Guys, I'm thinking about getting a Cobb AP for my Mazdaspeed3. I'm curious what the benefits and drawbacks are. I know it up the available horsepower. Are there any detrimental affects after being in use for 30k miles?
Any good spots to get a used one?
I have a Cobb Accessport for my '07 MS3 and it's a great device. I like that Cobb has premade maps so if you don't know how to tune EFI, you can still get a decent tune and not blow up your engine. It also has non-performance maps like a fuel-economy map, a valet mode map, and an anti-theft map. You can also scan OBDII codes and clear them, suppress certain OBDII codes, get engine parameters from the ECU, and pull your stock ECU data for a baseline.
The only issues I have are with the price, that it does not come with a mounting option (I bought a universal cell phone holder that clips onto the vents), that it only displays one engine parameter at a time (i.e. you can look at knock retard or water temp., but not both at the same time), and the USB cable sometimes gets in the way. The best place to look for a used one would be a Mazdaspeed3-specific forum, but you may need to be up to a certain post count to make an offer. Here's a few I know of:
http://www.mazda3forums.com (I'm on this one)
http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/
http://www.mazdas247.com/
Getting a used one will save you a few bucks an an Accessport, but really not that much. You have to be very careful that the Accessport has been "unmarried " from the original vehicle. As long as you stay with a reasonably conservative map your car will not die from your tune but from you hooning the beejeezus out of it.
The off the shelf tunes that are available from Cobb are ok for what they are. They are produced for a generic model year of a vehicle but as we have all learned two of the same car can each have their own quirks so some tweaks can have some solid returns. But beware that you will have a large amount of reading ahead of you if you want to roll your own ROM.
You should check out the video on this exact subject on this website.......
I just sold my Subaru Cobb AP because I wasn't terribly impressed with it. Yes it freed up power but I can get a better personalized opensource tune for 1/3 of the money.
The Video he's refering to can be found here.
Thanks for the tips guys. Anyone blow the turbo seals in a stock turbo pushing them with this equipment? I just had my turbo replaced under warranty so am wondering if this would make it blow seals faster. I can't help but think I'll have to replace the turbo again at 100k.
You can blow darn near anything with a ROM that is a bad fit for your car. I could create a ROM that would crank up the boost, crank up the timing, and lean out the fuel which would leave me with a blown engine and turbo in seconds. In the end Its not the AP that will blow your turbo it will be you making bad choices about what you do with your AP. A good ROM can give you more power, better MPG, and a marginally longer life for your engine. I still think that a good ROM is hands down the best return for your performance dollar for a TURBO Mazda/Subaru/ Mitsubishi/BMW/whatever.
In the interest of full disclosure I no longer own a Mazda, but I do own a Saabaru. I now prefer ROM Raider and a laptop over AP for Subarus but the principals are the same. Heck if I had a Mazda or a BMW I would get the AP and the Cobb tuning software in a heartbeat.
Ojala wrote:You can blow darn near anything with a ROM that is a bad fit for your car. I could create a ROM that would crank up the boost, crank up the timing, and lean out the fuel which would leave me with a blown engine and turbo in seconds. In the end Its not the AP that will blow your turbo it will be you making bad choices about what you do with your AP. A good ROM can give you more power, better MPG, and a marginally longer life for your engine. I still think that a good ROM is hands down the best return for your performance dollar for a TURBO Mazda/Subaru/ Mitsubishi/BMW/whatever.
In the interest of full disclosure I no longer own a Mazda, but I do own a Saabaru. I now prefer ROM Raider and a laptop over AP for Subarus but the principals are the same. Heck if I had a Mazda or a BMW I would get the AP and the Cobb tuning software in a heartbeat.
Just not all at the same time. Just sayin.
Thanks guys. I'm familiar with turbo tuning as I tuned my turbo Miata's Megasquirt. I'm just not as familiar with Speed3's or the Cobb AP's.
My goal with the AP wouldn't be astronomical boost levels. Just taking more advantage of my AEM intake and eliminating the boost cut from the factory.
