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Ian F
Ian F MegaDork
7/13/15 11:36 a.m.

The OCI on gas turbo VAG engines is not 10K - more like 5K or less. My TDI has a 10K OCI and is the engine is fine at 329K. Maybe I'd fix it if I didn't use my minivan so often for hauling my bikes around...

HiTempguy
HiTempguy UberDork
7/13/15 11:44 a.m.
Swank Force One wrote: Great car! Might completely hose your savings account inside of 40k miles, though.

Are you a salesman by trade?

bigdaddylee82
bigdaddylee82 Dork
7/13/15 11:54 a.m.

On our second DSG equipped VW diesel, no issues yet (knock on wood). Only maintenance I have the dealer do is the DSG service at the 40K mile interval. Works out to about every 2 to 2.5 years for our current commute.

flatlander937 wrote: I really like their diesels but the fuel system self destructing is kind of a barrier to seriously considering one myself.

Got a letter in the mail for our '09 that we don't have anymore (totaled in a wreck), VW extended the warranty on the HPFP to 10 years or 120K miles.

petegossett
petegossett PowerDork
7/13/15 12:09 p.m.

In reply to bigdaddylee82:

What's the ballpark cost for the dealer to service the DSG?

These are on my radar for our next vehicle as well.

SlickDizzy
SlickDizzy PowerDork
7/13/15 12:09 p.m.

This thread makes me a little sad, but alas. Guess I'm keeping the BMW for now and waiting for the right 3S or FoST. Shame about VW, hopefully they figure it out someday...

Ian F
Ian F MegaDork
7/13/15 12:54 p.m.
SlickDizzy wrote: This thread makes me a little sad, but alas. Guess I'm keeping the BMW for now and waiting for the right 3S or FoST. Shame about VW, hopefully they figure it out someday...

Conversely, I'd buy another VW before a BMW any day... I hated wrenching on the E30, but the Mk IV is fairly easy for me. Just what you get used to.

Then again... I drove by a Laguna Seca Blue E46 M3 this morning with a for sale sign on it...

SlickDizzy
SlickDizzy PowerDork
7/13/15 12:54 p.m.

In reply to Datsun1500:

Read closer. It is just you. All of the "no issues with mine" posts refer to the naturally aspirated or TDI models, which I didn't ask about.

As far as I can tell, nobody here has had a single good thing to say about the TFSI in the GTI yet, which is the one I'm considering...the ONE poster on this board that actually owns one had only negative things to say. If you're going to get snarky, at least read a little closer.

bigdaddylee82
bigdaddylee82 Dork
7/13/15 1:12 p.m.
petegossett wrote: In reply to bigdaddylee82: What's the ballpark cost for the dealer to service the DSG? These are on my radar for our next vehicle as well.

I buy the DSG Service Kit from IDParts (used to be TDIParts before VW's lawyers got their panties in a twist) and call around dealer service shops. Not all are willing to do the service with off the street parts, but if you call enough you'll find a service advisor willing to do it. $100 in parts and 2 hours labor, so should be around $300 before tax.

I had no problem getting a VW dealer to service it with my fluid/filter in OH, but I had one dealer in AR say no, and another quoted me an F'off price.

Swank Force One
Swank Force One MegaDork
7/13/15 1:22 p.m.
HiTempguy wrote:
Swank Force One wrote: Great car! Might completely hose your savings account inside of 40k miles, though.

Are you a salesman by trade?

I have been in the past.

Contradiction
Contradiction Reader
7/13/15 3:53 p.m.

I can't say VW has a "spotless record" but speaking as someone that has owned a MK1 (presently), MK3, and MK4 they are fun cars with a devote following. If you want a sterling reputation for "perfect" reliability then you should be buying an appliance like a Camry, not a car built for enthusiasts.

I have generally heard good things about the driving experience for the MK5 and MK6s, but they aren't without issues. Are they B5 Audi S4 2.7TT bad? NO! I know cam followers and carbon build up have been issues, but I can't speak to that myself completely since I haven't owned one and nor have a had reason to stay on top of those issues personally. If you check out vwvortex you'll see a lot of info on what people run into.

