First autocross after 5+ year Haitus, what should i expect?

Hi so i am finally getting a chance to do another autocross after about 5 years. Sadly a few years ago i had to sell the my main autocross car and since then have simply had reliable bangers for transport i wasn't willing to risk a autocross with (really slow, rusty, just bad for it)

edit: Description of myself moved to post #13 as it clogged up "Original Post"

Actual Question:

anyways none of this really matters,my actual question is what i should expect now that i am just getting back into autocross, i actually have my first meet this morning and im anticipating it. I have a feeling now that i am driving a completely different car and i am probably rather rusty i shouldn't expect much, but also am wondering if there are any universal pointers or consensus of what usually happens during the period when somebody finally makes it back to the track, how this can change the perspective on their own skills,Things i should be cautious about etc?

You will see a bunch of newer cars and more emphasis on Street tired classes. I find a lot of younger, newer drivers but still some of the same old grey beards

I'd say basic noob advice still applies: Go slow to go fast. Walk the course as many times as you can. Look ahead, no - farther ahead than that. Stay on course. I know how you feel, although I'm probably at least another year or two out before I have a car I want to run, although I may take the Mini out this year once I fix it if my racing/training (mtn bike DH) schedule allows.

Well, since I started about the same time you quit, here's what I've noticed in the past few years. Hoosiers are out in street class. (This is a good thing, IMHO) The "good" street tires are better. There's pretty much an "autocross formula" for every car. If your Google-fu is strong, you can find a decent set up for just about any car in 5 minutes or less. Locally at least, the "ST*" classes have become more popular, usually with the younger demographic. Good venues seem to be becoming harder to come by at the same time entry numbers are climbing. The good side of this is larger fields, bigger classes and better competition. The bad side is longer days and fewer runs.

BTW - interesting you mentioned Gingerman, doing my first HPDE there tomorrow.

The scca finally removed there heads from a deep dark smelly place and got Hoosiers out of the entry classes. There is no stock classes anymore.

You should expect big hats and be wary of them. /I'm le tired...

As always, if you think you're going really fast you're really not. Watch where and how others who are successful in your class turn and brake. Start off slow and almost comfortable, it will eventually grow to faster and almost comfortable.

I always like to get right out of the car and replay the lap in mind, one corner at a time, while staring at the track. Was there anywhere I had to smash the brakes? Where, did, I get behind? Next lap, I concentrate on those errors. SMOOTH IS GREAT!

I had about 6 years off before I got back into it. My first event, in a bone-stock '98 Integra RS automatic, I just took it slow to get the feel back. The next event, I pushed a bit harder. Since then, I feel like I'm back on pace. I didn't feel lost at all, but rather back in my element. I've changed cars a couple of times since then, but overall, it's about the same as it used to be, with some minor changes in the rules towards tires.

I'll be the dissenting vote on the "Slow/smooth" is fast argument.

Threshold braking/slip-angle/squeezing the throttle as early as possible on an AUTOCROSS course are not "smooth/slow" events, IMHO. They should whip your goddamned head/body around and make you feel like you're on a berkeleying roller coaster.

10 times out of 9, a "smooth" run on an auto-x course is my slowest, and the "violent" one is my fastest. The same does not necessarily apply to a 2-mile road course, but that's apples and orangutans.

What should you expect?

Jitters. Even though it's just a bunch of cones in a parking lot.

I minimize those jitters by walking the course at least three times. Alone. Memorizing KEY cones (There are usually only 5 or 6 of them, and the rest only serve to suck you into a turn too early) and other visual reference points; a letter on a hwy sign in the distance. A light pole, etc.

I'll "squat" to see what the picture looks like from the seated position. Unless you're driving an SUV, the whole course is gonna look a lot different standing vs. in the driver's seat.

I also like to take a "real world" approach to course walks; "In theory, I should be here. In reality, I'll probably be way the berkeley off-line over here." :D

Get the revs up on the start. I'd rather spin the tires a little than bog.

