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BoxheadTim
BoxheadTim SuperDork
1/24/11 4:23 p.m.

Looks like they're one of the few options for the 20R in the Celica (the other one would be a Doug Thorley 4-2-1 for > $500). They're 4-1 with all the downsides that brings but otherwise seem to be OK-ish.

Donebrokeit
Donebrokeit New Reader
1/24/11 4:26 p.m.

Put one on a neon years ago , easy and seemed to work well.Was still going strong when I sold the car a few years later. Paul B

bigbens6
bigbens6 New Reader
1/24/11 4:30 p.m.

Typically they perform well, sound like dookie, some fitment issues, and it is commonly aluminium steel so you will want to keep a can of high temp paint around for touch ups. On the mazda KLDE they made decent power but sounded like crap...

I have used their cat back, it worked well, sounded like crap, its cheap for a reason...

fast_eddie_72
fast_eddie_72 HalfDork
1/24/11 4:36 p.m.

I know the 22R guys seem to prefer OBX. I haven't bought one yet, but the pictues of the OBX I've seen on CelicaGTS.com look better than the Paceseter. Theres a pretty good thread about the OBX over there. Sorry, for second hand information.

The Thorley look really nice, but I'm with you. More than I plan to spend. You can get a header from LC Engineering too, but again, more than I want to spend.

BoxheadTim
BoxheadTim SuperDork
1/24/11 4:39 p.m.

Well, given that I'm just splashing on a set of rebuildable Mikuni sidedrafts with all the mounting hardware I'd really like to keep the cost of the header down somewhat.

Then again, I might pull the head and find that the engine needs enough work to allow me to save up for a Thorley header...

The 'cheap for a reason' was exactly the reason I figured I'll ask around here.

digdug18
digdug18 HalfDork
1/24/11 4:46 p.m.

They seem to make them for a variety of cars that no-one else in their right mind would make a aftermarket header for. What about bending one up yourself?

fast_eddie_72
fast_eddie_72 HalfDork
1/24/11 5:06 p.m.

They OBX isn't any more expensive than the Pacesetter.

LopRacer
LopRacer New Reader
1/24/11 5:11 p.m.

I believe we ran a pacesetter on our 77 Rabbit racecar for about a year before it was swapped over to a Turbo Diesel. It seemed to work well and it was half the price of comperable products.

irish44j
irish44j Dork
1/24/11 5:45 p.m.

I have pacesetters on my '70 GT6. They've been on the car since the 80s and still fine. On that car they're 6-1 headers so not great for midrange, but I can't afford some 6-3-1's

Curmudgeon
Curmudgeon SuperDork
1/24/11 5:46 p.m.

I've put both chromed and painted Pacesetters on Britmobiles with decent results. FWIW, the chrome ones seemed to be made of better steel than the painted ones. Then I put a set of painted ones on my '83 GTi and those were crap. They split at the seams more than once. As always, YMMV.

Raze
Raze Dork
1/24/11 7:11 p.m.

I got some on my 72 Fiat (came with them). They've been on for a long time, 4-1, I pulled them cleaned them up and hit them with header paint, can't talk about performance since I have no point of comparison but they're made well enough...

MrJoshua
MrJoshua SuperDork
1/24/11 7:22 p.m.

I know on rotaries the merge point had lots of pipe corners sticking into the flow path and the flanges were too thin for longevity. You could clean up the merge and make them survivable.

wbjones
wbjones Dork
1/24/11 7:59 p.m.

don't remember the issue... (got it somewhere in a box) but SCC did a test of headers (don't remember the car) and the pacesetters caused a pretty drastic drop in hp and torque.......

dlmater
dlmater New Reader
1/24/11 10:02 p.m.

For what it is worth...I have had three sets of Pacesetter headers over the years; for a 96 Tacoma, 97 Ford F150, and longtubes for a 99 LS1 Camaro. They were all painted and fit reasonably well. I never had any issues with them as long as I had the vehicles. There are better made headers out there, but I would buy from them again.

ddavidv
ddavidv SuperDork
1/25/11 5:58 a.m.

