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johnnytorque
johnnytorque New Reader
4/11/11 7:23 p.m.

Look up Brad Penn oils, it is EXACTLY what our cars need. It's semi-synthetic, affordable and it looks cool. I run it and love it.

joepaluch
joepaluch Reader
4/12/11 8:28 a.m.

Valvoline VR1 is a good dino oil for 944 motors. I use it in my 944 Turbo for years.

In my 944 race car I use Amsoil 15w50 Dominator oil. Crazy expensive, but racing puts alot of heat in the oil and since the motor is rebuild does not have any oil leaks. So this good oil for racing motors with zero oil leaks.

Most old stock motor will have some places with minror leaks and synthetic oils will tend to make those places worse. So stock with the dino oil unless you reseal the entire motor.

As for balance. There is alot of room to adjust the car. You can get -2 to maybe -2.5 camber in front and -2.5 in the rear stock as is. Plus rake impacts balance. Rear low = understeer, rear high = oversteer. One trick I used on my 83 autocrosser was to remove the spare tire and play with fuel load to either add rear grip (more weight in the rear) or take it away.

jeffp
jeffp New Reader
4/12/11 5:52 p.m.

Sorry to see you leave SCCA events! I love your car, the RIGHT color for a 944! And very true about the friendly nature of the PCA events...nice folks.

We SCCA Miata racers should learn there's more to cars than cost, reliability and lap times..

Javelin
Javelin SuperDork
4/12/11 7:56 p.m.
jeffp wrote: Sorry to see you leave SCCA events! I love your car, the RIGHT color for a 944! And very true about the friendly nature of the PCA events...nice folks. We SCCA Miata racers should learn there's more to cars than cost, reliability and lap times..

Just temporarily Jeff. It would have been possible to stick with them if half of the races weren't out in Packwood.

And yes, I like the color. I'm glad you like it, too! Are you coming to PCA Sunday?

Javelin
Javelin SuperDork
4/21/11 8:23 p.m.

UPDATE: 4/21/2011:

The Porsche now sports a set of Hankook RS-3’s in 225/45/15. They are WAY shorter than the 225/60’s that were on the car, but they grip sooo much better! Definitely a great tire.

The 944 also got treated to an oil change. That filter location berkleying SUCKS!!! I had to hammer-and-screwdriver the old one out. No matter though, as the new K&N filter has a 1” nut welded on it, which will make the next change a snap. The oil is 20W50 Valvoline VR1 Racing Oil by the way, for it’s high zinc content to protect the 225,000 mile engine (rolled over on the way to the autocross!).

As a side note, with the new tires I learned that even my low-profile HF racing jack doesn’t like to fit under the car any more. Suggestions?

I can’t get enough of that rear 3/4 view! This car is really cleaning up nicely. The oil pressure is great, it starts up every time, and it drives very nicely. I hate to say it here, but this twice the car the Miata is. Quieter, roomier, more useful (hatchback), handles better on the road, and is MUCH faster.

We took the 944 to it’s second ever autocross on Sunday (4/17) and did awesome! I won P02 and Audra got 2nd, both of us beating out a M030 968. I also took 23rd overall out of 59 (and Audra got 48th) for my most-impressive overall placing yet. This car is wicked fast on the autocross course! My time would have been good enough for the Improved 1 win, which has some very talented drivers in well-sorted cars! In a stock 2.5 NA 944 with nothing but a throttle cam and 140TW tires…

So, remember that “Dino” wheel from the 2010 swap meet that I thought was from a Ferrari? I happened to score a Dino to 944 steering wheel adapter on CL for $20! Unfortunately, my wheel has 1 too many bolts, but I might be able to re-drill it…

johnnytorque
johnnytorque New Reader
4/21/11 10:35 p.m.

Sweet job on the AutoX, sounds like you are lovin' it. I have to agree, the 944 is an autoX weapon!

dean1484
dean1484 SuperDork
4/22/11 8:08 a.m.

I have a dino wheel for my car. The adaptor that was supplied with it is not properly setup for the plastic piece that trips the turn signals. I got sick of it and put the old wheel back on. I was going to re-drill the adaptor but just never got around to it. I still have it some where in the box's of stuff. A project for another day.

dean1484
dean1484 SuperDork
4/22/11 8:09 a.m.

An old photo with it on my car.

Javelin
Javelin SuperDork
4/22/11 11:32 a.m.
johnnytorque wrote: Sweet job on the AutoX, sounds like you are lovin' it. I have to agree, the 944 is an autoX weapon!

Thanks! I wasn't so sure until this dry AX, but this car is a solid 2 seconds quicker than the same cars that my Miata was even with last season. I think the big differences are the torque available to pull out of a corner and the LSD that keeps the power planted. What little power the Miata made was spun on the inside tire in tight turns or in the wet.

AngryCorvair
AngryCorvair SuperDork
4/24/11 8:14 p.m.

drive up onto a 2x4 before sliding the jack under the car.