Make mental notes at each of those key cones. For me, it's usually "I was on the brakes/throttle too early."

Anyway, yeah. Expect jitters. I like to minimize these by showing up WAY early (early enough to help with set-up.) Have your car cleaned up/out & ready for tech, & HAVE FUN!!!

You should expect SRS BSNSS from the ruler eyes protest party, and lots of big hats with the likelihood of sunburn

I'd say smooth is fast is somewhat relative. We have the good fortune to have several national champions in our region, both with multiple titles. The similarities end there. One you would barely guess is moving. He is so smooth he barely looks like he is in motion at all. If you ride with him, his hands are slow and deliberate, the car is never out of shape, and cones are almost never hit. I even saw him take FTD at an event in a mostly stock Yugo he is so fast.

On the other side we have another guy (and GRM pro driver), that can be fast in anything. And although he too is smooth, it's much more violent in the car. His hands are faster, but he tends to throw the car around more. All in all, it's a more exciting ride.

So what do they have in common? An unreal ability to concentrate and process information, and an ability to understand the car and what it needs at all times. They are also both exceptional "brakers", which in my opinion, can separate the good from the great.

Lots of standing around working corners

Well I'm back and here is what i can say, maybe it could be useful to somebody in my position.... If you don't want to read all of the stuff below what i will say is coming back to autocross is actually really refreshing, especially if when you left you were in a comfortable position and figured out some basic fundimentals, in that case coming back to autocross is actually pretty great, you feel less coordinated but not in a way that is actually frustrating, instead intriguing and refreshing, happy memories included :D

 Walking the Course:  This was very different then old days, it helped alot but i wasn't able to properly visualize it from inside my car simply by walking (i suppose a hard-earned skill).  Importantly i had a friend there why recently started competing at nationals and he pointed out a few key things i would of got wrong, like how it was better to just take the short line on the first wide corner, as even if it looked like it was a good idea to late-apex it would actually just be a waste of time <img src="/media/img/icons/smilies/crazy-18.png" alt="" />

 Driving: Apparently i left at a decent time where the important bits stuck in regards to car control, philosphy and technique... What i found was that i was able to pull out decent times but started out quite slow for what i was driving.. My car control was ofc a Work In Progress but i progressed quickly and each run cut about 1.5 seconds without any errors.  What i noticed the most is that driving felt far less alien then when i was a newbie.  However since i hadn't done anything like this in about 5-6 years there was a further divide between the part of my mind working on studying/finding ideal lines ,  trying to take vs what i took, and the part of my mind getting the driving right (maybe hard to describe)... However it was actually very fun because i started feeling all the things i used to know coming back to me, it was extremely enjoyable and actually in a way much more fun then being a newbie again, where i felt quite a bit more lost even if my enthusiasm was very high.  I didn't feel lost at all, just a little uncoordinated.  Despite this i didn't knock a single cone over all day :D

Fun part was my friend who is a national level driver drove my car afterwords(fun runs), best i had a 45.5, he got it down to a 44.4 but ofc only in 1 run (but coned it voilently pushing through last corner), considering how he is well respected and has gotten further then i ever did in autocross, I'm actually kind of happy i was only 1 second behind (even if he only ran once), atleast in my mind i don't see any reason to feel bad about this, was fun to see how he handled the car as well.

 Is Smoother Faster (commentary because its a interesting subject that got brought up): Ofc it is, however its all relative!!! especially if your starting out then just start smooth!!!!...this is essential advice i would give to ANY newbie, especially a young and eager one (old men maybe it being different).. I actually started out (originally, over a decade ago) driving too harshly, so from this perspective ALL fast driving is smooth even if the driver has quick responses/input or is pulling high G-forces... In regards to coming back from Hiatus i benefited alot from driving the first run at a somewhat relaxed pace.  This was a excellent idea because i was able to pay more attention to how the car felt/reacted and how the track was actually setup, rather then getting distracted constantly fighting for control and getting back onto the proper line.

