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Login to post Forums » Grassroots Motorsports » Mazda3 vs. Focus vs. Honda

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Nov. 9, 2009 11:01 a.m. twolittlebroncos None

Sorry if this is an inappropriate post, but every time I google search a car that I'm interested in I seem to land at this forum and I like the information that comes up here. I'm looking for a new (to me) commuter on a shoestring budget. Input appreciated.

Assumptions:

1) Price range: $3,000 - 6,000 2) Commute: 55-65 mph interstate 50 miles per day 3) Will see snow/ice off and on for 4-5 months every year 4) Prefer hatchback and prefer 4-5 doors due to kids, but could settle with 3-door hatchback 5) Other than oil changes and brakes assume all maintenance and repair will be done at a shop. 6) A/C, heater, manual transmission and cruise control are mandatory. 7) safe as possible 8) could see occasional autocross duty 9) will be replacing a 16v mk2 Jetta - would like something equally as fun

Here's my shortlist:

1) High mileage mazda3 - found one loaded with xenons and everything with 130,000 for $6000. Are the miles too high?

2) 2.3L Focus. I have found a 2004 ZX3 5-speed with 50,000 miles and some cosmetic issues for $4,500.

3) Any ole civic

4) '99 - '02 Accord 4cyl 5-speed with a bajillion miles on it.

Welcome to any other suggestions. I really like the idea of the mazda, but I haven't driven it yet. Should I be more scared of the miles?

I wish they made a 2.3 SVT 5-door Focus with the european appearace package - and that I could get one for $5k.
Nov. 9, 2009 11:08 a.m. Matt B New Reader

130K doesn't scare me. You just have to get it checked out a little more thoroughly. I'd opt for the at least a compression test and possibly a leak-down during the pre-purchase inspection. Mazda 3's aren't terribly fast, but handle pretty good bone stock. I've had fun driving my brother in-law's.
Nov. 9, 2009 11:09 a.m. nocones Reader

I'd check out the Pontiac Vibe also. I've seen them with 80-100K in the 5-6g range. They don't have all the power (unless you get a GT) but handle well and get great gas mileage (I'm getting ~34mpg in mine). The cargo handling of them is amazing and maintenance wise, they should be very cheap to maintain. Recomended service is only oil change and plugs/wires every 80K.
Nov. 9, 2009 11:15 a.m. 96DXCivic HalfDork

I have to throw in some Civic love. I think it is best choice. I enjoy driving mine more then the Mazda 3 or Accord. And I average 36 highway with a max of 41 once. And they run forever and are very easy to maintain.
Nov. 9, 2009 11:23 a.m. twolittlebroncos New Reader

In reply to 96DXCivic:

If there was a 4-door hatch civic I'd be all over it. Also angers me that everyone sells them at a premium over book value - at least around here.
Nov. 9, 2009 11:51 a.m. jrw1621 Dork

Other suggestions:
Nissan Sentra SE-R with 2.5L and 6 speed.
Not the best MPG but no worse than your 16v VW.

Infiniti G20 with 2.0L and a 5 speed.

Not perfect on your hatchback suggestion but both are 4 doors not 2.

If a 2 door hatch is acceptable then my recommendation would be the best Celica that you can afford.
Nov. 9, 2009 11:58 a.m. Shaun Reader

Mazda protege 5?
Nov. 9, 2009 11:59 a.m. coll9947 New Reader

I've owned three Civics, and they have been great cars. Never had a single reliability issue over about 200,000 combined miles between the three of them. I just stuck to the maintenance schedule in the manual and always made sure they were thoroughly inspected before purchase. Regularly got 35+ mpg in mixed driving in my '00 LX sedan, even with 120K on the odo.

That being said, the Mazda3 is a lot of car for the money. I drove them every day while working as a lot attendant for a dealership. While I can't speak to their reliability (although I'm guessing they're just fine with regular maintenance), I can tell you that they're a lot of fun with a great set of standard features.

For your stated budget I would also check out the final generation Mazda Protege. Lots of fun to drive, and the '01-'03 interior was put together much better than the interior in my '00 Civic. My brother, my close friend, and my ex-girlfriend all had '01-'03 Proteges and they loved them and never had any issues. Plus you can get the Protege in wagon form.
Nov. 9, 2009 12:38 p.m. twolittlebroncos New Reader

Thanks for the input. Good feedback, as expected.

