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jharry3
jharry3 HalfDork
9/16/19 2:01 p.m.

2017 Ford Edge.   2.0 liter turbo 4 cylinder. Standard engine.  65,000 miles.  Warranty is 5 years/60,0000 miles.  Wife drives over 30,000 miles a year so here I am with a vehicle we have had for exactly 2 years.

White smoke is coming out the exhaust and water in the cylinders.

Ford dealer sends me TSB 19-2208.   This advises them to replace the long block and associated parts, $8,100, when this occurs. 

The fact a TSB exists shows me that this isn't Ford's first rodeo - its out there and its happening.    Dealer tells me it won't happen again because Ford knows about this and redesigned the block so it  won't crack.  The new engine will have a 3 year with unlimited mileage warranty.

Apparently engine block castings are wear items with Fords.  

They of course denied any responsibility, its out of warranty you  know.     I am working my way though the Customer Relations labyrinth with the hope of someone giving me a new engine.   I may have a lawyer in my future it this doesn't go well.   

alfadriver
alfadriver MegaDork
9/16/19 2:06 p.m.

The block is an emissions related item, it should be warranted to 80k miles (they are certified to 120 or 150k).  Make sure they are fully aware of that.  You can complain to the EPA if they don't replace it.

Read farther down the TSB, you'll see the same words being used.

jharry3
jharry3 HalfDork
9/16/19 2:23 p.m.
alfadriver said:

The block is an emissions related item, it should be warranted to 80k miles (they are certified to 120 or 150k).  Make sure they are fully aware of that.  You can complain to the EPA if they don't replace it.

Read farther down the TSB, you'll see the same words being used.

According to EPA bulletin EPA-420-F-15-035, published Oct 2015, the only items which must be covered to 80,000 miles are Catalytic converters, ECU and the OBD computer.   All other emissions items are to be covered to 24,000 miles.  None of the items mentioned in the specific list include the engine block.     

If you know of another bulletin or publication that helps me make my case please give me the title or a link to it.     None the less I will use loss of meeting emissions control standards in my approach to Ford.

FuzzWuzzy
FuzzWuzzy Reader
9/16/19 2:33 p.m.

Class action just like their wonderful Powershift they've been dealing with as of late?

alfadriver
alfadriver MegaDork
9/16/19 2:33 p.m.

No, I don't, but I do find it odd that the block isn't covered, since it's what generates the emissions in the first place.  That kind of blows.

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner MegaDork
9/16/19 2:40 p.m.

Well, if the block cracks then the engine won't make any emissions, right?

 

I kid, obviously. I have nothing to add but support. Keep working your way up the chain of command and hopefully you'll get lucky. A friend had a similar failure in a Subaru and they eventually offered free parts and he paid labor. It helped in his case that he'd had all his service done at the dealership.

dean1484
dean1484 MegaDork
9/16/19 2:44 p.m.

Yikes. That is a problem I bet Ford is trying to keep in the low down. 

slowbird
slowbird HalfDork
9/16/19 2:45 p.m.

Urgh. That blows chunks. Dangit Ford, stop messing up! I'm gonna be stuck only buying your old junk instead of your new junk! *shakes fist*

GameboyRMH
GameboyRMH MegaDork
9/16/19 2:57 p.m.

Came in here to see what insane F1-like engine Ford has built where the block is a wear item, leaving disappointed.

NOHOME
NOHOME MegaDork
9/16/19 3:02 p.m.

Well, yeah..!

 

Kind of a badge of honor for the high HP smallblock guys. About 500 hp seems to do it reliably.

 

 

 

Pete

 

 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ PowerDork
9/16/19 3:09 p.m.
jharry3 said:

2.0 liter turbo 4 cylinder

Dealer tells me it won't happen again because Ford knows about this and redesigned the block so it  won't crack.  The new engine will have a 3 year with unlimited mileage warranty.

Get that in writing, have the block replaced, pin the wastegate shut, and go party  devil

Tac1
Tac1 New Reader
9/16/19 3:20 p.m.

Should have let them go out of business. Waste of tax payer money saving a company that's in the position they're in from putting out s* products. Is there anything in their lineup without some sort of major issue going on?

