotated 90° and on the column.  It's actually kinda fun. It would be very interesting to see if the levers on the two transmissions are the same.

But for better hwy cruising, a taller gear gear is probably more important.  Especially if there are no plans to use the car for towing. 

Cotton
Cotton PowerDork
5/4/18 4:02 a.m.

In reply to Ian F :

Yeah,  no towing for this one,  but I would like decent performance if possible.

 I’m fairly close to Memphis now....should be home by 7am or so.

Ian F
Ian F MegaDork
5/4/18 5:47 a.m.

If spirited off-line performance is desired, then a GV overdrive may be the easiest and most flexible - if not the cheapest - option.

ultraclyde
ultraclyde PowerDork
5/4/18 6:27 a.m.
Ian F said:

In reply to Crackers :

The 3 spd and 4 spd have the same pattern, but with with one more gear. 

R-1-3

    2-(4)

The only difference is the whole thing is rotated 90° and on the column.  It's actually kinda fun. It would be very interesting to see if the levers on the two transmissions are the same.

But for better hwy cruising, a taller gear gear is probably more important.  Especially if there are no plans to use the car for towing. 

The truck I had was converted to a floor shift for the 3spd Hurst by the PO, so I never had the chance to compare column linkages to the OD trans shifter.  The Hurst wasn't installed in quite the right place, so 2nd felt like it was in the glove box and sometimes it would bind up and you'd be stuck in 3rd. The fun thing was that with teh 390, you could dead roll from a stop in 3rd.

Ian F
Ian F MegaDork
5/4/18 6:40 a.m.

In reply to ultraclyde :

That sounds about the same as the stock shifter in the '78 F-150 I had with a NP435: 2nd and 4th were almost in the bench seat, 3rd was like punching the dashboard. Reverse was in the passenger's crotch ("oops. sorry..."). The throws were about 18" of travel distance at the knob. 

mazdeuce - Seth
mazdeuce - Seth Mod Squad
5/4/18 6:48 a.m.

Column shift is basically a very complex short shift kit stuck on the column. I agree that it's fun. 

Crackers
Crackers Dork
5/4/18 8:03 a.m.
Ian F said:

In reply to Crackers :

The 3 spd and 4 spd have the same pattern, but with with one more gear. 

R-1-3

    2-(4)

The only difference is the whole thing is rotated 90° and on the column.  It's actually kinda fun. It would be very interesting to see if the levers on the two transmissions are the same.

But for better hwy cruising, a taller gear gear is probably more important.  Especially if there are no plans to use the car for towing. 

I may be getting myself confused, as I suddenly realized that I've never dealt with a Ford transmission with multiple linkage rods, and I'm not entirely sure sure how their 4 speeds operate. 

However, for something like a Muncie 4 speed, (of which I am familiar) in theory the column could operate 1-4. With one arm handling 1-2 instead of R-1 and the other operating 3-4 instead of 2-3. 

I've driven many column shift manuals. My wagon was column shift before I cut it all up. We even towed the race car with a Chevy C10 with a 3-tree for a whole season. Of course that was in CA with a 55mph speed limit on anything towing a trailer. 

Now I'm going to have to research Ford shifting patterns. LOL

Cotton
Cotton PowerDork
5/4/18 11:24 a.m.

Made it back around 7:40.  Will catch up on some sleep, then at least get Fergus started,  so I can hear that 390.

ultraclyde
ultraclyde PowerDork
5/4/18 1:50 p.m.

Glad to hear you got home ok.

Here's some links with info on the 3+OD Ford transmissions. Opinions vary on their usefulness:

http://www.davidkeetoploaders.com/imposters.htm

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/ford-3-spd-od-toploader-manual-transmissions.9688/

 

The one I had is definitely the OD in the first link. I recognize the offset bolt pattern on the tail shaft for the shifter.

DirtyDiesel
DirtyDiesel New Reader
5/4/18 2:24 p.m.

I'm kicking myself for missing this one, can't wait to see more content about the wagon. I love these old wagons, where do you find them, just craigslist? Been using searchtempest.com for a while. 

Cotton
Cotton PowerDork
5/4/18 5:34 p.m.
Ian F said:

If spirited off-line performance is desired, then a GV overdrive may be the easiest and most flexible - if not the cheapest - option.

I have thought about that.  It would give me exactly what I want,  expensive,  but does seem like the easy button in this instance.

Cotton
Cotton PowerDork
5/4/18 6:11 p.m.

Seth,  I can’t remember how long you did Fergus had sat,  but I hit it with a few squirts of starter fluid and that 390 fired up on the 2nd try and settled into a nice, smooth idle.

