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volvoclearinghouse
volvoclearinghouse HalfDork
12/22/13 6:29 a.m.

Yesterday my wife and I were heading from Maryland to South Carolina to spend Christmas with her parents. We also had a couple of cars to pick up in SC, so we were towing an empty 2 car hauler, about 3000 lbs. We got about 400 miles from home, truck running great. Heading south on I-77 just north of Charlotte, when traffic suddenly slowed from 70 down to a crawl. As I let off the accelerator to coast down the engine shut off without any warning. Just died.

I put it in Neutral (automatic) and coasted off onto the shoulder. it would not restart at all. She immediately checked online and found the cam position sensor (CPS) common mode failure so I hiked up the street to an auto parts store, bought a CPS (Duralast brand) and a 10mm socket and ratchet, got a ride back to the truck, and swapped out the CPS. I cranked the truck and it fired and tried to run once, very roughly, and then cut off again. More attempts at cranking did nothing. I checked all the fuses, disconnected and reconnected the batteries, and disconnected the PHP chip from the ECU (with the batteries disconnected). Still nothing.

Finally I called a wrecker and got a tow to the in-laws, who were about 100 miles away at that point. So, the truck is in their driveway, and of course Christmas being this week getting service is going to be hard. My plan is to see if I can find an auto parts store that has a code scanner and do a bit of diagnosis myself. I will keep this thread updated with progress.

Meanwhile, and ideas on what else it could be? One other thing- when the truck cranks, it doesn't sound like it normally does when it cranks. It seems to be a little slower (maybe?), and sounds more labored, or just weird. :(

Also posted on the powerstroke forum, but thought maybe you guys might have some ideas, too, as I'm sure there's others here running 7.3 PSD tow vehicles. Thanks!

Toyman01
Toyman01 UltimaDork
12/22/13 7:10 a.m.

You didn't say what year, but assuming 99 or newer, I would look into the high pressure oil regulator and high pressure oil pump. It takes high pressure oil to fire the injectors. If the high pressure oil pump or regulator is weak, it won't start. They also need to crank in the 300rpm+ range.

Will it start and run cold but not idle hot? Will it start on ether and run at high RPMs, but die at idle. I'd look at the high pressure oil system.

I've had a couple of friends have this problem. One was the regulator, $$$ the other was the pump. $$$$

Good luck, there is nothing worse than being broken down 1000 miles from your shop and using strange tools.

Edit: One more thing I would look into is the throttle pedal. They get a dead spot in them occasionally and will shut the truck down. They are fairly cheap and easy to replace. It should throw a code where the high pressure oil system doesn't.

Spoolpigeon
Spoolpigeon SuperDork
12/22/13 7:18 a.m.

Fuel filter? A dirty one can stop a diesel in its tracks, and they're fairly cheap and easy to replace.

redzcstandardhatch
redzcstandardhatch Reader
12/22/13 7:31 a.m.

sounds exactly like the symptoms mine have had when the lift pump fails (I have a 99 and 02)

its a "regular"looking fuel pump, on framerail below the drivers door on 99-03, have someone turn the keywhile you lay under and feel if its running (you can hear a good one)...its an easy fix, but you'll stink like fuel after. If that's it, buy the little "ford fuel fittings"kit when you buy a pump.....

volvoclearinghouse
volvoclearinghouse HalfDork
12/22/13 7:32 a.m.

Yup, 2000 PSD, 154,000 miles

Just replaced the fuel filter 1000 miles ago.

The truck won't run at all, and sounds weird when cranking. So far I've seen (inaddition to Toyman's recs):

1) IPR Valve 2) IDM 3) UVCH 4) ICP Sensor 5) Fuel heater blowing the #22 maxifuse.

Will check the fuse today and going to buy a scanner as soon as advance opens this morning. Hopefully that can narrow it down so I'm not swapping $$$ parts all day.

I've also heard that CPS sensors can be dead out of the box. Poor design. We'll see what the codes say...

redzcstandardhatch
redzcstandardhatch Reader
12/22/13 7:32 a.m.

fittings TOOL kit I mean, the little plastic tools to pop the fittings loose

CGLockRacer
CGLockRacer Dork
12/22/13 7:55 a.m.

In reply to redzcstandardhatch:

Get the metal ones if you can. I broke all the plastic ones I tried. The metal ones look like an X.

redzcstandardhatch
redzcstandardhatch Reader
12/22/13 8:01 a.m.

I've never broken a plastic tool...maybe I have lil wimpy precision hands

Ranger50
Ranger50 PowerDork
12/22/13 9:20 a.m.

If it cranks but doesn't sound like it is going to fire, I would suspect the IDM first. Take it loose and shake it, hope for no water intrusion.

calteg
calteg Reader
12/22/13 9:24 a.m.

Lift pump or injection pump are the prime suspects. Crack open a line to an injector, then try cranking. Any fuel come out?

tr8todd
tr8todd HalfDork
12/22/13 9:28 a.m.

