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  Oct. 16, 2009 2:55 p.m. SVreX PowerDork

  Was the Zamboni a Locost? Special Class?

  Didn't it win first place in the autocross?

  How does that fit with rule #14?

  14-A Special class for Locosts/Race Cars/Kit Cars/Specials will be run for exhibition only. It will be scored independently from the rest of the competitors. The Special class competitors will only be eligible for the Special class trophies, unless one of them explodes spectacularly. Then we might reconsider. Special class cars must also meet the classification requirements for a recognized autocross class (for example: SCCA’s A Modified). These cars must meet all Challenge budget rules and safety regulations with the following exceptions: a) The cars do not have to be roadworthy. headlights, windshields and horns are not required b) non-DOT approved racing slicks are allowed

  Shouldn't they have won a special class trophy, with each of the other competitors moving up a notch?

  Not trying to complain, just curious.

  BTW- The Zamboni was one of my favorite cars ever!

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  Oct. 16, 2009 2:59 p.m. Per Schroeder Technical Editor/Advertising Director

  A) those are the 2010 rules.
  

  B) they weren't scored in the overall.
  

  C) We did, however, give them the first place in the autocross. We debated back and forth on that.

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  Oct. 16, 2009 3:10 p.m. ReverendDexter HalfDork

  I thought that the year it ran, there was a special exclusion to that rule specifically for Zambonis.

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  Oct. 16, 2009 3:10 p.m. SVreX PowerDork

  Yes, they are 2010. It was easier. (2009 rules are not on the site anymore)

  I thought the previous rules were similar.

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  Oct. 16, 2009 3:13 p.m. SVreX PowerDork

  What was the 2009 rule?

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  Oct. 16, 2009 3:19 p.m. Per Schroeder Technical Editor/Advertising Director

  2009:

  5) Only Production-based passenger cars are allowed in the regular competition. All Locosts, kit cars, Zambonis and the like are allowed only in the Special class (See Rule #27).
  

  
  

  27) A Special class for Locosts/Kit Cars/Specials will be run for exhibition only. It will be scored independently from the rest of the competitors. These cars can be home-built, road-worthy vehicles that meet all Challenge rules and safety regulations. The Special class competitors will only be eligible for the Special class trophies, unless one of them explodes spectacularly. Then we might reconsider.

  
  So, yea, We gave them the autocross trophy—probably should have given that to Condor/Dirte30. We'll make a note of all that in the editorial.

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  Oct. 16, 2009 4:32 p.m. Nashco SuperDork

  My old man was confused and asking me the same thing on the phone after seeing the update page here on GRM. He mentioned the zamboni, hot rod, and cars with no hoods and was confused because he thought it was supposed to be racing street cars. I explained that some cars were in the exhibition class, he argued that the zamboni, hot rod, or cars otherwise missing bodies didn't seem to be on the same playing field. Just passing it on, my car was going to be built to look like a stock Fiero whether the rules required it or not due to the nature of the project.

  Bryce

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  Oct. 16, 2009 4:48 p.m. SVreX PowerDork

  If the "Hot Rod" you are referring to was Andy Nelson's yellow bug, the "missing"body panels were in fact on the car.

  Rear fenders moved inward in their entirety (outer edge located where the inner edge was originally), and the front fenders were cut up and used for patching the car in various places.

  It's a creative interpretation, but if you read the rules carefully, you'll see he was inside the rules.

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  Oct. 16, 2009 5:15 p.m. Nashco SuperDork

  Yes, Andy's car was the hot rod. Yes, I looked over it very closely, I was very impressed with the craftsmanship. Yes, Andy explained his interpretation of the rules. I asked if he wasn't really just messing with Per at this point, but he denied it (smiling like a chessire cat). If you'd like, I can give you my dad's phone number and YOU can explain how Andy's car meets this rule: "Modifications may be made to the original unibody or body and body panels and frame for engine and suspension swaps and modifications, but only to the extent neccessary to perform the change."