 

seemed to drive well to,  but for a moment I forgot about having ZERO brakes and almost ran into one of my Blazer Chalets!laugh

Cotton
Cotton PowerDork
5/6/18 5:02 p.m.

Gas leak repaired.  It was the accelerator pump diaphragm.  3.99 at autozone and under ten minutes to replace.

I also installed a newer battery and ordered the front disk brake conversion kit.

Cotton
Cotton PowerDork
5/10/18 2:16 p.m.

Disk brake kit has been delivered.  I'll start on it this weekend if I can find the time.

Esoteric Nixon - Jordan
Esoteric Nixon - Jordan UltraDork
5/19/18 3:42 p.m.

I am glad to see Fergus live on; one of my favorite wagons!

mazdeuce - Seth
mazdeuce - Seth Mod Squad
5/19/18 6:05 p.m.

Thank you for doing the things that I never got around to. 

Cotton
Cotton PowerDork
5/20/18 4:08 p.m.

New letters before and after:

Dusterbd13
Dusterbd13 MegaDork
5/20/18 4:12 p.m.

I zoomed in on the picture.  We have a town and country ford near me. I thought it may have been from aroundhere.

Cotton
Cotton PowerDork
5/20/18 4:12 p.m.

Starting on the disk conversion.

And yes,  my shop is so full I have the pleasure of doing this outside.

 

mazdeuce - Seth
mazdeuce - Seth Mod Squad
5/21/18 7:00 a.m.
Cotton said:

 

 

And yes,  my shop is so full I have the pleasure of doing this outside.

 

Story of my life. 

BrokenYugo
BrokenYugo MegaDork
5/27/18 9:45 p.m.
Crackers said:
Ian F said:

In reply to Crackers :

The 3 spd and 4 spd have the same pattern, but with with one more gear. 

R-1-3

    2-(4)

The only difference is the whole thing is rotated 90° and on the column.  It's actually kinda fun. It would be very interesting to see if the levers on the two transmissions are the same.

But for better hwy cruising, a taller gear gear is probably more important.  Especially if there are no plans to use the car for towing. 

I may be getting myself confused, as I suddenly realized that I've never dealt with a Ford transmission with multiple linkage rods, and I'm not entirely sure sure how their 4 speeds operate. 

However, for something like a Muncie 4 speed, (of which I am familiar) in theory the column could operate 1-4. With one arm handling 1-2 instead of R-1 and the other operating 3-4 instead of 2-3. 

I've driven many column shift manuals. My wagon was column shift before I cut it all up. We even towed the race car with a Chevy C10 with a 3-tree for a whole season. Of course that was in CA with a 55mph speed limit on anything towing a trailer. 

Now I'm going to have to research Ford shifting patterns. LOL

Ian is off, 3 on the tree and floor are both R/1, 2/3, 2 rods, I've driven one (68 Falcon) before. Like you said you can put a 4 speed on the 3 on the tree linkage but the shifter won't have reverse because only the 1/2 and 3/4 rods will be hooked up, need a big push/pull cable or something to operate the reverse lever.

Cotton
Cotton PowerDork
6/1/18 4:31 p.m.

Everything was going okay until I tried to put the wheel back on.  Disk hub od is larger than the drum,  so the stock wheels don’t fit.  I pulled everything back apart and took the disks, one drum,  and a wheel to the machine shop,  so they can turn the hubs down and test fit everything.  Should have it all back next week and can try again.

And yes,  I gave the dust cap a good beating.  Those things always drive me to the point of unreasonable hammering.

Crackers
Crackers Dork
6/1/18 5:57 p.m.

It's interesting that the conversion kit comes with GM pads/calipers. 

Was this a universal kit or something? If it's not supposed to have GM stuff there may have been a packaging/shipping error causing the wheel fitment issues. (Yes, I realize this is very unlikely.)

Cotton
Cotton PowerDork
6/1/18 6:10 p.m.

In reply to Crackers :

The kit is supposed to be specific to 65-68 Galaxies.  I wasn’t sure if a Country Sedan fell under Galaxie or not,  but they said it would work.  Later I found an article saying there could be wheel fitment issues with certain factory wheels,  so now I know my wheels have that issue.  I’m thinking the GM calipers we’re used for cost and availability possibly.

mazdeuce - Seth
mazdeuce - Seth Mod Squad
6/1/18 6:46 p.m.

That's shiny. 

Remember that a LOT of stuff was put together finger tight so I could roll it outside and work on the van. Don't assume anything is tight. 

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