A quick google search also brought up this blog from an independent shop that has a lot of good info on common issues with these motors:

Deutsche Auto Parts Blog

At the end of the day every enthusiast has to decide which brand's crap they are willing to put with the most. Some problems are more or less endearing depending on how much you enjoy driving the car. A CPO car you intend to ditch after the warranty expires really isn't a bad way to go if you a skidish about VW.

Choppa87
Choppa87 New Reader
7/13/15 4:41 p.m.

I had an 07 MK5 DSG GTI... By far the worst car I have ever owned and worst service experience ever. It spent more time in the shop then on the rode. After a LONG battle, I had to replace the motor due to a rocker arm at 90k (which I beleived was damaged by the cam follower that was recalled). Then right after, the DSG went out. This doesnt include the multiple little things that happened. It could just be my local dealer but the service was horrible. They never knew much about recalls and tsbs and I had to regularly print off recalls to prove that parts were indeed covered. When it worked, the car drove great but I was always nervous it would leave me stranded. I traded it in for a Focus St when the DSG started acting up and have not looked back. Make sure the CPO warranty is legit if you get one and get rid of it when it is up.

maj75
maj75 Reader
7/14/15 1:22 p.m.

I have some familiarity with auto warranty policies. I know that VAG have the poorest ratings and the highest premiums.

My financial advisor had his Tiguan Lemon Lawed. It had electrical and structural problems. It was at the dealers for 5 months of the 6 he owned it.

orphancars
orphancars Reader
7/14/15 5:12 p.m.

Seems like I post up in every "ZOMG teh VW is teh suxxors" thread that pops up here on GRM. Seems to happen every six months or so.

Own two of 'em of recent vintage. The experience of ownership of my wife's 2010 TDI Sportwagen was so awesome that I went out and bought a 2012 GTI. Das wagen is closing in on 70k in mileage and no surprising/odd/unexpected issues. The GTI has also been trouble free to date as well. The GTI just recently got an APR tune and has been happily autox'd this year about a dozen times so far. They feel tightly assembled and nothing has fallen off either car, nothing melted, and I haven't seen a check engine light. I did see the check tires/tire pressure light go off when missus Orphancars hit a curb and unseated a tire, so we know that works.

As always YMMV, but my real-world driving with 2 VWs of recent vintage and 85k total miles driven so far has been (knock wood) better than others that we've had recently (looking at you Mazda and Subaru).

SlickDizzy
SlickDizzy PowerDork
7/14/15 5:14 p.m.

In reply to orphancars:

Have you had any issues with the intake valve carbon buildup that these motors supposedly develop all the time?

docwyte
docwyte Dork
7/15/15 10:14 a.m.

Everyone on this board loves to hate on VAG products. Fact is I've put 100's of thousands of trouble free miles on VAG products, including the so called horrendous 2.7T's.

Everyone here loves Subaru's, despite their having huge motor issues.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, VAG products don't suffer fools. You HAVE to maintain them,if you do, all will be well. Don't buy a cheap one unless it comes with a complete service history.

HiTempguy
HiTempguy UberDork
7/15/15 10:46 a.m.
docwyte wrote: Everyone here loves Subaru's, despite their having huge motor issues.

False. We've had this argument before. Its a tuning issue which costs under $400 to fix, and you get better mpg and more power by doing it. That's not a motor issue, and it is simple to rectify. It is not simple to rectify poor electronics/wiring/bizarre things with VW's.

This is compared to VW's in general just having horrible reliability rates by any known metric. I had a 2004 Golf with only 30,000kms on it in 2008. Great car, slow as balls, awful mpg, and the best part was the one time the coolant temp sensor failed which COMPLETELY SHUT OFF THE CAR IN TRAFFIC or when the throwout bearing randomly exploded.

rcutclif
rcutclif Dork
7/15/15 11:41 a.m.

I've only owned 2 VWs. Neither were turbo. 1st was a 1993 VW fox. it died a nasty death at about 115k miles, due to a ground strap breaking, grounding the motor through the 4 fuel injectors. This grounding fried all 4 at the same time, blocking them all at full open. Very shortly later, the engine hydrolocked due to fuel filling up the pistons.

the 2nd was an aircooled VW bus. Never had undue trouble with that car. Replaced the generator once.

