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April 26, 2009 12:59 a.m. TAftonomos New Reader

So I find a "clean" 328is today. Set up an appointment with the guy, which is like pulling teeth. I figure if you want to sell a car, you want to sell it.

I get there. 96 328is, 120K miles, asking 5K.

windshield is cracked seats are torn/cracked headliner is missing no maintenance records paint is shiny....because of all the swirl marks tires shot suspension needs replacing

Car was described as solid and "clean".

While I'm ranting...how hard is it to put manual or auto in the FS AD? How about the sellers that respond to an inquiry email asking for more info "What do you want to know?"...without any phone number/contact info

Maybe it's just the BMW crowd I'm running into, but either the car is 2000 above retail NADA, or they want NADA retail in a tanked market for a car that would need 4K to get it to "clean" condition. Only car I've found that is decent has been snagged by a dealer. Asking a premium over retail...and has no maintenance records....but swears it's 100%.

Miata people have been so much easier to deal with. And the maintenance records really arn't that big of a deal. Besides, you don't expect perfect paint or a flawless interior on a 2k car...

Rant over....
April 26, 2009 5:03 a.m. TR3only Reader

This seems to be "par for the course". Folks nowadays who are selling ANYTHING never look at the description they post from the buyer's point of view. After the year of a car (or truck), the FIRST thing I want to know is the engine and then the transmission. If it's something like a vintage Volkswagen beetle, I don't need you to tell me it has 2 doors and a 4 cylinder engine. If you don't have a picture, tell me the color of the exterior/interior. PLEASE include info about the physical and mechanical condition. Does it look like a collander because you left it on the beach at high tide, or was it only used to drive Grandma to church and the market? And finally, if you don't want pesky E-Mails, don't include your address, and if you can't be bothered to answer questions.....don't post an ad.

BTW, I hate guying a car/truck from most folks too. And yeah, this guy is asking AT LEAST 2K more than your description says it should sell for.
April 26, 2009 9:59 a.m. Rumnhammer New Reader

I ran into something similar to this years ago when I was planning my B6T festiva project. I wanted to find a festiva in decent condition for the project. One of the cars I drove up to Philly from Baltimore to see was offered for $600. I called the guy to ask questions about the condition. The guy was a Russian that only spoke ok english, but I don't think too much was lost in translation. I asked the normal various questions, body condition, whether or not all the glass was in good shape, how well it ran, was not too important, because I only needed to drive it home and then it was getting an engine swap. So he assures me that all is well and the car is clean, all the glass is intact etc. I have a friend drive me up to Philly, so if the car is good I'll buy it and drive it home. We meet up with the guy and to put it mildly his definition of clean left a lot to the imagination. Firstly the car looked like it had a family of pigs living in it. the interior was not only trashed condition wise, but I think the guy had been hauling around manure in the back. None of the items on the dash ie heater/vent controls worked, a cheap stolen looking radio was hanging out of the dash, resting on the floor next to the dash. The front seats were shot as if the 800lb pigs that had been living in the car had also been sitting in the front seats. The door panels were shot and torn, one of the outside door locks had been punched out as if someone had tried to steal the car (the guy told me that happened when the radio that used to be in the car was stolen). The windshield was cracked, this really pissed me off since I specifically asked the guy about this before I came up. The outside of the car was only moderately beat up, then I drove the car it drove ok, so I pull over and pop the hood, the engine compartment was so caked with oil and dirt that you would have had to scrape about an inch of glop off the top of the engine to get to the bolts holding the cam cover on, this is no exageration. Soooo I close the hood and turn to the guy and say Is this the car car that you are selling? He is like yes you like? I laugh and try to suppress my frustration. I say you want $600 for this car? Man I wouldn't give you $60 for this thing. We walk away, my friend takes me to a strip club to try and cheer me up on the way home.

I'm just glad I didn't travel any farther then this to even look at this thing. After that I made sure any car I call about has pics. Lots and lots of pics, no pic and I don't even bother calling to ask questions.

Chris Rummel
April 26, 2009 10:07 a.m. mad_machine SuperDork

I read Bimmer Magazine and every month they have a buyers report on different models.. one of the things the write rants about every month is the "serious inquires only" tag that a lot of CL sellers like to include in their ads.

He will not even use those ads in showcasing the cars..

