Hard for a team to rationalize why they gave Nico instructions. Every race engineers say the same thing "sorry can't tell you" but this race the engineers clearly break the rules? I think this is more than a blunder.
I had a laugh when Alonso said that next year the Honda is going to be competing for wins...if the rules change in their favor they are probably 5 years away.
In reply to rob_lewis:
So, asking "What do I do if it gets stuck in 7th again?" was not asking for help?
racerfink wrote: In reply to rob_lewis: So, asking "What do I do if it gets stuck in 7th again?" was not asking for help?
Agreed, but I was taking it as the damage had already been done by them immediately telling him what to do. As Keith posted, apparently, that was acceptable from the FIA but the 7th gear question was not.
BTW, not trying to defend Nico, just noting that these radio rules are weird. Yes, he asked for help in the 7th gear, but that was not his original radio call. I thought when they responded with the settings that the rules were already broken. So, Nico then asking what to do was a continuation of that.
But, seems like that was acceptable, but asking about 7th was not. So, technically, the infraction was instigated by Nico. I just didn't understand it that way (and wonder if Nico did).
-Rob
In reply to rob_lewis:
Rosberg asking for help wasn't the problem; it's his engineers responding that was. They could have simply said nothing or (at least) that they couldn't offer any solution.
Maybe, the team didn't think it was violating the rule. Maybe, the team responded without thinking of consequences. Maybe, the team suspected it was in breach and just wanted to clarify what penalties would be imposed.
My thinking is that the corporate influence is such that anything less than first and second places is unacceptable. The radio rules are vague (enough) and enforced inconsistently (enough) that it was worth the risk to keep second place. Then, there is also the "forward thinking" aspect of doing nothing and having to replace a gearbox (that could have been "saved") and then getting a grid penalty at the next event.
I don't have any issues with the concept of anti-coaching radio restrictions but the implementation and enforcement seem the root cause of complaints from the grid.
trigun7469 wrote: I had a laugh when Alonso said that next year the Honda is going to be competing for wins...if the rules change in their favor they are probably 5 years away.
I heard that too. I hope for my wife's sake, he's right. She's totally written off his career.
Her favorite driver by a very wide margin. But I didn't have the heart to tell her his claim.
alfadriver wrote:trigun7469 wrote: I had a laugh when Alonso said that next year the Honda is going to be competing for wins...if the rules change in their favor they are probably 5 years away.I heard that too. I hope for my wife's sake, he's right. She's totally written off his career. Her favorite driver by a very wide margin. But I didn't have the heart to tell her his claim.
I could see Honda in the Williams/Force India zone next year, maybe even Ferrari sometimes. They have made some gains recently, but Merc is too far ahead. Good lord, they qualified a full second ahead at Silverstone, didn't they?
In reply to Streetwiseguy:
Yea, I would have figured a BIG jump this year vs. next. It's the first part of the learning curve that you learn the most. Unless it took this long to find the right people....
I hope he's right- it would be nice to see McLaren do well, again. And I hope Button stays on board, too, for the "great" next season.
I missed the race :-( Anyone know if it will be re broadcast this week?
I must say that Verstappen is rather good. I was way off the Max band wagon but after the last couple races I am starting to recognize he has some skill. More so from the in car footage of car control. But I can't shake the feeling that Redbull instantly decided to back him like they did with Vettel(in torro rosso and redbull proper).
I just don't understand why they toss guys to the side instead of trying to support them all to success. Ricciardo is great and I hope they stop screwing up his races. He is taking the fall for bad team work outside the car. Same for Sainz. He is very impressive.
All through the race I was assuming that Hamilton was in conserve engine mode from the first pitstop to the end of the race. He wasn't running away like in other years, just keeping a gap. Then Verstappen started to close and it is funny that both go off turn 1 at the same time.
dean1484 wrote: I missed the race :-( Anyone know if it will be re broadcast this week?
Hey Dean NBCSN LIVE should have a replay ready to stream at any time.
In reply to Advan046:
Do you hear Hamilton's comments when Max told him that he was closing?
"No, you weren't."
Hamilton just managed that gap once he got it. Well done, and having an engine that is less stressed is a good thing.
In reply to alfadriver:
Well with this rather large change to the cars next year, MB might be how McLaren is now. They might, just not get it right, while definitely they got it right in 2014.
We will see how it spins things. I do think if Honda sticks it out they may become the best power unit soon.
In reply to alfadriver: I am sure Button is regretting the move from Brawn (now Mercedes) to the the 4 miserable seasons with Mclaren. I am sure they will shorten the gap, I still think they are far away from a legitimate race to the podium. Button sank like a stone in Austria. I am guessing that Stoffel will get the nod, next year. Even his talent is probably not going to result any better. Lauda is a politics guy in F1, even if the rules are turned upside down, I still think they have a competitive edge.
Advan046 wrote:dean1484 wrote: I missed the race :-( Anyone know if it will be re broadcast this week?Hey Dean NBCSN LIVE should have a replay ready to stream at any time.
