FORMULA ONE - 2020

alfadriver (Forum Supporter) said:

Lots of new rules... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJc2320jlUQ

Some sound good, some sound interesting, and it's going to take some time to absorb.

Yeesh that was a lot to digest.  I'll just state, for the record, that I think these new rules and restrictions are ridiculously convoluted.

z31maniac said:

wvumtnbkr said:

Javelin (Forum Supporter) said:

Reports of Toto Wolff leaving Mercedes!

I saw reports of him stepping down, not necessarily leaving.

 

The reports of him and lance stroll buying the team and turning it into Aston Martin are interesting.  I could see stroll beside Hamilton in 2021 or 2022 at Aston Martin (powered by mercedes).

Just on a common sense level, this makes no sense. Stroll has already purchased Racing Point to rebrand as Aston Martin for next season. So this would mean Stroll would own TWO Aston Martin-branded teams? 

I realize Red Bull effectively has two teams..........Lawrence Stroll is a Billionaire, but he isn't even in the same category as Dietrich Mateschitz. Mateschitz net worth is literally more than 10x that of Stroll.

Well, there is already a tie in with Toto Wolff as well.  He owns a bunch of shares of Aston Martin.

Weird things happen in f1.

nderwater said:

alfadriver (Forum Supporter) said:

Lots of new rules... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJc2320jlUQ

Some sound good, some sound interesting, and it's going to take some time to absorb.

Yeesh that was a lot to digest.  I'll just state, for the record, that I think these new rules and restrictions are ridiculously convoluted.

Oddly enough, the teams seemed to have agreed.  

To me, the financial part is the amaxing one.  $145M next year, and going down to near $130M in '25.  Which is less than the lowest team's current budget.  For the top teams, it's less than half.

Then the development time part.  hm...  Not sure if it will help.  Although of the top teams, given the culture we are aware of, my bet is that Mercedes will suffer the least, Ferrari the most, with Red Bull- no idea- could be ok with Newey vision, or bad with bad tempers.  

For sure, it helps Renault stomach the bill a lot better.  Especially with the engine freezes.

F1 is going to be interesting in '25.

Regarding Williams, the Formula 1 subreddit is kicking around the idea of crowdfunding to sponsor them and keep them afloat.

https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comments/gtamns/williams_2019_accounts_reveal_the_truth_about/

-Rob

Didn't one of the failing teams do that a couple of years ago? Caterham or...Marussia?

BBC reports the modified 2020 season begins with eight races, starting in Austria July 3-5.  

And there are double races - two weekends at the same track. That'll be really interesting to see how things change on the second weeks as the teams adapt to what they learned. 

I'm excited for this. Hopefully everyone stays safe and we have some good racing. Science knows I need a distraction.

Keith Tanner said:

And there are double races - two weekends at the same track. That'll be really interesting to see how things change on the second weeks as the teams adapt to what they learned. 

Did the teams vote on the reverse grid qualifying races for the second weekend yet?  I think it would be cool to see.

The qualifying races would be 1/2 hour races.  Where you finish is where you qualify for Sunday.  BUT, you start inversely to where you are in the championship for the qualifying race.

In reply to wvumtnbkr :

Mercedes voted against the reverse grid and I understand why: they had the most to lose potentially. I think the double header races at the same venue will be more exciting because the teams that do well will likely have achieved maximum results but those who didn't can correct mistakes, making for a much tighter second race. It's just a theory but I'm sticking with it

Reverse grid is a gimmick. It's an artificial way to get more passes, but it's not racing. You're punishing those who are fast. If I wanted to see that, I'd watch BoP series.

Keith Tanner said:

Reverse grid is a gimmick. It's an artificial way to get more passes, but it's not racing. You're punishing those who are fast. If I wanted to see that, I'd watch BoP series.

Given the consequences, I also see a lot more collisions as people are fighting for positions.  It's not really worth it to the top teams to pay for broken cars just to qualify.

Reverse grid is a wonderful gimmick for a short track Saturday night. Given a track with good passing zones, inverting the top half of the field might work.  Nascar has done that a couple of times, and it was mostly good.  

Lewis and Charles would feel picked on, based on theircquali skills.  Plus, quali is often the best part of the weekend...

I don't think reverse grid idea was for the actual race. I think it was for a 30 minute qualifying race that would determine pole position.

That would change some aspects of car design. Instead of building a car that works best in clear air - qualify on pole, then get out in front and stay there - teams would have to focus on the ability to pass AND be fast in clean air. People who like to see passing and crashing would probably prefer the artificial quali race more than the real race.

loosecannon said:

In reply to wvumtnbkr :

Mercedes voted against the reverse grid and I understand why: they had the most to lose potentially. I think the double header races at the same venue will be more exciting because the teams that do well will likely have achieved maximum results but those who didn't can correct mistakes, making for a much tighter second race. It's just a theory but I'm sticking with it

I would guess it would be the opposite. the top teams will improve - they always do. they will make parts over the week and be even better off and they will better utilize the data on tire wear for their team on the competition to their advantage.

the lesser teams will struggle to improve by the same margins as the top 3 and will be lapped earlier and more often. 

If they want to have fun, give all the teams the same number of each tire (super soft thru hard and inters and wets) like 2 or 3 sets of each and they have to use a different tire strategy for each qual and race.

So put the cars in parc ferme between the two weekends. That way you can only adjust setup and not bolt on new parts. Becomes a game of tuning instead of a game of modification.

Season kicks back off tomorrow FYI!

So excited - hosting a very small socially distanced F1 get together Sunday.  Bring on the noise!

Rusnak_322 said:

loosecannon said:

In reply to wvumtnbkr :

Mercedes voted against the reverse grid and I understand why: they had the most to lose potentially. I think the double header races at the same venue will be more exciting because the teams that do well will likely have achieved maximum results but those who didn't can correct mistakes, making for a much tighter second race. It's just a theory but I'm sticking with it

I would guess it would be the opposite. the top teams will improve - they always do. they will make parts over the week and be even better off and they will better utilize the data on tire wear for their team on the competition to their advantage.

the lesser teams will struggle to improve by the same margins as the top 3 and will be lapped earlier and more often. 

 

If they want to have fun, give all the teams the same number of each tire (super soft thru hard and inters and wets) like 2 or 3 sets of each and they have to use a different tire strategy for each qual and race.

I doubt they'd be able to make any meaningful change in parts from Sunday to Thursday, once you include analysis, new design, machining it, and shipping to Austria.

That's why during a "normal" season, you typically don't start seeing upgrades until Barcelona.......or usually the 5-6th race of the season.

Reverse-grid is a gimmick punishing fast drivers? True, but so does DRS. I don't like any of crap. 

Kind of pumped for this weekend of racing! Sweat-fest in Indy, Daytona, then Austria....

JimS said:

Reverse-grid is a gimmick punishing fast drivers? True, but so does DRS. I don't like any of crap. 

I've never been a fan of DRS or requiring the teams to use anything other than the optimal tire choice. I know why these rules exist, but they're bandaids. Maybe once they figure out how to get rid of the dirty air problem we can lose DRS.

Just a few hours from now, practice starts.  I'm so excited to have F1 back!!  Really curious to to see how the drivers and teams are on the first few laps.  Plus, MB still has the DAS system.  Dying to know how much (if any) advantage it'll have.

-Rob

The short season could bring some surprises. One or two bad races and the whole championship would look different with very little chance to claw back. If someone comes hard out of the gate, we may have some racin'.