Login Register Sign up for the GRM e-newsletter

Login to post Forums » Grassroots Motorsports » I almost killed myself
  • AutoXR

    Dec. 31, 2011 3:43 p.m. AutoXR Reader

    I am trying to figure out how I did this.

    I was using off the shelf furniture stripper to strip the paint off the floor of my challenge car. This is in my 500 sq ft garage. Being winter in Canada it's not warm. I have a 125k BTU propane heater. I have a C02 detector in the garage and rarely work in there when the heater is running and it's never set off the detector (detector works fine).

    Well... Paint stripper + Propane heater = disaster. I started coughing badly after 2 min. Another min later I puked on my lawn.

    Initially I thought it was my asthma as I have 1 really bad lung with little to no capacity. An hr passes and a friend comes over and we putter away. Again I put a bit of stripper on the floor.. walk over to the bench and turn on the heater..

    This time it happens even quicker. We run outside and open up the doors.

    Decided to work in the cold and just deal with it.

    Any ideas as to what chemical I made?

  • Twin_Cam

    Dec. 31, 2011 3:44 p.m. Twin_Cam SuperDork

    Not sure, but it sounds like when you heat paint stripper it does not nice things to you. Maybe you should wait until spring to do that, when you can open some doors.

  • benzbaron

    Dec. 31, 2011 3:49 p.m. benzbaron Dork

    You didn't make any chemicals, the solvent in the stripper was evaporated by the heater. There wasn't enough ventilation and you were overcome by the fumes. The fact you have a breathing problem probably influenced the severity of the reaction. On the bottle there is probably a mention of using the chemical in a well ventilated area or to use proper safety gear. You should have had ventilation and/or proper fume mask. I'd invest in a fume mask and take this as a lesson learned.

  • Dec. 31, 2011 4:06 p.m. 93gsxturbo HalfDork

    Brake cleaner and propane heaters do it to me. I don't like garage heaters. My attached garage is fully insulated and doesnt freeze, some insulated Carhartt bibs and a hooded sweatshirt are great!

    And yes, real Carhartt. The Walls stuff is for chumps.

  • SVreX

    Dec. 31, 2011 4:18 p.m. SVreX SuperDork

    I'm glad you are OK.

    Now, I'm gonna chew you out.

    Many paint strippers contain dichloromethane (methylene chloride). The fumes of this can be metabolized to carbon monoxide in the liver.

    Your unvented propane heater is also giving off carbon monoxide, as well as consuming oxygen.

    Carbon monoxide decreases the oxygen content of blood.

    Since you already have lung issues which leave you oxygen challenged, what you did was really stupid, and yes, you could have died. Easily.

    The labels on BOTH the paint stripper AND the propane heater BOTH SAY USE ONLY IN A WELL VENTILATED AREA. Additionally, the paint stripper says to not use near open flame.

    You violated all of these guidelines, as well as making yourself a prime candidate for a Darwin award by NOT READING THE DIRECTIONS.

    Thankfully, you survived. This round.

    Now, get rid of the damned unvented heater, NEVER use stripper in unventilated areas, and READ THE INSTRUCCIONS BEFORE USE.

    Sorry to be harsh. That was stupid. Glad you're OK.

  • erohslc

    Dec. 31, 2011 4:50 p.m. erohslc HalfDork

    The methylene chloride vapor in the air was being ingested by your propane heater and burned, creating god knows what.
    I looked at MSDS, ATSDR, and Osha sites, no one talked about what happens when it's burned, only about vapor exposure.
    Best case is that it oxidized into simple CO gas, worse case, one of the nastier chlorine containing gases, hopefully not similar to Freon oxidation (i.e. Phosgene gas).

    (Glad you are OK)

    Edit: Found this site:

    http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1959RSPSA.250..197H

    which says that it oxidizes into CO and HCl (Hydrochloric Acid !!!!)

    So yes, breathing HCl vapor might irritate the lungs.

  • Trans_Maro

    Dec. 31, 2011 5:12 p.m. Trans_Maro Dork

    93gsxturbo wrote:

    Brake cleaner and propane heaters do it to me.

    That's because you're making phosgene gas!!!

    Holy crap, google it if you don't know what it is.

    Shawn

  • dean1484

    Dec. 31, 2011 5:13 p.m. dean1484 SuperDork

    As noted above you were dumb and maybe very very lucky!!! You know that now and I don't think piling on will help anything.

    I strongly recommend that you give your doctor a call and explain what happened. Especially considering your pre existing lung condition.

  • JoeyM

    Dec. 31, 2011 5:49 p.m. JoeyM SuperDork

    erohslc wrote:

    The methylene chloride vapor in the air was being ingested by your propane heater and burned, creating god knows what.
    I looked at MSDS, ATSDR, and Osha sites, no one talked about what happens when it's burned, only about vapor exposure.
    Best case is that it oxidized into simple CO gas, worse case, one of the nastier chlorine containing gases, hopefully not similar to Freon oxidation (i.e. Phosgene gas).