A quick review of craigslist didn't yield any good matches for Vibe, Matrix or Protege5 (I live in a smaller city - selection is pretty limited locally). I will keep those cars in mind as I continue the search.

I think I'm leaning toward the 3. I'm really enticed by the factory xenon lights, 5-doors and side-curtain airbags. That's what happens when you commute in a 1990 Jetta.
Nov. 9, 2009 1:28 p.m. 2002maniac Reader

I think the Duratec focus would be an awesome car.
Nov. 9, 2009 2:21 p.m. skruffy Dork

I loved my 03 protege 5 and never really had any problems with it up to 80k when I traded it in for my 06 Gti. You could pick up a really nice one for around $4k probably, and a high mileage one for much less. I was just bored with mine and wanted more power, and it made more sense to buy a faster car than spend $5k on a turbo kit to make 200hp.
Nov. 9, 2009 8:12 p.m. forzav12 New Reader

Focus. A ZX3 with a little over a third of the miles as the Mazda? Sheesh-no brainer. ZX3 is a great platform, easily modded, practical and durable.
Nov. 9, 2009 8:48 p.m. alex Dork

For the record, my '00 Focus ZX3 hasn't had a hiccup in 150k miles, with little more than basic maintenance. And I still haven't done the damn timing belt...

Recommended. If mine had a manual, I wouldn't even think about another commuter-type car (after putting on the SVT suspension, that is, which should be #1 on your list of mods).
Nov. 9, 2009 8:51 p.m. JetMech Reader

Matt B wrote:

130K doesn't scare me. You just have to get it checked out a little more thoroughly. Mazda 3's aren't terribly fast, but handle pretty good bone stock.

Me, either. Mileage is an indicator of how far the vehicle has traveled, not how it was maintained. Though my 1992 Toyota pickup had the highest mileage of any Toyota truck I looked at before buying it (365,000+, and I put another 10,000+ on it before it was totaled), it was in the best shape.

Right after it was totaled, I rented a Mazda 3. It hauled ass, but swilled gasoline (though I did, admittedly, lead-foot it).
Nov. 9, 2009 8:57 p.m. alex Dork

Good point. I can't speak to the others, but I cannot get less than 29 mpg in my Focus, no matter how hard I try. Usually closer to 31 on the highway.
Nov. 9, 2009 9:08 p.m. Hal HalfDork

2002maniac wrote:

I think the Duratec focus would be an awesome car.

Agree. The 2.3 Duratec is considered by many to be a better engine than the SVT Zetec. Most of the people racing in Spec Focus are using the 2.3 and in Rally Spec Focus the 2.3 is not allowed becasue it has such a big torque advantage.

Add to that the fact that the 2.3 was only available in the hatchback in about 5 states in 2003 and as an option in all states in 2004. Which make it a fairly rare engine especially when combined with the 5 speed.
Nov. 9, 2009 9:24 p.m. BAMF Reader

Weird that the 3 is so cheap. For grins I priced my base model hatch '07 on KBB. Retail for one with my options and mileage (30k) is $16k, a grand less than I paid for it brand new. A private party deal would be just above $14k, which still isn't terribly bad for over 2½ years of driving it.

I'd normally advocate for the Mazda because I love mine, but some of the other cars sound like potentially good deals too.

The Mazda will absolutely do all of those things. On winter tires, it's pretty capable in the snow. On stock tires, it's hopeless.
Nov. 9, 2009 9:24 p.m. JohnW Reader

Both are reliable, but the Mazda 3 is a much better car than the 00-05 Civic.

I like Focuses a lot, but wonder about the quality, especially on the early cars. Prices haven't fallen as much as I think they should have yet.
Nov. 9, 2009 9:39 p.m. Shaun Reader

I did not know there was a mazdaspeed protege with a turbo, limited slip, bigger brakes, and a "sparco interior": 6k with a little warranty action to boot, damn.

http://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/ctd/1458929008.html
Nov. 9, 2009 10:55 p.m. junkbuggie New Reader

I have a 03 zx3 and it has been a great car 180k it only had one problem a bad 2-3 shift selnoid. I beat the car like a red headed stepchild. drove it a all over
Nov. 10, 2009 9:14 a.m. twolittlebroncos New Reader

I drove the 3 last night. It's much nicer than the Focus. Night and day difference between the two. They share the same motor, but that's where the similarities end. I was smitten by the steering wheel, shifter, xenons and the car even feels faster than the Focus. It tugged my heart strings like the Focus never could.

