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David S. Wallens
David S. Wallens Editorial Director
5/22/19 2:08 p.m.

Are Type R Civics still selling above MSRP? Today I saw this:

bcp2011
bcp2011 Reader
5/22/19 2:14 p.m.

No wonder I don’t see them on the street!!

Duke
Duke MegaDork
5/22/19 2:18 p.m.

I wonder how much of that $2,495 accessory cost was for the nitrogen fill?

Considering plain old pleb air is about 78% nitrogen, that extra 22% better make a big difference for all that extra money.  Or maybe they throw in the green valve caps.

--

On another note, I am all for dealers making a profit, but this is the pure unadulterated bullcrap that makes everybody scream hate-filled obscenities about them.

 

Sonic
Sonic UltraDork
5/22/19 2:49 p.m.

And why specialty cars don’t sell as well as the manufacturers think they should.  Same with the focus RS, etc. 

ShinnyGroove
ShinnyGroove New Reader
5/22/19 2:59 p.m.

"You're interested in the Type R?  Well just come back here to this small room and bend over so I can give you your 'market adjustment'".  Geez, that's unbelievable.

 

On a different note... my last track day, a Type R was running in the Advanced group and was clearly the fastest car there.  Faster than the Vettes, Porsches, GT's, etc.  It had aero and minor suspension mods, but was running the stock drivetrain.  I was pretty amazed.

David S. Wallens
David S. Wallens Editorial Director
5/22/19 3:01 p.m.
ShinnyGroove said:

On a different note... my last track day, a Type R was running in the Advanced group and was clearly the fastest car there.  Faster than the Vettes, Porsches, GT's, etc.  It had aero and minor suspension mods, but was running the stock drivetrain.  I was pretty amazed.

The other thing about the Type R: It's also quite comfortable on the street. 

nderwater
nderwater UltimaDork
5/22/19 3:04 p.m.

Yo dog, that 15K could buy an extra Civic with your Civic.

spacecadet
spacecadet HalfDork
5/22/19 3:09 p.m.

Yes, I've called out old dealer buddies on it and they keep getting $3k over in Houston so they keep asking for it. 

There are select dealerships selling for MSRP. Howdy Honda in Austin, TX has always sold for MSRP. 

I expect this market will begin to die in a bit.. There are tons of them in the used market... there are only so many buyers for a $35k+ honda civic with shouty bodywork.. 

Duke
Duke MegaDork
5/22/19 3:49 p.m.

In reply to spacecadet :

The kind of sales manager that would put a bare-faced $15,000 / 40% markup on that car and then add an "accessory package" at 10x actual cost is also the kind of sales manager who will still be refusing to negotiate on this thing when it is a leftover 2 years from now.

z31maniac
z31maniac MegaDork
5/22/19 3:51 p.m.
Sonic said:

And why specialty cars don’t sell as well as the manufacturers think they should.  Same with the focus RS, etc. 

This is exactly what I was thinking. Dealer's gouge the people looking to buy one, they don't buy, sales don't meet expectations, car gets canceled. I was so ready to put down money on an RS at the end of 2017, but the markups + no test drives, killed all desire for me. 

docwyte
docwyte UltraDork
5/22/19 4:21 p.m.

The no test drives thing kills it for me.  I went in 2008 to buy a car, mine had been totaled.  I was a cash in hand buyer.  I wanted to check out the STi and Evo X, both of which were new.  I went to the Mitsu dealer and handed my card to the sales guy.  Checked out an Evo and asked to drive it.  His response?  "Sign the sales contract and if you don't like the car, we'll tear it up."  Nope!!

Crazy that the porsche dealer had no issue tossing me the keys to a car that cost 2.5X as much without blinking an eye but I couldn't test drive an Evo or an STi.  Not gonna buy something without driving it first...

spacecadet
spacecadet HalfDork
5/22/19 5:10 p.m.
Duke said:

In reply to spacecadet :

The kind of sales manager that would put a bare-faced $15,000 / 40% markup on that car and then add an "accessory package" at 10x actual cost is also the kind of sales manager who will still be refusing to negotiate on this thing when it is a leftover 2 years from now.

Some dealers will be like that.

I was surprised to find that they were still regularly getting $3k over sticker when I spoke to some friends last year. 

 

poopshovel again
poopshovel again MegaDork
5/22/19 6:00 p.m.

Was that at Hennessey Honda of Woodstock? Does it include a whole trailer load of dicks?

There are still a couple dealerships hanging on to TWENTY SEVENTEEN FoRS for $43k. Seems like a crazy strategy if they’re paying $300/month to have it collect dust, but never underestimate the power of the sunk cost fallacy.

mr2s2000elise
mr2s2000elise HalfDork
5/22/19 6:03 p.m.

