$2017 Challenge Rules and Date Announced

Hey O&F Got three headlights now,Lol I removed the area where the Lights would go, so if you cut the hood Behind the lights and sent that.... But I skinned the Inner Structure off of mine and whatever I have you can get for the asking,We should prob. take this discussion out of this thread,Johnbpero@live.com, or call 678 six 5 oh 1 2 niner niner

hey swapping an engine May be easier than building a car in the parking lot,Both automatics both Carbed.2 hrs. each way. sorry, been talking to Ovid forgot to finish this sentence.

In reply to patgizz:

Crap!!! I was going to post it on our Facebook event page today. Kidding

Okay, so where is everyone finding these great deals on autocross tires? The best I managed was a set of very well worn RS3's that were way to wide for my 7" wheels, but I counted myself lucky that a fellow competitor lugged them all the way to the challenge for me and they stuck a lot better than the all season Falkens I had before.

For me the old rule new rule debate was a moot point. I can't afford to buy a set of new race tires anyway.

With the other discussion that has been laced through this thread here and there about building challenge cars to SCCA classes, it got me thinking. A nice addition to the autocross portion of the event would be to introduce a control group like GRM always does on its tire tests. Invite a national level SM, SP, or maybe more appropriately an XP racer to come to the event and take a few runs on the course to give a good measuring stick for how these Challenge cars compare to high level autocross cars. This will show us if the top challenge cars are truly fast on course, or just faster than the other cars that showed up.

Last two years I've gotten my autocross tires off eBay. leegrx7 was the seller but he mentioned getting out of the used race tire biz and now I notice he doesn't have anything listed.

Leegrx7 is Lee Graser- a former Challenge competitor. He has made it known for years that he would make good takeoffs available to challengers for a good price. He's the same person I bought from. My deal was free- shipping only.

Lee is no longer selling tires, but there are other Challenge friendly sources.

Tom Suddard wrote: Just keep one of these in the passenger seat if you run C clips. (kidding!)

That's what disc brakes are for, sheesh.

I'm fine with pretty much all the rules, except for the chance that I'll have to run a sponsor's windshield banner. That would mean removing or covering up this awesome piece of 1990's history:

In reply to eastsidemav:

The rules don't say you have to wear the windshield banner in the normal location.

They've been run up the sides of the windshield, or applied to hood leading edges, bug screens, or spoilers in the past.

We even cut it up one year and rearranged the letters to spell something else (which the sponsor's rep thought was pretty cool, but I do not recommend doing).

I realize the staff could mandate the location, but that's not what the rules say.

In reply to eastsidemav:

Back then, we'd always say, "Some Fear" because if you had "No Fear", you weren't going fast enough.

this year my windshield banner was split in two. the general tire GT logo on the passenger side quarter panel and the big GENERAL TIRE down the driver's side. i have my race team name on the glass.

I was wondering about that, because I was thinking of getting my own windshield banner made for it.

To clarify something with recoup/budget:

If I buy a parts car for ~$600, keep the wheels, transmission, and some interior bits, then part it out/scrap/whatever the rest of it. Can I recoup anything at all from the parts car? What would it make the cost for the wheels and stuff I do keep?

In reply to RevRico:

If you recoup $600 then what you keep is free. If you recoup $100 then what you keep cost you $500.

In reply to Stampie:

assuming you haven't already hit the recoup limit

Wow, I was mostly kidding about the banner thing (it had been way too serious in here), but it would be nice to keep it as a "time capsule" piece, along with the big bow tie on the back window

In reply to Robbie:

Yes and I saved all the nuts and bolts I could off the Q45. I figure since it's zeroed out it can count as a parts car towards other builds.

In reply to Stampie:

Umm, it can be used as a parts car toward another car IF it's purchase is in the budget. You can't zero out the car in 1 budget, then use parts from it in another build.

But if you are actually talking about nuts and bolts, go for it.

Well, Stampie paid $50 for it and found about $50 in cash in it plus some crack rocks. So he can toss $50 in budget and $50 of recoup and use anything from the car for free.

Ive already recouped 10 cents in pennies from my donor's floor. Hoping i score big and find quarters when i pull the carpet

One pass through the "Hood" he can get sum green fo dem rocks too! Don't recon I'd report the extra Income.

SVreX wrote: Umm, it can be used as a parts car toward another car IF it's purchase is in the budget. You can't zero out the car in 1 budget, then use parts from it in another build.

Asking because I'm idly curious (I live in California, so there's basically zero chance of me ever building even one Challenge car, let alone two):

Let's say you buy a $500 parts car for year X and then sell the engine for $500 and the transmission for another $500. The engine zeroed out the cost of the car, the transmission money was just gravy with no impact on the Challenge budget, and you used some of the other parts from the car in the build.

OK, so let's say that in year X+1, you want to use what's left of that same parts car in another build, so you "sell" it to yourself at an estimated FMV. That FMV is presumably no higher than $500 (since that's what you paid for it in cash originally, and taking parts off of a car only makes it more cost more if you're Porsche). Presumably if you hadn't sold the transmission in year X, you could have left it in the car, then sold it after "selling it to yourself" for year X+1, and re-zeroed the car. But you didn't, you sold it in year X. Can you retroactively apply those credits from selling it in year X to zero it in year X+1?

Two things as an conscientious objector(real life prevents budgeting even a cheap race car):

A) I brought up the idea of a protest rule a few years ago when I attended and was almost strung up.

B) I am ok with the "current" tire rule because in racing tires are consumables, and are arguably the first upgrade you should make to any car. I'd rather see a UTQG or other restriction just to keep it from being an arms race in the future.

In reply to patgizz:

I actually found $44.42 in it and sold the wheels for $20. So the argument is did I pay $50 and recover $50 in recoup or did I pay $5.58 and recover $5.58 in recoup? Btw the dash will come apart this year so more chance to recover more cash and crack.

In reply to codrus:

I wouldn't sell it to myself at FMV. It's budget would be bought at $500 and recovered $500 with the engine to have a zeroed out starting point.

In reply to minivan_racer:

Yep- No claimer rule. I'll join folks to string you up again.

You won't understand until you go, but these are not $2000 cars. They are cars with $2000 in parts, and hundreds, even thousands of hours. If you would like to offer me $2000 plus pay me for a thousand or so hours of my time, I will happily sell you any of the 13 Challenge cars I've built.

Sorry. It I just doesn't work for this event.