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DILYSI Dave wrote:To me, that's one of the most annoying traits of an automatic.
Yea, but remember that you represent a small group of people who actually enjoy the third pedal and that odd stick in the middle of the console.
Others see that how well it creeps allows them to move in parking areas slowly, and without thinking (maybe). Creeping lets me line up my trailer a whole lot easier, when I'm backing up to it (and that rear view camera is really incredible in helping, too...).
So.
I am on the fence on creeping.. I know it helps a lot in city.. but otherwise, I would prefer it didn't
Alfadriver:
Am I wrong in assuming the DCTs are having a lot of reliability problems? I was planning to avoid them when I join the new car shopper's ranks in a couple years for that reason and the added weight.
Well that and I find all Auto modes incredibly annoying.
In reply to MrBenjamonkey:
I have not heard of reliability issues. Audi, VW, Ferrari, or us. Lets put it this way, we are selling somewhere around 20k Fociii a month, most with this box. it better not be a problem.
There are people who don't like how they feel, though. 
I think a lot of the complaints are because they act differntly than the normal automatic. Not quite as smooth. Also,at least in the Ford, they have an addaptive learning program. I learns how you drive an addapts its shifting to that. Drive the ++++ out of it and it will respond. Seriously, I have no shifting problems with my Fiesta.
alfadriver wrote:93EXCivic wrote:In reply to alfadriver:
The thing is I have never talked to anyone who has driven a manual who doesn't think it is more fun.
And how many of them are car people? Real car people- not the pretend ones. and how many of them buy new cars?
The industry has been selling less than 10% manuals for close to a decade now, here in the states. Is it that hard to think that MOST, and I mean most by a 9:1 ratio, don't want manuals? Of those 9, what tiny percentage really care about having fun driving? Heck, of the one, how many of those REALLY have fun driving, or are they convinced that it's better for different reasons.
Here's something to consider- on a normal day- for my 35 mile commute, I shift less than 40 times. When I drive our Edge, I surely don't miss shifting.
I can't tell you how many times I've read here and miata.net how great manuals are for one reason or another. And that their evidence of mass appeal is talking to friends. But numbers don't lie. They just don't sell.
Not many of them are what I would call car people. And at least a couple are looking at new cars.
In reply to 93EXCivic:
When people start actually buying more than 10% of the cars with manuals, well...
Not that I can't be put into the same general grouping- I complain about my cable company for whatever, but it's not as if I am going to get rid of them. People like to say they have fun and want manuals, but when push comes to shove, they by autos.
93EXCivic wrote:alfadriver wrote:93EXCivic wrote:In reply to alfadriver:
The thing is I have never talked to anyone who has driven a manual who doesn't think it is more fun.
And how many of them are car people? Real car people- not the pretend ones. and how many of them buy new cars?
The industry has been selling less than 10% manuals for close to a decade now, here in the states. Is it that hard to think that MOST, and I mean most by a 9:1 ratio, don't want manuals? Of those 9, what tiny percentage really care about having fun driving? Heck, of the one, how many of those REALLY have fun driving, or are they convinced that it's better for different reasons.
Here's something to consider- on a normal day- for my 35 mile commute, I shift less than 40 times. When I drive our Edge, I surely don't miss shifting.
I can't tell you how many times I've read here and miata.net how great manuals are for one reason or another. And that their evidence of mass appeal is talking to friends. But numbers don't lie. They just don't sell.
Not many of them are what I would call car people. And at least a couple are looking at new cars.
I'm starting to think Alphadriver isn't a car person either.
In reply to bravenrace:
Whe you put it like that... can't reall argue it. Can't really drive a letter.
but you can take a Letter.
I for one have never owned anything but Manual shifted cars. The number of cars I have driven that were automatics are low.
Even the trucks I used to drive were manual.. and I would drive them in Boston, NYC, Philly, Baltimore, and DC. I never once wished they had been automatics
alfadriver wrote:In reply to MrBenjamonkey:
I have not heard of reliability issues. Audi, VW, Ferrari, or us. Lets put it this way, we are selling somewhere around 20k Fociii a month, most with this box. it better not be a problem.
There are people who don't like how they feel, though.
The rumors I heard were mostly about VAG cars, especially the GTI. Those and the Evo Xs.
Ferrari has a rebuild schedule of like 40,000 miles, right? Or was that with the old robotized manuals?
dp
mad_machine wrote:I personally agree, but the market doesn't lie. I can't stand autos because I want absolute control and it genuinely pisses me off when I can't use a downshift to get the right amount of engine braking to set up a decreasing radius corner, or when the damn tranny shifts up in the middle of a part throttle sweeper. That and I'm a weight Nazi.but you can take a Letter.
I for one have never owned anything but Manual shifted cars. The number of cars I have driven that were automatics are low.
Even the trucks I used to drive were manual.. and I would drive them in Boston, NYC, Philly, Baltimore, and DC. I never once wished they had been automatics
How many of the people at your local Homely Despot, for example, are likely to give a damn about any of those things?
Honestly I think we should be grateful DCTs are replacing torque converter autos and even more thankful that real manual transmissions (particularly sequentials) are better for racing, which means they are unlikely to go extinct for sporting models at least.
Most of the DCT's have shifting programs to alieviate that problem. At least mine does. Even without paddles. And even in drive they have engine brakeing.