Just checked my NBCSports app- and the race replay does appear right now. So you can watch.
alfadriver wrote: In reply to Advan046: Do you hear Hamilton's comments when Max told him that he was closing? "No, you weren't." Hamilton just managed that gap once he got it. Well done, and having an engine that is less stressed is a good thing.
No I missed that comment. That is cool. Kind of sobers the guys up when they start to realize that as you were giving your all to catch up with Hamilton; he was actually short shifting and an lifting early for corners in a lower power mode. These MB cars are like the Audi R8's iconic/historic/amazing.
trigun7469 wrote: In reply to alfadriver: I am sure Button is regretting the move from Brawn (now Mercedes) to the the 4 miserable seasons with Mclaren. I am sure they will shorten the gap, I still think they are far away from a legitimate race to the podium. Button sank like a stone in Austria. I am guessing that Stoffel will get the nod, next year. Even his talent is probably not going to result any better.
I see that as happening- F1 is the ultimate "what have you done lately" sport. Alonso seems to have kept his ability to wring more out of a car than most drivers, though.
It's just that Jensen seems like a great guy to have around. It would be great to meet him someday.
Advan046 wrote:alfadriver wrote: In reply to Advan046: Do you hear Hamilton's comments when Max told him that he was closing? "No, you weren't." Hamilton just managed that gap once he got it. Well done, and having an engine that is less stressed is a good thing.No I missed that comment. That is cool. Kind of sobers the guys up when they start to realize that as you were giving your all to catch up with Hamilton; he was actually short shifting and an lifting early for corners in a lower power mode. These MB cars are like the Audi R8's iconic/historic/amazing.
It kind of puts Nico's wet driving more into perspective, too. Once he got clear of Max in the dry, and up to the "issue"- he did exactly what Lewis did- manage the gap. Both cars are really good on tires this year.
On the tire thing- I thought it was interesting that the entire field ignored Pirrelli's suggestion of lap limits on the medium compound....
trigun7469 wrote: In reply to alfadriver: I am sure Button is regretting the move from Brawn (now Mercedes) to the the 4 miserable seasons with Mclaren. I am sure they will shorten the gap, I still think they are far away from a legitimate race to the podium. Button sank like a stone in Austria. I am guessing that Stoffel will get the nod, next year. Even his talent is probably not going to result any better. Lauda is a politics guy in F1, even if the rules are turned upside down, I still think they have a competitive edge.
I actually think McLaren aren't bold enough to put Stoffel in the car in 2017. He should be though and if it does happen Button really only has Williams to jump to.
To your point I can't imagine the pain for Wehrlein to choose his next step. Will Manor continue to improve? Will Williams go bankrupt? Will he ever get a change at MB? Everything else seems locked up.
dean1484 wrote: I missed the race :-( Anyone know if it will be re broadcast this week?
If you have access to a UK proxy, Channel4 in the UK has their coverage available to stream. MUCH better commentary team and pre-race than NBC, and no commercial breaks in the race. There are British commercials inserted into the stream, but they were added after the live broadcast and the race picks up where it was when the commercial started.
Advan046 wrote: But I can't shake the feeling that Redbull instantly decided to back him like they did with Vettel(in torro rosso and redbull proper). I just don't understand why they toss guys to the side instead of trying to support them all to success.
There are 22 regular F1 drivers in the world. Off the top of my head, I doubt half of them get paid, so that means there are 11 paid F1 drivers in the world. If I show up there, and don't either perform or bring a multi million dollar sponsorship, I'm out the berkeleying door so fast...
Its a very harsh world up at the pointy end.
In reply to Streetwiseguy:
I guess that's my point. Putting you on a bad strategy two races (while putting your teammate on a better one) then not having tires ready for a pitstop as you are dominating the most prestigious race on the calendar. Then fire you?!?
I guess my point is they are squandering Ricciardo. He could have provided the team much more in points if they just stop messing up his races.
Silverstone for Ricciardo was just unlucky VSC timing.
Finished watching the race last night. That was very entertaining, especially Alonso rampaging around like a lunatic. He was working hard. Nico vs Verstappen was fun to watch as well.
I have watched the replays of Hamilton pulling away on the first green flag racing lap. It was rather impressive.
Rosberg is much less tolerant of tail wagging or attacking the racing lines.
Did anybody watch the Indycar Toronto GP? Sato was able to do a Nico move in Turn 8 without taking out both cars. Again the other car did cooperate, but he had the inside and turned in late missing the apex completely to retain his position. Frankly surprising that Sato didn't take anybody out.
trigun7469 wrote: Did anybody watch the Indycar Toronto GP? Sato was able to do a Nico move in Turn 8 without taking out both cars. Again the other car did cooperate, but he had the inside and turned in late missing the apex completely to retain his position. Frankly surprising that Sato didn't take anybody out.
I can't imagine how beat up all those guys are today. That track is soooo rough. Freeze Thaw cycle for the loss.
It sure seems like almost all those guys are being pretty well behaved these days. There really hasn't been a lot of crashing and shoving on the street circuits, and historically its been impossible to run one of those clean.
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