I'm on a very tight budget and the worst thing that could happen would be a large repair bill in the short term. I'm fairly competent mechanically, but the purpose of this transaction is to get a car that doesn't need tinkering like my VW.

The $5,000 question is, can I wring 250k miles out of this thing without major repairs or rebuilds? The owner has all service records and there have been no major repairs. It had an oxygen sensor fail and it has had one set of brake pads. There is some body damage, but nothing too scary.

Please talk me out of it, my wallet and wife will thank you.
Nov. 10, 2009 9:34 a.m. Kia_racer Reader

Kia Spectra 5

I have 166K on my Sephia and the only thing that has gone bad are the plug wires twice and the alt went out. otherwise great car. Not the fastest but a good DD and tossable.
Nov. 10, 2009 10:00 a.m. Gearheadotaku Reader

Saturn SL2 or SW2. Ion quad coupe lvl 3
Nov. 10, 2009 10:20 a.m. Buzz Killington Reader

twolittlebroncos wrote:

I drove the 3 last night. It's much nicer than the Focus. Night and day difference between the two. They share the same motor, but that's where the similarities end. I was smitten by the steering wheel, shifter, xenons and the car even feels faster than the Focus. It tugged my heart strings like the Focus never could.

I'm on a very tight budget and the worst thing that could happen would be a large repair bill in the short term. I'm fairly competent mechanically, but the purpose of this transaction is to get a car that doesn't need tinkering like my VW.

The $5,000 question is, can I wring 250k miles out of this thing without major repairs or rebuilds? The owner has all service records and there have been no major repairs. It had an oxygen sensor fail and it has had one set of brake pads. There is some body damage, but nothing too scary.

Please talk me out of it, my wallet and wife will thank you.

can't help you there. all of my mazdas have been trouble-free, including my '90 Protege that was running like a clock when i sold it at 215,000 miles (i seriously considered buying it back a few years later), and my '91 Miata that is still tearing up autoX courses at 245,000 miles.

(actually, i just had my first problem w/ my RX-8. the engine flooded this weekend and won't start; this makes it the least reliable mazda i've ever had.)

while there are no guarantees with any car (new or used), the fact that the car has been well-maintained and has reocrds is about as well as you're going to do w/ a used car. if you treat it right, there is no reason the car won't make it as far as you need it to.

bottom line is that if you're going to be putting out your hard-earned money for a car, it might as well be one that you like.
Nov. 10, 2009 1:05 p.m. Shaun Reader

I think 250k on top of the 130k (if this is the car you mentioned in your first post) is asking allot. Most of the durable make and model modern cars if they are well cared for and not abused are making it to 250k with out touching the innards of the engine or tranny if what I read on the interweb can be trusted (.....). It is the axillary stuff and all the little motors, solenoids, sensors and switches that give the headaches. The fewer of those the more enjoyable the maintenance experience. At any rate, I think 360k is beyond knowing with any reasonable confidence, but IMHO 250k is likely with a good make/model well cared for.

twolittlebroncos wrote:

I drove the 3 last night. It's much nicer than the Focus. Night and day difference between the two. They share the same motor, but that's where the similarities end. I was smitten by the steering wheel, shifter, xenons and the car even feels faster than the Focus. It tugged my heart strings like the Focus never could.

I'm on a very tight budget and the worst thing that could happen would be a large repair bill in the short term. I'm fairly competent mechanically, but the purpose of this transaction is to get a car that doesn't need tinkering like my VW.

The $5,000 question is, can I wring 250k miles out of this thing without major repairs or rebuilds? The owner has all service records and there have been no major repairs. It had an oxygen sensor fail and it has had one set of brake pads. There is some body damage, but nothing too scary.

Please talk me out of it, my wallet and wife will thank you.

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