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Lof8
Lof8 Dork
8/28/18 9:00 a.m.

330 hp really is pretty sufficient for my needs. I'm not after huge hp on this thing.  I just want it to be reliable for track days.

dclafleur
dclafleur New Reader
8/28/18 10:43 a.m.

Skip the trunions they aren't worth it for where you're at and the stock units are pretty good.  The people saying the cylinder walls are thin are right in that you can't really bore it out if there's a failure but even at 190k if the compression is good there's no worry.  I'd be more worried about bearings but if you aren't taking apart the motor I say change out valve springs, seals, retainers and locks and run with it. I wouldn't bother with an LS6 cam, it just isn't enough of a gain to be worth it. I'd focus more on oil control (pan baffles and oil pump) and crankcase breathing.  

Cams are cheap and easy to swap on these you can spend almost as much on pushrods and spring kits to support the cam as the cam itself.  

Patrick
Patrick MegaDork
8/28/18 11:00 a.m.

I have no doubt at 190k it’s still probably in really good shape inside.  Modern materials, oils, and especially fuel injection are wonderful things and help longevity.  The 6.0 van that’s the donor for andy neuman’s rx7 swap has 311k and my 5.3 donor for the challenge datsun had 428k and i sprayed much nitrous at it.  

But i also believe in leaving well enough alone.  You have a proven commodity, you know in ws6 form it’s about 330hp.  Why cam swap when you’re already at the “good enough for me” level?  It’ll also require tuning time to take advantage of.  It’s one thing to use hptuners to turn off emissions stuff and vats and calibrate the speedo, it’s a whole new ballgame tuning for real changes.  

I’m usually good at spending other people’s money and I love when people support Summit Racing because they are my local speed shop, but in this case there isn’t a single item on your list that i would buy if in your situation, even knowing it’s not about challenge budget constraints.  

Lof8
Lof8 Dork
8/28/18 11:41 a.m.

I appreciate that advice and those examples!  I’m going to thin down the list, but I think I’m still going to do the oil baffle and pump.  Maybe water pump too. You don’t think I should worry about a timing chain at that mileage?

Curtis
Curtis UltimaDork
8/28/18 11:45 a.m.

Agreed.  Stock power levels will move that car well.  I might suggest a tuner (or a tune from someone).  There is a wee bit of power to be had by pushing the timing ahead a couple degrees and leaning out the fuel a tad... maybe 15 hp or so.  You'll likely have to jump to premium fuel to maximize the benefits, otherwise the knock sensors will just pull that timing back out.

Otherwise, there is no challenge-friendly easy bolt-on for making a big amount of power increase.  They're pretty well matched.  An LS6 intake will give you 10 or so, the cam maybe 25, headers maybe 10, but those are budget-killers for little gain.

Curtis
Curtis UltimaDork
8/28/18 11:48 a.m.
Lof8 said:

 You don’t think I should worry about a timing chain at that mileage?

As long as you have the water pump off (and as long as the engine is out of the car) it can't hurt.  Other than the balancer being a royal pain to R&R.

TheV8Kid
TheV8Kid HalfDork
8/28/18 11:55 a.m.

I would recommend staying with a stock oil pump assuming it is good. The high volume pumps have a tendency to suck the pan dry. We use the stock pump on our turbo cars and it is more than up to the task.

Also, I'll say it again, the oil pan baffle is a must, if you want to do any kind of racing.

Patrick
Patrick MegaDork
8/28/18 11:58 a.m.
Curtis said:
Lof8 said:

 You don’t think I should worry about a timing chain at that mileage?

As long as you have the water pump off (and as long as the engine is out of the car) it can't hurt.  Other than the balancer being a royal pain to R&R.

It’s a 5 minute job with the correct puller and installer.  I gave in and bought the LS specific tools and should have done so years ago.  Unless you’re in a vette chassis where the steering rack is in the way then it sucks big time

TheV8Kid
TheV8Kid HalfDork
8/28/18 12:00 p.m.
Patrick said:
Curtis said:
Lof8 said:

 You don’t think I should worry about a timing chain at that mileage?

As long as you have the water pump off (and as long as the engine is out of the car) it can't hurt.  Other than the balancer being a royal pain to R&R.