I can handle torque steer and traction issues. 
what year is your mazdaspeed? i think cobb has just introduced their accessport for the 2nd gen MS3, which apparently uses very different tuning methods than the previous generation. the first gens used a load-based tune which adjusted boost, timing, fuel cut and boost cut based on calculated load, which it figured from a few other sensors. its definitely not a "just add a bit more fuel here, and turn up the boost there...and we're done" but once you know what affects what, its not too difficult to make it do what you want.
Yep, the ones for the 2010 are based on boost targets instead of load targets IIRC.
I'd get one for my 2010, but just can't get over all the fuel psi drops once you start tuning one. Looks like you can't even completely get everything out of the stock turbo/intake/exhaust because the high pressure fuel pump can't keep up.
In reply to z31maniac:
the upgraded pump internals aren't that difficult to do, just a little hard on the nerves thinking you might booger up something in the motor.
Just not all at the same time. Just sayin.
I can only speak for a specific case with Subarus in regards to engine durability. My main issue with the stock Subaru is the CL/OL transition delay. Just from my own experience the delay caused my motor to be leaner than I like at max throttle opening which can lead to knock. As far as power and mpg I prefer to emphasize power, but I did increase timing at part throttle/low load so that does help mpg as long as I keep my foot off.
Strizzo wrote:In reply to z31maniac:
the upgraded pump internals aren't that difficult to do, just a little hard on the nerves thinking you might booger up something in the motor.
That's basically what's stopped me, I have no desire to screw up the 5yr/60k powertrain warranty. And while I love the car (~9k miles currently) I suspect it will be gone before the warranty period, so it just seems like a waste of money and a good way to cause myself unneeded problems.
I'm planning on using this for a 2007 MS3. Sounds like I'm safe from the complications you guys were talking about.
07-09 MS3s still suffer from an insufficent high-pressure fuel pump. The reason the car stops making power above 5500rpm-ish is because the HPFP is somewhat overtaxed. I also found some open source software for the MS3 that DaveEstey mentioned:
http://www.epifansoft.com/phpBB3/new-mazdaedit-tool-t432.html
I have no experience with this software, but it seems more powerful and less n00b-friendly than the Cobb AP, for what it's worth.
Ojala wrote:Just not all at the same time. Just sayin.
I can only speak for a specific case with Subarus in regards to engine durability. My main issue with the stock Subaru is the CL/OL transition delay. Just from my own experience the delay caused my motor to be leaner than I like at max throttle opening which can lead to knock. As far as power and mpg I prefer to emphasize power, but I did increase timing at part throttle/low load so that does help mpg as long as I keep my foot off.
If subaru's lean out at WOT, then there's a problem.
But most cars are calibrated to protect the engine so that it will make the maximum power AND be able to for well over 120k (which is the emissions rules). FE should be dependant on physics and gear ratios, but if someone is leaning out the cal to get FE, then I'm quite certain that it sacrifices emissions badly, and probably durability.
Turbos are a bitch- have to account for a whole slew of exhaust temps (exhaust valves, manifolds, and turbos- maybe sensors and catalysts) and turbine speeds. Add in DI, and real fuel, and there are a lot of things that are done to make sure the car survives in the real world.
My observations of aftermarket hacks, I mean "tunes", are that they violate a slew of the requirements all at once for the name of power. And when the car fails, the owners expect the OEM to replace the damaged parts, when the damage is due to the modifications that the owner makes.
RexSeven wrote:07-09 MS3s still suffer from an insufficent high-pressure fuel pump. The reason the car stops making power above 5500rpm-ish is because the HPFP is somewhat overtaxed. I also found some open source software for the MS3 that DaveEstey mentioned:
http://www.epifansoft.com/phpBB3/new-mazdaedit-tool-t432.html
I have no experience with this software, but it seems more powerful and less n00b-friendly than the Cobb AP, for what it's worth.
Oh, and Direct Injection brings a whole different level of issues. Even if you pump the boost, you may run into fuel flow problems.
Many of the turbo DI engines are power limited by the fuel pump.
I had the stock 93 tune on mine before I got rid of the car a few months back. Only other upgrades were a K&N drop-in & a OE style Forge bpv. I noticed a slight increase in mpg, boost would build up sooner & run up to 6,000 rpm. There was only a few occasions where I would run into fuel cut at the track, but other than that I thought it was a great subtle tune.