Brett_Murphy
Brett_Murphy UltimaDork
9/16/19 3:33 p.m.

I'd like to bring up the water pump failure with under 70k miles  in the Ford 3.7 that made "get a junkyard engine and slap it in" the easy button for my wife's car.

Good luck with this. I had no luck with mine.

z31maniac
z31maniac MegaDork
9/16/19 3:44 p.m.
Tac1 said:

Should have let them go out of business. Waste of tax payer money saving a company that's in the position they're in from putting out s* products. Is there anything in their lineup without some sort of major issue going on?

*facepalm.png*

Ford didn't take bailout money, or TARP if you want to be specific. They took out gov't backed loans they are paying back by 2022. 

But whatever you do, don't use the power of technology to keep yourself educated, use it to yell at clouds instead. 

https://www.thebalance.com/auto-industry-bailout-gm-ford-chrysler-3305670

Javelin
Javelin MegaDork
9/16/19 3:47 p.m.
Tac1 said:

Should have let them go out of business. Waste of tax payer money saving a company that's in the position they're in from putting out s* products. Is there anything in their lineup without some sort of major issue going on?

You do realize Ford didn't get bailed out right? That was GM and Chrysler...

JamesMcD
JamesMcD SuperDork
9/16/19 3:48 p.m.
Tac1 said:

Should have let them go out of business. Waste of tax payer money saving a company that's in the position they're in from putting out s* products. Is there anything in their lineup without some sort of major issue going on?

I thought Ford was the one that didn't take any bailout money.

Ranger50
Ranger50 UltimaDork
9/16/19 3:54 p.m.
NOHOME said:

Well, yeah..!

 

Kind of a badge of honor for the high HP smallblock guys. About 500 hp seems to do it reliably.

 

 

 

Pete

 

 

Must be the infamous “XXX” stripper block!!! lol 

Brett_Murphy
Brett_Murphy UltimaDork
9/16/19 4:14 p.m.

Ford didn't take any bailout money because they'd saved enough cash by cutting corners with engine blocks, water pumps and DSG transmissions  that they didn't need it ... devil

 

GarageGorilla
GarageGorilla Reader
9/16/19 4:54 p.m.
alfadriver said:

The block is an emissions related item, it should be warranted to 80k miles (they are certified to 120 or 150k).  Make sure they are fully aware of that.  You can complain to the EPA if they don't replace it.

Read farther down the TSB, you'll see the same words being used.

Lol.

I thought you worked in the auto industry? Standard language in warranty guides makes the bolded statement laughably untrue.

GarageGorilla
GarageGorilla Reader
9/16/19 4:57 p.m.
alfadriver said:

No, I don't, but I do find it odd that the block isn't covered, since it's what generates the emissions in the first place.  That kind of blows.

Is this you???

GarageGorilla
GarageGorilla Reader
9/16/19 5:00 p.m.

OP, your best bet is to play nice with Corporate and see if you can get a goodwill or partial goodwill repair. I would hope that being so close to warranty, they would cover 50% or more of the cost. Be nice, polite, persistent and stress the fact that you are within 3 years and less than 10% past the mileage threshold of the driveline warranty. 

EDIT: Actually start with the dealer... politely ask the service manager for a goodwill repair. If he declines, ask for a partial goodwill, if he declines, ask to to speak to the GM or owner, if they decline, go to Big Ford and try to get a hold of a regional customer service manager. 

 

Flynlow
Flynlow HalfDork
9/16/19 5:17 p.m.
GarageGorilla said:
alfadriver said:

No, I don't, but I do find it odd that the block isn't covered, since it's what generates the emissions in the first place.  That kind of blows.

Is this you???

Not sure you care about how your messages are received, but you come across as a tool.

Just in case you want to change it. yes

_
_ HalfDork
9/16/19 5:22 p.m.

 Do you know who almost never has any problems with the main components of an engine? Nearly every Japanese company that has ever existed. 

iceracer
iceracer UltimaDork
9/16/19 5:25 p.m.

In reply to Tac1 :

Ford is the only company that used their own money , no tax payer money unlike the others.  

iceracer
iceracer UltimaDork
9/16/19 5:31 p.m.

You might mention that this puts a negative effect on any future Ford products.

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