Javelin
Javelin SuperDork
4/24/11 10:32 p.m.
AngryCorvair wrote: drive up onto a 2x4 before sliding the jack under the car.

Good idea, thanks! I'll go buy some now

aussiesmg
aussiesmg SuperDork
4/24/11 10:41 p.m.

Buy 2 x 10 its much easier to keep the car stable, then cut it at a 45 degree angle to create a ramp style start to get onto the wood, I have 4 of these

Javelin
Javelin SuperDork
4/25/11 9:43 a.m.

Updates 4/25/2011:

The new shorter tires coupled with the factory M456 Sport Suspension makes for a VERY low ride height! The nose now rubs on things and my low-profile jack won’t fit under the nose. I’ll be getting some 2x10’s for ramps.

I did wash and detail it out for the first time though, and she cleans up pretty nicely!

So the original exhaust system includes this built-in tip that I assume is stainless steel. After a little elbow grease and some polish it shined up pretty good!

The next step on the 944 is to address the suspension. This side of the car has all of the issues, as the right rear shock is blown and the right front ball join is bad. I have already purchased the Rennbay racing ball joint kit, but if I’m going to pay a shop to take the A-Arms off, I might as well get the shocks done too to save on labor. Koni’s are on sale through the end of May, and adjustables would bring my M456 spec up to M030 specs (minus bushings). Obviously I should think about front springs and strut mounts, too. Decisions, decisions…

Suggestions?

joepaluch
joepaluch Reader
4/25/11 12:02 p.m.

Few things. 1) Oil filter. Get the proper oil filter wrench. These fit over the top of the oil filter. They work great, just don't over tighten.

2) Jack.. yes uses ramps. Interestingly my 944 race car does not need need ramps at all. I am at 4" to the rocker on that car. However I also run 225/50 R15 tires. So slightly taller than the 225/45's you are using.

3) I suggest back dating to steel control arms. Any lowered car and suffer ball joint failures when you track the car on stock soft springs. What happens is the ball joint maxes out is angular travel and it deforms the soft aluminum arms. No level of rebuilding will fix an arm. Arms are expensive. So if you change to steel arms from 83-85 cars this problem goes away. No limit how low you can run (other than closing up the shock) and if you must you can replace the ball joint for $11. It is attached with 3 bolts. Steel arms without bushings run $25 each. I run these on my 84 race car.

I have no suggestions on spring rates as what I run on my race car works well, but may not work as good a street car. The only advice is that you must address the rear t-bars if you plan doing front springs. Otherwise the car will not longer be balanaced and despite less body roll may be slower on course.

pigeon
pigeon Dork
4/25/11 12:11 p.m.
joepaluch wrote: Steel arms without bushings run $25 each. I run these on my 84 race car.

Where? I have a ball joint going bad on my '86 951 and would rather change out the entire arms to steel (especially at that price!) than try to rebuild them.

pinchvalve
pinchvalve SuperDork
4/25/11 12:14 p.m.
Javelin wrote: After a little elbow grease and some polish it shined up pretty good!

Shined up pretty WELL.

(god my wife is really affecting me!)

joepaluch
joepaluch Reader
4/25/11 12:57 p.m.
pigeon wrote:
joepaluch wrote: Steel arms without bushings run $25 each. I run these on my 84 race car.

Where? I have a ball joint going bad on my '86 951 and would rather change out the entire arms to steel (especially at that price!) than try to rebuild them.

Sorry.. Latest price is $27 each.

Paragon has all the parts you need. The arms are cheap, but you will need all new bushings and the Control Arm - caster bushing clip for retrofitting. You might be able to get these used for alot less.

http://www.paragon-products.com/Porsche_944_Suspension_Control_Arms_s/450.htm

turboswede
turboswede SuperDork
4/25/11 1:08 p.m.

I'll take your take off shocks/struts :) Trade you for the 250lb Weltmeister springs I have on the shelf, plus some cash if you'd like.

Ground-control makes adjustable camber plates for the 944 series, supposedly quite good. The cheap eBay camber plates (Mookeh) apparently have issues with the spherical joint, but regular lubrication is the key to their survival, I have the cheap ones on my car, so I guess I'll see what happens.

CIP1.com has a pretty good deal on stiffer torsion bars. About $200 for 26-28mm solid Tbars. Search under the off-road section for HD rear suspension pieces. I have them on my 79 924 with 87 trailing arms, a buddy has them on his 80 924 Turbo with steel arms and they work well.

Control arms are easy to remove on these cars. Takes maybe a couple of hours start to finish. Don't even have to remove the struts, just apply some upward pressure on the uprights and remove the bolts/nuts, then gently pry the assembly down.

Steel control arms are the same as A1 Rabbit arms (aluminum arms have the same geometry), with the exception of the sway bar linkage mount, which is easily added with some steel and a welder. I have a pair in my garage (with sway bar mounts) that I'll give to anyone who wants them (Note: they aren't pretty, but will work once blasted and painted).

