4l60e: Rebuild vs. Junkyard Replacement

Thread from 2017:

This is for a challenge build. I've got an '01 Mazda B2300 w/ a blown motor and a complete 99 Silverado 4.8 donor, but the "Trans needs 3-4 clutches or a quickie friction kit overhaul, drives fine 1-2." I haven't pulled anything yet, but it does drive around the alley fine. I need to decide between pulling a JY unit and attempting a rebuild. They'd both run in the $90-100 range if I get the JY unit this weekend during the Memorial Day sale. JY trans would take less time overall (I think) but of course runs the risk of being a bad unit. Rebuild would take me longer, still have some risk of me screwing it up, but I'd have the potential to rebuild it a bit stronger. After the challenge I'm giving the B4800 to my dad as a retirement present. He'll use it to mostly to just cruise around, throw his golf clubs/bicycle in, and other small town truck stuff. He's not into fast cars, but does live 500 miles away, so reliability post challenge is an asset. I could always do a JY trans for the challenge, rebuild the current one, then swap it in after. Advice? I don't know auto transmissions very well (yet!). I could look for another bolt-on option at the JY too, but was hoping to use as much from the donor truck as possible for the swap for time/$$ budget reasons, so it really needs to be fairly "bolt-on".

You know, I always tell myself to keep posts like this short so it's easier for people to read and respond. Someday I'll get that right.. sigh

D. None of the above, manual trans swap!

Honestly though, between your two options I would absolutely rebuild it- you're rolling the dice with a junkyard one since you can't try it out to see if it works well.

Don't know where you are, but around SW Ohio, a 4L60 in a later model truck at a upull yard is pretty high on the list of what probably put the truck in the junkyard in the first place. If you go the junkyard route, I'd suggest looking for a donor with crash damage, as that way it's likely the transmission was working.

eastsidemav wrote: Don't know where you are, but around SW Ohio, a 4L60 in a later model truck at a upull yard is pretty high on the list of what probably put the truck in the junkyard in the first place. If you go the junkyard route, I'd suggest looking for a donor with crash damage, as that way it's likely the transmission was working.

I'm in DC and hit the LKQ yards around here/Baltimore. Yeah, that was my thinking as well. I can't go until Monday, which means the yards might be pretty picked through.

Is there another auto option I should target instead?

Chris, if you know of a manual trans w/ flywheel/clutch for under $200 I can swap in, i'm all ears!

In reply to bluej:

I can look next time I'm in a junkyard, the newer trucks with manuals are rare but do appear occasionally. It's almost certainly going to be cheaper to work with what you've got, though.

Even a crashed JY trans could have issues. Not to long ago we put a used (40k miles) in one of my kid's Altima, thought it was the deal of the century but it only lasted 3 weeks. My theory is they may have pulled and drained it letting it sit on a shelf. I know CVTs aren't very robust but the original had 230k on it, our hope was to get another year out of the JY unit. I'd vote for a rebuild as you have better control over the process.

I'd rebuild it but i wouldnt assume you're going to do it for $90 all in. Even just adding 10-11 qts of fluid would nearly double that and you'll probably find something halfway worn through once you open it up. I wouldn't be surprised if it goes into the several hundreds. I used to rebuild 4l60s when i worked in a trans shop in 06-07 and most of them are in worse shape now then they were then.

But yeah in general i would never do a used 4l60 because the chances of it having issues are really high. If you're willing to take a chance on it for $90 then sure, but don't forget to value your labor time. Taking it apart another time might cost you more in personal time than the extra money you'd spend on parts rebuilding yours.

For challenge purposes, the trans fluid cost doesn't factor, but otherwise all good points. Thank you.

Should I be looking for some other auto to swap in its place?

As a lifelong GM nut, in my opinion, all 4L60 and 4L60E trans' are a core unless proven otherwise to be good. I've just dealt with too many heartaches. The only way I will bolt one in is fresh.

Now, a Turbo 350 or 400, I'll gamble on a used one all day long. They have seldom bit me.

I'd be looking for a 200r4 in a caprice from the mid-80s if I wanted overdrive and was rolling the dice at a u-pull-it.

oldopelguy wrote: I'd be looking for a 200r4 in a caprice from the mid-80s if I wanted overdrive and was rolling the dice at a u-pull-it.