Both were incredibly fun to drive (and P.S. I had bought the fox for $800 and driven it for all of high school, doing all the maintenance and damage usually associated with a 16 year old boy).

einy
einy New Reader
7/15/15 11:48 a.m.
Ian F wrote: The OCI on gas turbo VAG engines is not 10K - more like 5K or less. My TDI has a 10K OCI and is the engine is fine at 329K. Maybe I'd fix it if I didn't use my minivan so often for hauling my bikes around...

My 2011 GTI has a recommended 10k mile OCI.

So far, only failure has been the intake manifold, replaced under warranty at ~ 37k miles. Apparently a common failure, as VW upped the warranty on that unit to 110k miles (injectors upped to that mileage limit also). Service manager said "see again you in 35k miles" when I asked if the replacement manifold was an improved design. Great ...

Other than that, I really love this car (so far)!

amg_rx7
amg_rx7 SuperDork
7/15/15 11:51 a.m.
Contradiction wrote: If you want a sterling reputation for "perfect" reliability then you should be buying a car engineered by enthusiasts like a Mazda

Fixed that for you

docwyte
docwyte Dork
7/15/15 12:46 p.m.

Hitempguy, so cracked oil pump pickups are solved by a tune? Or the weak head gaskets on all the 2.5's, including the NA's? Or the poorly made ring lands that break? How about the motors in the STi's just going BOOM! That all solved by a $400 tune?

Please. Subaru's are just a big of a pile of E36 M3e as any other car out there, sometimes more since their interior/exterior quality is garbage compared to the VAG products.

Aspen
Aspen Reader
7/15/15 1:15 p.m.
docwyte wrote: Everyone here loves Subaru's, despite their having huge motor issues. I've said it before and I'll say it again, VAG products don't suffer fools. You HAVE to maintain them,if you do, all will be well. Don't buy a cheap one unless it comes with a complete service history.

Subaru motors do suck, I have owned two.

Maintenance usually has little to do with the parts that fail in my experience. All the crap that failed on my Subarus, Saabs, and MINI had zero to do with maintenance, just faulty parts and bad engineering. Eg. how does one maintain a coil pack, strut, LCA bushing, headgasket? Most of the fails I read about VAG products are the same, like cam tensioners, intake coking, coils, electrical fails, etc.

SlickDizzy
SlickDizzy PowerDork
7/15/15 1:39 p.m.

At this point I'm just done considering one of these. I can deal with intake carbon cleaning, but when you get into the stuff that just shouldn't happen within 100k (like timing chain tensioner failures, cam follower replacements, etc) it just seems like a bad idea. Especially when you look at VW's CPO warranty: 2-year, 24k miles bumper-to-bumper...nearly irrelevant compared to the 7-year, 100k powertrain warranty every other major manufacturer offers.

Ian F
Ian F MegaDork
7/15/15 3:23 p.m.

In reply to SlickDizzy:

(chuckle...)

If you dig hard enough, you'll find these complaints about damn near every car currently being sold. For example, my own past experiences with BMW's makes me leary of ever buying another one. At least not as car I'd want to depend on.

ShadowSix
ShadowSix Dork
7/15/15 3:30 p.m.

I love VAG products. I had a MkII Golf, which was unbelievably fun for an econobox, and felt like it was milled from a single piece of steel compared to the chintzy build of same-era Hondas and Toyotas. The 1st Gen Audi TT has one of the most beautiful, special interiors I've ever seen on a car under the $100k mark. The last new Golf TDI I drove was awesome, fast, great handling, beautiful interior, and the doors closed like a bank vault.

The fact is that VAG fans just have a different definition of "reliable" from the one I have as a Honda/Toyota/Mazda guy. I wish that these cars were reliable. I wish that 50% of past owners that post on these threads didn't have serious mechanical issues. But we're not there yet. I still have hope.

Ian F
Ian F MegaDork
7/15/15 3:32 p.m.
einy wrote: My 2011 GTI has a recommended 10k mile OCI.

You might want to double-check that. I've read otherwise in a number of places. Personally, I wouldn't go past 5K and make damn sure you use VAG-rated oil. Unless you plan on dumping the car within a few years... then it'll just be some other poor saps problem.

And I suppose in that case, SlickDizzy is better off avoiding a CPO VW as you can never really be sure what the service history is and that is everything with these cars...

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