    (Glad you are OK)

    Edit: Found this site:

    http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1959RSPSA.250..197H

    which says that it oxidizes into CO and HCl (Hydrochloric Acid !!!!)

    So yes, breathing HCl vapor might irritate the lungs.

    acid fumes are nasty

  • rotard

    Dec. 31, 2011 11:18 p.m. rotard HalfDork

    Are you trying to win a Darwin Award?

  • DoctorBlade

    Dec. 31, 2011 11:54 p.m. DoctorBlade Dork

    I've done the Hydrochloric Acid fumes accident. Wasn't fun.

  • SVreX

    Jan. 1, 2012 12:08 a.m. SVreX SuperDork

    The initial fail qualified for the Darwin award.

    Trying it again (with a friend)...priceless.

  • rotard

    Jan. 1, 2012 12:29 a.m. rotard HalfDork

    SVreX wrote:

    The initial fail qualified for the Darwin award.

    Trying it again (with a friend)...priceless.

    Seriously. What's next, drinking coolant because it smells sweet?

  • SkinnyG

    Jan. 1, 2012 1:24 a.m. SkinnyG HalfDork

    rotard wrote:

    Seriously. What's next, drinking coolant because it smells sweet?

    Naw, we do an "identify the leak - taste test" in my mechanics class. They're putting a "bitter" agent in coolant now. So sad...

    (just kidding)

    (well, mostly kidding)

  • Curmudgeon

    Jan. 1, 2012 8:45 a.m. Curmudgeon SuperDork

    Wow. Glad you are OK. But like SVreX says, if you have to, wait till spring. Dead guys don't win Challenges.

  • J308

    Jan. 1, 2012 10:13 a.m. J308 New Reader

    Rookie move.

    Everyone knows you're supposed to let the garage fill up with fumes before igniting the heater.

    You've all seen this, but link anyway.

    Naw, seriously, don't do that. And don't operate the heater in a closed garage.

  • alex

    Jan. 1, 2012 12:50 p.m. alex SuperDork

    I repost this link a lot, but everybody needs to re-read this article a few times a year to remind themselves not to screw around with chemicals. Myself included.

    Common cleaners can turn into poisonous gas

    Don't forget that ours is a dangerous hobby - your biggest risk is not just busting a knuckle.

    Be careful, guys.

  • dlmater

    Jan. 1, 2012 4:02 p.m. dlmater Reader

    For indoor paint stripping, try Citristrip. It does not contain Methylene Chloride and can be used indoors. I used it to strip a car and it worked OK, not great. It did the job but took longer and required more elbow grease. But it was useful because I wanted to strip paint in the garage during the winter. I found it at my local Home Depot store.

  • rotard

    Jan. 1, 2012 4:23 p.m. rotard HalfDork

    dlmater wrote:

    For indoor paint stripping, try Citristrip. It does not contain Methylene Chloride and can be used indoors. I used it to strip a car and it worked OK, not great. It did the job but took longer and required more elbow grease. But it was useful because I wanted to strip paint in the garage during the winter. I found it at my local Home Depot store.

    As a general rule, it's a bad idea to breath in the fumes coming off of ANY solvent.

  • erohslc

    Jan. 1, 2012 5:05 p.m. erohslc HalfDork

    Difference with Citristrip, it uses Citrus Oil (byproduct of making OJ), which is not an aromatic solvent, so no fumes.
    Also commonly used in hand cleaners, 'Goof-Off' label and glue remover, etc.
    Works by direct contact of the oil to the item to be err, ... softened.

    Also, smells Orangy-fresh!

  • Gearheadotaku

    Jan. 2, 2012 8:50 a.m. Gearheadotaku SuperDork

    Trans_Maro wrote:

    93gsxturbo wrote:

    Brake cleaner and propane heaters do it to me.

    That's because you're making phosgene gas!!!

    Holy crap, google it if you don't know what it is.

    Shawn

    I read about welding when there was brakeclean on the part was bad, but didn't know that a heater would get hot enough to make the phosgene gas, just burn the fumes.

    I thought it smelled funny...

  • rotard

    Jan. 2, 2012 9:28 a.m. rotard HalfDork

    erohslc wrote:

    Difference with Citristrip, it uses Citrus Oil (byproduct of making OJ), which is not an aromatic solvent, so no fumes.
    Also commonly used in hand cleaners, 'Goof-Off' label and glue remover, etc.
    Works by direct contact of the oil to the item to be err, ... softened.

    Also, smells Orangy-fresh!

    We have people here that expose themselves and others to poisonous gases. We're trying to use broad sweeping generalizations in the name of safety.

 
Tire Rack- Revolutionizing Tire Buying

You'll need to log in to post.