I am a 200R4 Fan, I beat mine with a 455 buick all day in the Mountains, A Good servo,Shift Kit, awesome.

Challenge car? The first TH350 or TH400 you find on Craigslist.

We had an S10 with a blown transmission donated to the school shop. It cost me $1000CDN for a FULL rebuild kit, new torque converter, and replacement separator plate. Kit came with the Corvette servo and other bits.

It was a LOT of work to rebuild (not ~hard~ work, just a ~lot~ of work), and I fabricated a few specialty tools to complete the job.

If you do go junkyard, see if there is any way to verify the mileage. 110,000 to 130,000 miles and the trans most likely E36 M3 the bed or is about to.

i rebuilt one and i made the special tools needed out of scraps. i bought the kit from bulkpart.com. the biggest thing i can say about home rebuilding one besides keep it clean is make sure to test your clutch packs with air on the bench and test the tolerances, and biggest thing is be careful with the seals because if you nick one it's going to blow out as soon as you put fluid pressure behind it.

the 4L60E isnt the ticking time bomb the internet portrays it as especially as it was revised.

in your situation, i may be inclined to take it to a trans shop and get it built, but for the challenge find a cheap long tail th350 from a 70's or 80's pickup and bolt that in for the event, because the 9" tailshaft th350 is the same length as the 700r4/4L60E so you won't need any driveshaft work. would just need to keep in mind the mount is 3.25" farther back on the newer trans so 2 sets of crossmember holes would have you swapped back to the overdrive in a day.

Would I need a different torque converter to work w/ the th350 or does the stock one from the 4.8/4l60e work?

I recognize that I may want to pick a different one anyway, but torque converter selection isn't something I've made the effort to learn yet.

Thanks for input, all!

A Th350 uses a different torque converter than your 4L60e does.

Converters do not interchange between 4L60E and TH350, but TH350 converters are cheap and a stock one would work ok.

TH400 also works, kinda overkill (and much more parasitic drag than a TH350) for a stock 4.8 though.

EDIT:Watch out for the TH250/TH250C (a cheapened and weakened TH350) and TH350C (a 350 with lockup converter). You definitely don't want the 250/250C and the 350C takes a special torque converter.

Make sure it's not 1 and 4 not engaging, not 3 and 4. 1 and 4 are controlled by the same shift servo. Bad actuation solenoid and it's in limp mode. It will default to just 3rd, but you can manually shift between 2 and 3. It's not that bad or difficult to rebuild one. Just have to make sure you keep it all clean, and like Pat mentioned. Test it with air pressure.

Spinout007 wrote: Make sure it's not 1 and 4 not engaging, not 3 and 4. 1 and 4 are controlled by the same shift servo. Bad actuation solenoid and it's in limp mode. It will default to just 3rd, but you can manually shift between 2 and 3. It's not that bad to difficult to rebuild one. Just have to make sure you keep it all clean, and like Pat mentioned. Test it with air pressure.

it definitely goes into 1(i sold him the truck). i did a burnout in my driveway to make sure it wasn't a locking rear diff

Big thing is the sun shell that breaks/cracks/strips splines leaving only a manual 1 and 2. Most people think they have burnt out clutches and it's never the case.

Well that was a bust. Bunch of 4l60e's of questionable life and not much else. Not entirely surprising on the last day of a 3 day holiday sale I guess.

What all is missing that I might need in addition to the $1-200 rebuild kits all over eBay/rockauto? Do they include the sun shell?

Skinny, what else did you do to get to $1k Canadian?

Sun shell isn't included in a kit.

At this point I would pull it apart to get to the 3/4 set and sun shell and see what's up. If sun shell is cracked you could get away with that and a few seals and reassemble. I may have one on the shelf, but would recommend the beast upgraded one.

bluej wrote: Skinny, what else did you do to get to $1k Canadian?

I bought THIS KIT, and sourced a new torque converter and separator plate locally (because I didn't think of it at the time).

Kit came with a new sun shell, corvette servo, a couple of accumulator pistons that typically wear more than you'd expect, a couple of sprags, all the bushings, pumps guts. It was a very complete kit, well labeled, with a curious instruction that you really need to follow.