It’s a 5 minute job with the correct puller and installer.  I gave in and bought the LS specific tools and should have done so years ago.  Unless you’re in a vette chassis where the steering rack is in the way then it sucks big time

This^ 

The LS specific tool is worth every penny!

pres589
pres589 PowerDork
8/28/18 12:03 p.m.

Rev limit to reduce need to change parts?  Does that help?

Lof8
Lof8 Dork
8/28/18 12:48 p.m.

Well you guys are saving me much time and money! :)  I'm going to leave the balancer, water, and oil pumps alone.  Going to do an oil pan baffle, rear main seal, and some plugs/wires.

Lof8
Lof8 Dork
8/28/18 5:23 p.m.

Anyone have any good tips/tricks/kit suggestions for deleting the emissions/egr plumbing stuff?

Furious_E
Furious_E SuperDork
8/28/18 8:22 p.m.

In reply to Lof8 :

There's not much to it, just trace the lines and pull the stuff out. You need a block off plate for where the EGR routes to the intake manifold, right behind the throttle body, which are cheap on Summit Racing or eBay. Plug the ports in the manifolds too, if you're keeping the stockers. There might be a vacuum port or two somewhere that needs to be capped as well. For evap, I just left the purge solenoid in place and capped the nipple.

Lof8
Lof8 Dork
8/28/18 8:45 p.m.

In reply to Furious_E :

Exactly the tips I was looking for. Thanks

Lof8
Lof8 Dork
8/29/18 11:56 a.m.

Another question - clean red Dexcool was drained from this engine. Should I put Dexcool back in, or flush it and use something else?

Lof8
Lof8 Dork
9/2/18 12:34 p.m.

Any thoughts on the dexcool situation?  Google searches generally suggest Dexcool is fine in this engine when not accidentally mixed with anything else. But I trust the opinions here more. 

Patrick
Patrick MegaDork
9/2/18 1:05 p.m.

I haven’t had issue with dexcool and just replace it with more.  

Also on the egr you don’t need a fancy aluminum plug, i measure the hole in the intake and use a rubber expansion plug at tractor supply for a few dollars.  I’m not home until Wednesday to know what size it is.  I have them on 2 engines right now, one has been there for 7 years with no issues.

pres589
pres589 PowerDork
9/2/18 2:40 p.m.

The engine will be out of the car? I would flush with a garden hose as much as possible then move to common green coolant. 

Lof8
Lof8 Dork
9/2/18 2:43 p.m.

Engine is out of the car

Curtis
Curtis UltimaDork
9/2/18 3:04 p.m.

Dexcool is fine until it isn't, and it's not the most stable stuff.  Fantastic new, but doesn't stay new long if there is anything out of the ordinary.  Don't let it get low and don't expect water pumps to last as long if you use dexcool.  Cavitation/aeration will cause major issues, as can silicone gaskets.  Dexcool is a house of cards.  Beautiful and stable until you take out one card and then it all falls apart.  It's not quite that apocalyptic, I just got tired of it after 3 heater cores under warranty, sudden loss of heater function (usually in February), and flushing once a year to get the orange jello out of everything.  The Caprice/ImpalaSS of those years had a particular confluence of factors that made them an awful combination for Dexcool, hence my hatred for it.

I switched all of my dexcool cars to old-school green and I haven't had any issues.  Last time I checked, there were over 700 class-action lawsuits about dexcool, and GM has sued Havoline about a dozen times over it.  I don't think Prestone has had a single class-action lawsuit brought against it in its 70 years of making their old-school green stuff.  Works for me.

Lof8
Lof8 Dork
9/2/18 3:15 p.m.

I think I’ll flush and go green. 

Patrick
Patrick MegaDork
9/2/18 3:15 p.m.

To qualify my previous statement, if out of car flush clean and replace with green.  I assumed you were still in the trans am

Lof8
Lof8 Dork
9/2/18 3:25 p.m.
Patrick said:

To qualify my previous statement, if out of car flush clean and replace with green.  I assumed you were still in the trans am

10-4. (With the change in Challenge format this year, I decided to proceed with engine extraction ahead of schedule)

Lof8
Lof8 Dork
9/5/18 6:04 p.m.

More newbie questions:

 

whats this vacuum hose/system out of the side of the manifold?  Can I remove and cap it?

Lof8
Lof8 Dork
9/5/18 6:06 p.m.

Whats this hose out of the back of the manifold?  Ok to remove?

 

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