 Tires: Between now and about 2007 street tires have turned into basically slicks... I was around in the days of Falken RT-615 Supremacy.  Now "street tires" are basically just slicks with a tire-wear rating of 200 :p, what sillyness is this?!?!


 Cars and Classes: I used to race MK1 MR2, which was in same class as early Miatas, that seems the same.... Probably a nice class if you have either of those cars today, Miatas ofc being preferable but all things relative not horribly imbalanced.

Problem is I'm now in H-Stock.... MY GOD.... Talk about a class which must have changed alot, i don't have a ideal car for being competitive, just a fun one for keeping myself sharp, a 2003 Honda Civic Coupe ("EM2")..... Nice 115hp economy car, comfy and soft but relatively nicely balanced suspension... Guess what type of cars are in its class? 210hp Turbo Ford Fiesta STs (:P.... Those Fiestas were absolute bosses, ignoring the Caterham that obviously was insane compared to everything else they were fairly close to some of the fastest cars (on slicks, modified F-Bodys and Corvettes) despite basically being "stock" momentum cars... The Golf Rabbits and Focus's weren't slow either.

H-stock is weird now!!!!, luckily I'm more interested in improve myself atm hehe, because clearly i don't come close to possessing the right type of car for this class, but its still fun to compete...

sesto elemento wrote: Lots of standing around working corners

Just make sure when your signing up for work you sign up with a friend and get assigned the same corner, if not that then just be sociable, i honestly like working corners so long as the other guy(s) there are relatively sociable, it can be pretty fun :P

Smarta$$ McPoopyPants wrote: I'll be the dissenting vote on the "Slow/smooth" is fast argument. Threshold braking/slip-angle/squeezing the throttle as early as possible on an AUTOCROSS course are not "smooth/slow" events, IMHO. They should whip your goddamned head/body around and make you feel like you're on a berkeleying roller coaster. 10 times out of 9, a "smooth" run on an auto-x course is my slowest, and the "violent" one is my fastest. The same does not necessarily apply to a 2-mile road course, but that's apples and orangutans. What should you expect? Jitters. Even though it's just a bunch of cones in a parking lot. I minimize those jitters by walking the course at least three times. Alone. Memorizing KEY cones (There are usually only 5 or 6 of them, and the rest only serve to suck you into a turn too early) and other visual reference points; a letter on a hwy sign in the distance. A light pole, etc. I'll "squat" to see what the picture looks like from the seated position. Unless you're driving an SUV, the whole course is gonna look a lot different standing vs. in the driver's seat. I also like to take a "real world" approach to course walks; "In theory, I should be here. In reality, I'll probably be way the berkeley off-line over here." :D Get the revs up on the start. I'd rather spin the tires a little than bog. Make mental notes at each of those key cones. For me, it's usually "I was on the brakes/throttle too early." Anyway, yeah. Expect jitters. I like to minimize these by showing up WAY early (early enough to help with set-up.) Have your car cleaned up/out & ready for tech, & HAVE FUN!!!

That's exactly how I walk the course. I tend to walk with a couple of more experienced friends who've done well at nationals once or twice, and then walk it myself at least 2-3 more times taking into account my car and driving style. I usually do pretty well in-class for my experience; I would've won STC last year pretty easily with 2 more events if I didn't have life/car problems get in the way, with a VERY unprepared car-about 2 seconds off a "chariot" pace, which was REALLY good from my prep level. I'll still usually tag along a few paces behind on the novice walk to see if there's anything I missed, but most of it isn't applicable anymore as they usually tailor it to noobs. The people I race with tell me I'd be really fast in a well prepared car or something that's actually "fast".

Also, my first run is normally slow and smooth, second is a little bit faster with as late braking as I can get, then 3/4/5 are usually balls out making adjustments. I'm a pretty "toss it in, let it move, power out" style of driver, so usually my wildest run is the fastest in my case.

In reply to Ottobon:

Just start the conversation.....I usually learn that I'm working with noobs who are full of questions, but just are afraid to ask basic ones.