  Like I said, I didn't care, I was building my car the same either way. I put WAAAAY too much time making my hood fit just like stock to be taking it off to shed 40 or 50 pounds in the competitive events. It's just tough to explain why some cars didn't have hoods even though the rules say you have to have one and how a car like Andy's is different than a kit car.

  Bryce

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  Oct. 19, 2009 3:53 p.m. SVreX PowerDork

  Nashco wrote:

  YOU can explain how Andy's car meets this rule: "Modifications may be made to the original unibody or body and body panels and frame for engine and suspension swaps and modifications, but only to the extent neccessary to perform the change."

  OK, I'll try...

  If you're gonna drop a Chevy V-8 (motor swap) and a solid axle (suspension swap) into a bug and intend to do NHRA legal 10's, you're gonna need to drop it on a frame with a full cage (certified for 9's) and some pretty serious traction assistance at the rear end. Therefore, the extent of changes neccessary to the original bug pan and panels to perform the (allowed) engine and suspension swap and modifications was rather extensive!

  The Challenge has seen a V-8 powered CRX, a Datsun with a V-8 in the passenger seat, a G-framed mid-engined VW bus, and a Mustang sitting on a Supra suspension and floor pan. All quite extensive!
  

  Bryce, your efforts were outstanding! I found your Fiero and Andy's bug to be equally entertaining. But the one thing that there has never been any lack of at the Challenge is creative rules interpretation.
  

  Rule 1 of the Challenge is that the purpose of the Challenge is to generate editorial content for the magazine.

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  Oct. 19, 2009 4:01 p.m. unevolved New Reader

  SVreX wrote:

  Rule 1 of the Challenge is that the purpose of the Challenge is to generate editorial content for the magazine.

  That's something we didn't take into consideration near enough when we built our car that we'll be remembering this time around.

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  Oct. 19, 2009 4:42 p.m. DirtE30 New Reader

  we'll bring the car back for next year and hopefully wont need a rule change to take the fastest time. Either way the car with "cake" like fenders was still super excited to receive the second place autox award.

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  Oct. 20, 2009 1:47 a.m. Nashco SuperDork

  SVreX wrote:

  Rule 1 of the Challenge is that the purpose of the Challenge is to generate editorial content for the magazine.

  Good point. Rule 1 is to make it interesting/cool/crazy, which preceeds rule 2 (if it doesn't say you can, you can't).

  Bryce

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  Oct. 20, 2009 6:42 a.m. redzcstandardhatch New Reader

  our crx (gutty) ran a couple autox runs without the hood (JG gave us permission) due to the heat....

  just in case bryce's dad was talking about that.

  it was so fricken hot ,and our hyundai fan wasnt pulling enough air out of the car after the autox runs.

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  Oct. 20, 2009 7:31 a.m. spin_out New Reader

  I remember thinking that since the Zamboni did have the FTD at the autocross, they did deserve the award.
  But in hindsight they were in a class seperated from the regular competition, so probably not eligible for Any award outside the Locost trophy.

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  Oct. 20, 2009 8:41 a.m. splitime Reader

  redzcstandardhatch wrote:

  our crx (gutty) ran a couple autox runs without the hood (JG gave us permission) due to the heat....

  just in case bryce's dad was talking about that.

  it was so fricken hot ,and our hyundai fan wasnt pulling enough air out of the car after the autox runs.

  You forget we found that timing was 5deg retarded the next day. That was NOT helping either :p

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  Oct. 20, 2009 8:42 a.m. Sarah Beltrami Events Coordinator

  In reply to DirtE30:

  Carlos...I'm rooting for ya!!!

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  Oct. 21, 2009 2:43 p.m. silence New Reader

  Sarah Beltrami wrote:

  In reply to DirtE30:

  Carlos...I'm rooting for ya!!!

  That was actually James, but thanks Sarah! We're shooting for the top spot next year ;)

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  Oct. 21, 2009 9:38 p.m. evildky Dork

  having a zomaboni in the challenge brings a lot of questions, I never get tired of explaining why there was a zamboni at the challenge

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