Challenge Supreme Court (Questions Answered Here!)

In reply to Tom Suddard:

I think next I'll have someone ask for me. I have a feeling anytime I ask it gets extra thought to loopholyness.

Around here A Good manual trans is worth Twice what the Same in an auto is worth, but can't get a trade at two for one. I could use a T-10 or Muncie a Saginaw or a Toploader they are all right here. PowerGlide was a Hundred Bucks and I drove Before Buying so an SFI Flex plate was all I needed but the Manual would require everything if it goes faster than 12's I think. I've quit looking for Loop holes and am concentrating on Money, Fiero this year!

In reply to Stampie:

That may work for other stuff, but I already thought about the loopholes when I was writing that rule the first time around.

Tom Suddard wrote: In reply to Ovid_and_Flem: If you transfer everything over to the new spreadsheet, that's awesome, and you're the best. But you can use last year's total as the starting point this year if you need to. In the future, we will require that everything be carried over from year to year.

Not to beat a dead horse, but does this go for all of the 2016 competitors? If I can do this too then it simplifies things a lot and I can focus on tweaking and tuning what I've already got.
If I have to start the build budget sheet fresh then that will cause quite a bit more of a headache since I will have to get very creative figuring out what parts to remove or change to get back down to budget. (the 2016 to 2017 rule changes cause me to be over budget even if I don't do anything to the car)

I got a 1985 BMW 318ti automatic for free. A co-worker was offering it (verbally) to anybody, but didn't have it listed anywhere. His asking price was "haul it away, and if you race it, I want a picture". Do I need to apply FMV to a free 318ti that runs badly? Do I have to fix anything or can I bleed the brakes and run it the way it is claiming $0 total budget? Can I sell parts off it?

In reply to Cactus:

I'd say that ones free.

You can run it as is and claim $0 budget.

You can't recoup money from a purchase that didn't cost you anything.

SVreX is correct on all counts there.

In reply to bigben:

Yes, you can simplify there and use last year's sheet as the starting point for this year.

If you're over budget, though, that's a different conversation. What makes you over budget?

Tom Suddard wrote: In reply to bigben: Yes, you can simplify there and use last year's sheet as the starting point for this year. If you're over budget, though, that's a different conversation. What makes you over budget?

It has to do with the change to the recoup rule from 2016 to 2017. The 2016 rule was a simplified one...You may recoup up to half of the total budget ($1008) by selling parts originally included with the challenge car, parts car(s), or parts packages, and you may not buy and sell unrelated parts and put that back into your budget. (Many competitors noted that the 2016 rule set actually made it possible to have a negative budget!) Abiding by the 2016 rule I recouped a total of $915 and stayed below budget; however, the 2017 recoup rule includes an additional clause that you can not recoup more than you paid for any particular item. This itemization is what will cause me to be over budget for 2017 if I convert my 2016 budget directly over to 2017.

If I take the lump sum challenge car + parts car + engine swap parts package = $1,190 cost. The total recoup from all of it lumped together is $915,but if I break each item out individually and cap the recoup at the purchase price of each individual item, then by the 2017 rule I am only allowed to count $580 of the $915 recoup. Again this is with the car exactly how it competed in 2016 with no additions or subtractions to the 2016 budget sheet. That's the conundrum: Is this a part of the rule set that can be grandfathered in or not.

In reply to bigben:

I believe the 2016 rule was a mistake- it never should have been written that way.

However, it was, and you were not the only one who benefitted.

My vote (as a fellow competitor, not official) is yes, you should be allowed to run based on the 2016 math. I think this should be be offered ONLY to cars that appeared in 2016 (with the same owner making a reappearance in the same car). That's the perk you get for being there.

I'm writing this for Tom's benefit. It's just my opinion. It's HIS decision.

But I do think that is the only fair way you get out of the mistake that was made.

Side note: I will be hurt by this. I bought a car and the parts for a 2017 Challenge car under the 2016 math immediately after the 2016 Challenge. I will not be able to run under the 2017 math.

+1 with SVRex's interpretation for 2016 competitors caught in this conundrum. Not that my vote counts. FWIW new rule/old rule does not affect my piece of E36 M3.

In a For Instance Question, I buy the Fiero And that is My Base Cost, We know it Needs head Gasket's (I'll replace both) A good tune and figure out what's up with The ECM or the Mega Squirt that was included,

Is that the Point I start Adding in additional Cost's(+ the Gasket's and tune up parts) I get 4 tires free,but anything Past that is where I need to Itemize, .

My getting an almost running car and not changing anything is an Advantage to me? It dosn't Matter what was Spent before me only what I have Spent?

In reply to GTXVette:

What you have spent, but you've got to include the purchase price.

GTXVette wrote: My getting an almost running car and not changing anything is an Advantage to me? It dosn't Matter what was Spent before me only what I have Spent?

Advantage you. Line 1 is purchase price. Doesn't matter what someone else put into it, it matters what you paid.

Thank ya, Thank ya Very Much.

bigben–you're grandfathered in, as are other $2016 cars that are over budget for the same reason.

GTX, yep, the only math that matters is what you have in the car. Not what the last guy dumped into it.

In reply to Tom Suddard:

Woohoo! Thanks.

Partial TRADES/BUDGET CAPS

I paid $500 for my car. I have recouped $500 max selling parts. Suppose Tranny went out. Replacement transmission is 600$ if purchased outright. But I can get $200 trade in/core charge if I give my transmission in trade.

I know trades are a "wash". Even if I have already reached my recoup cap?

In above example what would I show on budget spreadsheet? $400 or $600?

$200 is the core charge. You are turning in your core which has already been devalued to $0 by the recoup. So it shouldn't matter what the shop values the core at. You've only paid $400 out of your budget. You already paid for that core when you bought the car. It shouldn't hit you're budget twice. That's my logic anyway.

Yep. $400 out of your budget.

safety recall?

So this is probably a dumb question, but I just got a safety recall for my car for the lighting control module.

In the interest of transparency, I assume this shows up on the budget as a free repair?

Yes, that's correct.

What's the deal with making a truck out of a car for 2017 truck class? Asking for a friend.

Go for it.