They were just about the only choice for Fiestas back in the day, and I bought two sets during my Fiesta-phase. They were sturdy, both were chrome with horrible finish, the welds were ugly but effective. Flow? Who knows? Better than a stock manifold but I don't think any engineering whatsoever went into them. I'm pretty certain they were build in Mexico.

foxtrapper
foxtrapper SuperDork
1/25/11 6:00 a.m.

Pacesetters have about the worse collectors on the market. They mash the pipes down, stuff them into the collectors, which have no taper.

So when it comes to flow, they are about the worse header design on the market.

That said, they often times flow better than the cast iron lumps many manufacturers call exhaust manifolds.

That having been said, Toyota makes darn good factory exhaust manifolds. Especially with the R-E engine (not the R).

MrJoshua
MrJoshua SuperDork
1/25/11 8:09 a.m.

My basic understanding is that pacesetter makes their own designs and build them cheaply here and OBX and SSAutochrome copy the designs of others and manufacture them cheaply in China. Basically the copies are of better designs than pacesetter so you are more likely to get better flow.

aeronca65t
aeronca65t Dork
1/25/11 8:09 a.m.

Very poor fit on my 1500 Spridget. I had to practically cut them apart and remake them. As stated above , the collector section is poor and welding was shoddy.

Ian F
Ian F SuperDork
1/25/11 8:16 a.m.
foxtrapper wrote: Pacesetters have about the worse collectors on the market. They mash the pipes down, stuff them into the collectors, which have no taper. So when it comes to flow, they are about the worse header design on the market.

Yup. The factory 4-2-1 design on Volvos and Euro Spitfires flows far better than a Pacesetter.

I'd consider a Pacesetter a 'last resort' if there were no other options - and a temporary one at that to be adpated to the existing exhaust.

As far as the OP is concerned, I'd either save up the $500 for the good header, or install the stock manifold until I could.

Blitzed306
Blitzed306 Reader
1/25/11 8:24 a.m.

I've had PS on my F-body with no issues and got them CHEAP. I can tell you the welds looks like E36 M3, I also put a pair on a new GTO and they fit really well. Again, welds where nasty but that car sounded like a angry demon that was going to eat your soul

BoxheadTim
BoxheadTim SuperDork
1/25/11 9:06 a.m.

Well, I've got the stock manifold on it but that doesn't flow too well. But given that I'm after a header for performance reasons, I guess I better save up for the Thorley header or try to find a used one.

ST_ZX2
ST_ZX2 Reader
1/25/11 9:16 a.m.

We have a Pacesetter on the ZX2 autocrosser because it was one of only two shorties made that retain the ability to run a cat in the stock location (per the rules). The other choice was JBA, which was 3x the price and did not look as 'tuned' as the PS with respect to the primaries. Either way, our goal was to shave weight more than make power with a shortie.

The PS fit fine. The welds were a little sloppy, and we sandblasted the painted finish off and applied our own hi-temp rattlecan paint. It did change the sound of the car...instead of sounding like a typical inline 4, it actually sounds a bit more like a Subaru. I do not mind that, just an observation. I would get a PS again if there was no (better) option at a similar price.

93EXCivic
93EXCivic SuperDork
1/25/11 9:35 a.m.

I think my Civic has a Pacesetter header. It is a bit louder then stock but with an otherwise stock exhaust it doesn't sound bad.

mndsm
mndsm SuperDork
1/25/11 9:41 a.m.

Anyone I've ever heard outside of this crowd said they'd cracked the welds on those within a few thousand miles.

wvumtnbkr
wvumtnbkr New Reader
1/25/11 3:03 p.m.

They suck! I had a Pacesetter catback for an FC. I didn't even put it on the car due to crappy manufacturing. The welds sucked and where the tubes met, you could barely blow through the pipes because they were blocked off (they didn't cut the pipes at an angle before welding them together)

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