When replacing the balljoints, bore the mounting holes out to use 8mm grade 8 bolts as the provided 6mm bolts may not hold up under the loads generated by the stickier tires of today. Welding steel plate to the arms to box in the structures helps stiffen them quite a bit. Carefully drilling holes in the boxed arms will reduce the weight added.

A1 Rabbit ball joint spacers also work to help correct geometry, just make sure you get the proper spindle diameter.

Bumpsteer spacers are also a good idea to correct geometry issues with the strut front ends.

Prothane poly bushings for an A1 Rabbit are cheap and include the appropriate steel sleeves to make them work, versus some of the other vendor's versions on the market. Should work with the later aluminum arms as well, but I don't know for sure.

Adding/building a caster block brace and using poly bushings will help keep the suspension from moving in weird directions under load.

There is some debate on whether the 968 caster blocks are a worthwhile upgrade. I think going to a monoball solution, negates the discussion.

Delrin and poly rear bushings increases road noise in the cabin, but does help improve suspension response. For a dual-duty rig, plan on extra sound deadening material under the carpet.

Good luck!

docwyte
docwyte Reader
4/25/11 4:57 p.m.

The steel control arms have the same geometry as the late model 944 arms?

turboswede
turboswede SuperDork
4/25/11 6:06 p.m.

There is a later model 944 aluminum control arm that is slightly longer (I think after 87 or 89) which uses different uprights.

Otherwise, yes they are the same geometry and can be interchanged (with the appropriate hardware)

Javelin
Javelin SuperDork
4/25/11 9:14 p.m.
joepaluch wrote: Few things. 1) Oil filter. Get the proper oil filter wrench. These fit over the top of the oil filter. They work great, just don't over tighten. 2) Jack.. yes uses ramps. Interestingly my 944 race car does not need need ramps at all. I am at 4" to the rocker on that car. However I also run 225/50 R15 tires. So slightly taller than the 225/45's you are using. 3) I suggest back dating to steel control arms. Any lowered car and suffer ball joint failures when you track the car on stock soft springs. What happens is the ball joint maxes out is angular travel and it deforms the soft aluminum arms. No level of rebuilding will fix an arm. Arms are expensive. So if you change to steel arms from 83-85 cars this problem goes away. No limit how low you can run (other than closing up the shock) and if you must you can replace the ball joint for $11. It is attached with 3 bolts. Steel arms without bushings run $25 each. I run these on my 84 race car. I have no suggestions on spring rates as what I run on my race car works well, but may not work as good a street car. The only advice is that you must address the rear t-bars if you plan doing front springs. Otherwise the car will not longer be balanaced and despite less body roll may be slower on course.
  1. My car has power steering, making the standard over-the-top oil filter wrench useless (unless there's a super-thin-wall one out there). Moot point though, as the 1" nut on the K&N filter solves it.

  2. My car's suspension probably sags, it has the M456 setup, and the tires are very short, so it probably sits lower than it should. I can get the jack under the side rail, just. The nose is an absolute no-go though.

  3. Can't, not legal for the class I'm running. Not to mention by the time I source and buy a complete steel arm setup I could have just had my alloy ones rebuilt (I already have the kit), and they are heavier.

3A. My car is not lowered. Stock shocks, springs, and ride height (minus sag from age). The tires are shorter is all for now.

Javelin
Javelin SuperDork
4/25/11 9:16 p.m.
pinchvalve wrote:
Javelin wrote: After a little elbow grease and some polish it shined up pretty good!
Shined up pretty WELL. (god my wife is really affecting me!)

Sorry! I'm from the South, so my grammar stinks sometimes.

Javelin
Javelin SuperDork
4/25/11 9:17 p.m.

In reply to turboswede:

Thanks for all the advice! I probably will not change springs (I don't think it's legal in my class anyways). Camber plates are definitely on the list though!

Javelin
Javelin SuperDork
4/25/11 9:24 p.m.
turboswede wrote:
docwyte wrote: The steel control arms have the same geometry as the late model 944 arms?

There is a later model 944 aluminum control arm that is slightly longer (I think after 87 or 89) which uses different uprights.

Otherwise, yes they are the same geometry and can be interchanged (with the appropriate hardware)

Ack! No, no, no, no! (Turboswede is 99% right) The misinformation out there on 944 A-Arms nearly cost me a fortune! The 924 and 944.1 (83-85) use the steel Rabbit arms. The 944.2 (85.5-86, mine) uses an alloy arm with identical geometry. On an 85.5-86 you CAN back-date to the steel arm, no issues.

The 944.3 (87 and newer) though uses a nearly identical looking alloy arm that's 40MM longer and requires a different strut, housing, and brakes! They absolutely, positively, CANNOT back-date to the steel arm without swapping the whole she-bang. 1987 is the model year that changed. The A-Arm then stayed the same dimensions through the 968.

docwyte
docwyte Reader
4/26/11 8:59 a.m.

That's what I thought. That the late offset 944's could only use the alloy A arms they came with.

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