Locally they sell for $1500-$2000 over msrp

 

Some dealers force financing or force accessories to get the markup

 

most of our local owners group buy for msrp at a wisconsin dealer and ship it here for $800

 

9 sales locally so far for that WI dealer 

BoxheadTim
BoxheadTim MegaDork
5/22/19 7:09 p.m.

I was trying to check one before pulling the trigger on the Alfa and the impression I got was that at least around here, pretty much anybody who had one in stock wanted more than MSRP for it.

I think it's a potentially great car around MSRP, but not after all those "market value adjustments". No thanks.

irish44j
irish44j MegaDork
5/22/19 7:18 p.m.
docwyte said:

The no test drives thing kills it for me.  I went in 2008 to buy a car, mine had been totaled.  I was a cash in hand buyer.  I wanted to check out the STi and Evo X, both of which were new.  I went to the Mitsu dealer and handed my card to the sales guy.  Checked out an Evo and asked to drive it.  His response?  "Sign the sales contract and if you don't like the car, we'll tear it up."  Nope!!

Crazy that the porsche dealer had no issue tossing me the keys to a car that cost 2.5X as much without blinking an eye but I couldn't test drive an Evo or an STi.  Not gonna buy something without driving it first...

always go in and ask to drive something mundane and lame (like a regular Impreza). Then be like "hmm, maybe I could stretch for an STi" and they'll practically throw the keys at you trying to upsell. 

wearymicrobe
wearymicrobe UberDork
5/22/19 7:32 p.m.

Funny thing is that its no longer the desired model for showing up to your local cars and coffee event. It has not been for about 10 months or so. Lots of the them locally getting wrapped up in something stupid to stand out now.

Terrible thing too. It's a really good car.

bmw88rider
bmw88rider SuperDork
5/22/19 7:57 p.m.

In reply to irish44j :

Funny thing is in 08 I tried that both with the Subaru and the Mazdaspeed in Austin and the dealer said nope. Driving one a few years later, I would have totally upgraded but I'd never buy anything with no test drive.

Knurled.
Knurled. MegaDork
5/22/19 8:43 p.m.
ShinnyGroove said:

"You're interested in the Type R?  Well just come back here to this small room and bend over so I can give you your 'market adjustment'".  Geez, that's unbelievable.

 

On a different note... my last track day, a Type R was running in the Advanced group and was clearly the fastest car there.  Faster than the Vettes, Porsches, GT's, etc.  It had aero and minor suspension mods, but was running the stock drivetrain.  I was pretty amazed.

My shop services a Type R.

 

After seeing how thoroughly cram-packed it is under the hood, I am as amazed as you.  Honda had to put in heat shields for things you don't normally associate with needing heat shields.  The whole thing looks like a thermal event waiting to happen.

Knurled.
Knurled. MegaDork
5/22/19 8:45 p.m.
poopshovel again said:

Was that at Hennessey Honda of Woodstock? Does it include a whole trailer load of dicks?

There are still a couple dealerships hanging on to TWENTY SEVENTEEN FoRS for $43k. Seems like a crazy strategy if they’re paying $300/month to have it collect dust, but never underestimate the power of the sunk cost fallacy.

I haven't looked for a while but I am pretty sure I can buy a used 2017 FoRS with four-digit mileage for under $30k.  They seem to be depreciating like gas station donuts.  I assume the head gasket thing has scared people off, or the tunerboyz are dropping them because you can't double the power on stock internals like an Evo.

Knurled.
Knurled. MegaDork
5/22/19 8:50 p.m.
irish44j said:

always go in and ask to drive something mundane and lame (like a regular Impreza). Then be like "hmm, maybe I could stretch for an STi" and they'll practically throw the keys at you trying to upsell. 

irish44j
irish44j MegaDork
5/22/19 9:02 p.m.
bmw88rider said:

In reply to irish44j :

Funny thing is in 08 I tried that both with the Subaru and the Mazdaspeed in Austin and the dealer said nope. Driving one a few years later, I would have totally upgraded but I'd never buy anything with no test drive.

Interesting. When I got my WRX, it was literally the first 09 on the lot (was coming off the truck when I got there to look at a used Legacy). I was like "hey, can I try that WRX out?" and they had no problem with it. And then I bought it :)

GCrites80s
GCrites80s Reader
5/22/19 9:38 p.m.

That trunk tray is normally $250.

Feedyurhed
Feedyurhed UltraDork
5/22/19 10:07 p.m.

Absolutely disgusting.  I have seen this type of thing before on other low volume models. Maybe one day we will be able to go on line and order a vehicle directly from the manufacturer and completely skip this idiocy.  

Appleseed
Appleseed MegaDork
5/22/19 11:11 p.m.

Tell me again why I would want one of these things?

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