And yes, I do not know about VW or Porsche, but BMW owners seem VERY stuck up about the value of their cars. I paid NADA for my 318ti.. before finding it had been hit hard and the entire passengerside had been repaired, that is needed all new bushings, and the cat was crapped out.

once I got it up to snuff (2grand later) it was a great car
April 26, 2009 10:15 a.m. 4cylndrfury HalfDork

I think the BMW vs Miata seller thing boils down to this..

and allow me to preface this by saying that this is a generality and not meant to be aimed at the people on this site:

BMW owners = the upper crust of the cattle who buy cars simply as status symbols/mobility devices

Miata owners = people who are willing to buy a car for fun over practicality

Cattle think theyre always right and that theyre entitled to ask a lot for their "valuable imported luxury vehicle". Whereas Miata owners understand that the car isnt just an object to have for its utility/bling factor, and are more "realistic" with their expectations.

Like I said, this is a generality and there are probably tons of people who buy beemers new cuz theyre fun driving machines and aren't all douchey, and there are probably tons of miata owners who smell like a summers eve and think they own a Ferrari cuz the paint looks nice.

just my .02
April 26, 2009 12:22 p.m. Travis_K HalfDork

I tried to buy an E30 a couple of years ago, but i had no luck for similar reasons. Any of the "price reduced (to only $2k more than the car is worth) for quick sale", "serious inquiries only", "no lowballers", and other stuff like that should result in clicking the back button before you waste any more of your time. Same with any adds that dont mention the transmission type, they are almost always automatics.
April 26, 2009 1:03 p.m. TAftonomos New Reader

I've expanded my search quite a bit, even to e30's, but it seems anyone with a roundel badge thinks there car is worth bank.

Case/point:

http://atlanta.craigslist.org/cto/1140125469.html

"great car" except for the cracked glass, oil leaks, worn down drivers chair, odo with 190k on it thats probably been broken for the last 5 years. $4500 LOL!
April 26, 2009 1:15 p.m. Travis_K HalfDork

I think with bmws you either have to buy a project that is no longer useable as a daily driver without alot of work and fix it up to how you want it, or spend enough to get one from someone who took care of it. The ones in between are better left for the people that just want to look cool by driving a bmw.
April 26, 2009 3:02 p.m. docwyte New Reader

If you want a truly clean BMW with all records that's been taken care, expect to pay a premium for it. These are the cars owned by enthusiasts and are in like new condition.

Otherwise you take your chances on one that has probably been spanked hard and put away wet by multiple owners.
April 26, 2009 4:31 p.m. TAftonomos New Reader

Agreed. Problem is all the one's I've run into are expecting a "premium" to be paid, yet have no records to back up what they are asking. just that "it's clean" :D

No worries, I just found myself a project car that is pretty darn cheap, and ought to be a LOT of fun. Here is hoping I can figure out how to get it from TX to GA now...
April 26, 2009 4:37 p.m. Feedyurhed Reader

Ditto that with the Mercedes crowd. They are either cheap and complete basket cases or expensive and well worn. As previously mentioned, you are better off paying more for a well documented, well taken care of car. The middle range they seem to want a premium for the name but no effort has been put into the up keep. And don't get me started on the true collectables. Those you will be paying top dollar for just a frame and a VIN.
April 26, 2009 4:50 p.m. jimbob_racing HalfDork

I ran into the same problems when I was looking for a fun daily driver. You either had to pay the drift tax or the country club tax depending on the make and model. I kept at it and as much as I doubted it would work for me I went with this boards favorite car, a Miata. Very clean, enthusiast owned and modified, some records to prove the quality. The price was right and it's nearly perfect for me. A little more cargo capacity would be good at times but when the top goes down I forget about the absurd trunk.

Good luck in the BMW search. I figure it stands for Breaks My Wallet and maybe someday I'll be in a position to buy one but in the meantime I'm happy with my Mazda.
April 26, 2009 6:04 p.m. docwyte New Reader

Well, with BMW's there's a number you pay. Either you pay it up front and get a nice, dependable car that needs little to no work, or you get a cheap one that you end up pouring money into and turns out you pay the same amount.

For instance, for a nice well maintained E30 M3, that number is $15-17k. If you find one cheaper than that, by the time you're done making it nice and dependable, you'll spend $15-17k...
April 26, 2009 7:28 p.m. neon4891 SuperDork

So $7k for a '90 e30 'Vert at a stealership is par for the course. But at 30/30 it looks cleanrolls eyes
April 26, 2009 11:24 p.m. docwyte New Reader

The E30 verts seem to be going cheaply, at least in my limited research on them. Everyone wants the E30 M3 or 325is...
April 27, 2009 8:08 a.m. Xceler8x Dork

docwyte wrote:

Well, with BMW's there's a number you pay. Either you pay it up front and get a nice, dependable car that needs little to no work, or you get a cheap one that you end up pouring money into and turns out you pay the same amount.

I bought a BMW 2002 years ago and learned this lesson. Great looking car on the outside but the trans and the rust work was too much. I sold it at a substantial loss. (sigh)