Just went thru this with my 6.0 and it ended up being the FICM. This was after the diesel mechanic swore it was the turbo and would cost $1600. I put it on a scanner and saw low voltage at all 8 injectors so I figured it had to be the FICM. Rock auto, and $226 later I fixed it myself. You really won't know whats up until you scan it, but it sounds like fuel to me.

volvoclearinghouse
volvoclearinghouse HalfDork
12/22/13 10:11 a.m.

All right folks, here's the 11AM update:

Hooked up the codereader (Actron 9580) and pulled a Code P0603 and P0470.

The P0603 was an Internal Control Keep Alive Memory Malfunction. Suggested fixes were the Cam Position Sensor (of course), PCM, fuel heater element (which I think I've ruled out, due to the #22 maxifuse being good), ICP sensor, IDM, IPR, or UVWH.

The P0407 was an Exhaust Backpressure Sensor Fault. Suggested fixes are the EBP sensor, or the APP (Accellerator Pedal Sensor).

I tried cranking the truck with the accelerator in various positions, no difference. Fuel pump is running, I hear it. Wait to start light does its thing, no lights or weird buzzers or anything on the dash.

Just for giggles, because the cranking sounds different, I've got a charger on one of the batteries now (will swap over in an hour or so to the other battery, the batteries are divorced electrically for charging right now).

Could the problem be as simple as a dead battery/s &/or bad alternator? I've heard these PSDs need a really good charging system to crank and run.

JtspellS
JtspellS Dork
12/22/13 10:21 a.m.

Have you reset the KAM (leave the battery un hooked for about 10 min) The scanner you have might do it..

Good luck sir!

volvoclearinghouse
volvoclearinghouse HalfDork
12/22/13 10:38 a.m.

I did disconnect the batts for about 10 minutes while doing the CPS on the side of I-77. That was when it tried to fire, started, ran rough, and died.

Going to check the fuel filter now, see if it's got fuel...

nicksta43
nicksta43 SuperDork
12/22/13 10:49 a.m.

And this is why Ford trucks are junk. We've spent enough this year on trying to keep our fleet of three Ford diesel trucks ( 2-F550's and 1-F250) running to completely knock us out of our Christmas bonus, and nearly put us in the red for the year. Not counting all the lost revenue from downtime while they sit in the shop getting an $18k engine installed. All the trucks are less than ten years old and one has less than 150k on it and on it's third engine. The other has a little more miles and is on it's second engine and second transmission. berkeleying junk.

stan_d
stan_d Dork
12/22/13 11:52 a.m.

The 6.0 yes. 7.3 no mine has 190k and I didn't

stan_d
stan_d Dork
12/22/13 11:55 a.m.

6.0 yes. I have a 01 with 190k on it. I didn't plug it in but it still started @ 9 degrees. Every 6.5 chevy I have had would do that. The only no start condition I has was this summer when the batteries went bad. And found a loose connection on the starter.

volvoclearinghouse
volvoclearinghouse HalfDork
12/22/13 11:57 a.m.

It is getting fuel, just checked the filter drain valve.

turbojunker
turbojunker HalfDork
12/22/13 11:59 a.m.
stan_d wrote: 6.0 yes. I have a 01 with 190k on it. I didn't plug it in but it still started @ 9 degrees. Every 6.5 chevy I have had would do that. The only no start condition I has was this summer when the batteries went bad. And found a loose connection on the starter.

We had so many problems out of the 6.0 trucks where I work that they only buy gas burners now. An F450 with a V10 is no fun.

yamaha
yamaha PowerDork
12/22/13 12:23 p.m.

Considering the can sensor is a duralast, its about a 75% chance its DOA?

TRoglodyte
TRoglodyte Dork
12/22/13 12:33 p.m.

Toy man suggested the accelerator pedal sensor, two strikes? Where in SC.?

amg_rx7
amg_rx7 Dork
12/22/13 12:33 p.m.

I don't see your thread on the Ford-Trucks forum... http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/forum31/

Brotus7
Brotus7 HalfDork
12/22/13 12:35 p.m.

I had the fuel heater blow the maxifuse on my OBS 7.3 power stroke, but it doesn't sound like that happened to you.

Ranger50
Ranger50 PowerDork
12/22/13 12:46 p.m.

The KAM code is from removing the chip. The EBP code is something I would not worry about either. Unplug it and wire it open.

If fuse #22 is ok, I'd still suspect a dead IDM. I bet it fails the injector buzz test, which requires more than a simple code reader.

nicksta43
nicksta43 SuperDork
12/22/13 1:11 p.m.

In reply to stan_d:

None of our are 6.0. Not only are they completely unreliable they have the absolute worst turning circle of anything I've ever driven. The seats suck and they are way to loud. They have no redeeming qualities at all. All the little complaints pail in comparison to just how many cubic dollars it takes just to keep them on the road. I hate them. I know there is a huge love fest for Ford on this board so carry on drinking the kool aid. My 12+ years of running medium duty trucks every single day tell me different.

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