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  • scrowner

    Jan. 24, 2009 10:30 a.m. scrowner New Reader

    I have a 97 Miata, HKS turbo and fuel rail. I bought this car to have fun on the track and use on the road. Currently it has the following for engine tune controls:

    1. Apexi SAFC air computer

    2. HKS EVC5 electronic boost controller ( 3 little boxes, one with a cool display, another with knobs, third with just wires)

    3. J&S knock/retard ( old unit, not listed on J&S site, black box with a row of red LEDs )

    I have little experience with car modifications but I would like to use the car with some knowledge. I have a local shop who can dyno tune the car and is somewhat familiar with these controls. But I am not and all these controls seem excessive and cumbersome.

    My question: Is there an "all-in-one" solution to these "band-aids"? Keeping with the grassroots idea, a solution that is relatively inexpensive would be cool.

  • Keith

    Jan. 24, 2009 11:09 a.m. Keith UltraDork

    I think you're looking for a full-on ECU. One option is to go with Megasquirt. The popular Link ECU is out of production, but Flyin' Miata has a couple left for the 1997 and it's a great value at $850 with full FM support.

  • Jan. 24, 2009 11:56 a.m. 93gsxturbo Reader

    Do they make an AEM box for those cars?

  • scrowner

    Jan. 24, 2009 11:58 a.m. scrowner New Reader

    I was not able to find a megasquirt at FM. But I found this one: megasquirt

    The megasquirt does not have a display like the "band-aids" do. I assume once the car is tuned with the megasquirt the displays are not necessary during run time?

    The other thing is that the current "band-aids" are attached to various sensors on the Miata - should I expect the sensors to be changed or is there simple mods with the squirt to allow interface to existing sensors?

  • Keith

    Jan. 24, 2009 12:42 p.m. Keith UltraDork

    FM doesn't sell the Megasquirt. That's available from a number of different places. It's cheaper, but a little more effort to get all the parts and to get it up and running.

    FM sells the Link and the Hydra Nemesis. The Hydra is a kick-ass piece of kit - I run two of them myself - but it's priced accordingly. It does include a wideband O2 sensor though. The Link is built specifically for the Miata and is a nice unit. The $850 price is about half of what they used to cost. It's no longer produced, but still supported.

    AEM does have a box for these cars as well, although I don't know if they have a plug-in for the 1996-97 cars. There isn't a plug-in option available for the 1999-05 models from them.

    In all cases, these ECUs are tuned via laptop and don't require extra displays. The Link also has the feature of a little keypad that lives in the car that lets you monitor and adjust the ECU in real time. You can add various gauges to monitor what's going on if you want. Ideally, they'll use the factory sensors although some may require extra/different ones. For example, the Link and the Hydra use a different air intake temperature sensor that's included with the kit. I'm pretty sure both the AEM and the Megasquirt will need a different one as well, as the factory one is integrated into the (now redundant) Mass Airflow Sensor.

    Disclosure - most people probably know this, but I work at Flyin' Miata. Thus I am more familiar with their products and offerings than those from other sources, and my answers reflect that.

  • scrowner

    Jan. 24, 2009 6:47 p.m. scrowner New Reader

    So, Link system, I was thinking from your original post that the "link" was the model of the megasquirt. I now understand it is this one.

    So Items to purchase:

    1. Link ECU $841. This kit comes with new intake temp sensor and knock sensor. (Can I assume these sensors will fit in place the the ones on my Miata?)

    2. Boost Control Solenoid $52. (There is one of these on my car currently with three hoses connected - I assume I should replace this with the link item?)

    3. ECU upgrade for Link $132 (Do I really need this for the newly purchased Link system?)

    4. Data Logging software $104 - to allow me to analyze the tuning work. (Are there specific steps to follow when analyzing?)

    5. There is mention of serial connector but there was no item for sale. (I assume a USB or DB9 - what does the Link use to interface to the PC?)

    So around $1140 to have everything in one system.

    The Link description indicates it will not meet OBD2 emission regulations. Is there a simple way to pass my "every 2 year" emission test with the my daily driver using the Link system?

  • Jan. 24, 2009 10:32 p.m. skruffy Dork

    swap your stock ecu back in for smog.

  • Keith

    Jan. 24, 2009 10:38 p.m. Keith UltraDork

    No full replacement ECUs retain OBD-II compliance. None. The way to pass an OBD-II test is typically to reinstall the stock ECU for a couple of days every two years. This is a fairly quick procedure, depending on just how "plug-in" the aftermarket ECU really is.

    1. Your Miata does not have a knock sensor, the Link adds this capabilities. The air temperature sensor will take the place of the one on your Miata, but you'll have to find a place to put it. The usual spot is in the IAC intake hose. Remember, the stock unit is integrated into the MAF which you will remove from the car.

    2. You will probably be able to use your existing solenoid.

    3. No, you won't need it for a brand new system. That's a software update for older models to bring them up to the level of a brand new.

    4. Data Log Lab is really handy stuff. There are some freeware display/logging programs (RTLink is one), but the analysis capabilities of Data Log Lab kick some serious butt. It's available for a wide variety of ECUs, but it's best integrated into the Link.

    5. The serial connectors (an interface box that plugs into the Link's ribbon connector) are a bit hard to find these days. It's a DB9 serial connector, and I might be able to find a spare one in my garage.

    So your estimate is a bit high. I'd recommend Data Log Lab and either build or find a serial connector - or find a local who's got a copy of DLL and a connector. In which case your total is around $945.

  • scrowner

    Jan. 24, 2009 10:56 p.m. scrowner New Reader

    Keith, nice sales work.

    I do not have my Miata handy as it is having a oil return attached into its pan. My Miata had some hand made return into the oil dip stick that had seen better days. But, since I have the J&S controller in the car, can I assume it has knock sensor? Either way, present or not, I should use the new one with the Link system. I read the Link's install instructions and went through the manual (whew). It all seems to be within my capabilities. Thanks for the help.

  • scrowner

    Jan. 24, 2009 11:01 p.m. scrowner New Reader

    skruffy wrote:

    swap your stock ecu back in for smog.

    Sweet. But what about car getting to the test station? Or just general running around for the few days before the test? All the sensors suddenly are no longer used. Will this cause some havoc with actual car operation?

  • Keith

    Jan. 24, 2009 11:47 p.m. Keith UltraDork

    When you swap the stock ECU back in, you'll need to reinstall the MAF as well as the stock injectors. Any extra sensors (such as a knock sensor) will not be used, and the stock ECU will have what it needs. Not a problem.

    The J&S does add a knock sensor to your car right now, yes. It's not as tightly integrated into the engine management as a full setup would be (in many cases, the ECU will pull timing and add fuel when a knock event occurs, and will retain these changes until the car is shut off so it won't happen again) and your goal is to remove bandaids.

    Give us a call at Flyin' Miata and we can help answer questions in person. It's often easier than going back and forth on a forum. Jeremy or Bill are the guys you want to speak to.

  • 4cylndrfury

    Jan. 25, 2009 8:51 a.m. 4cylndrfury New Reader

    woah Keith, very nice job. I dont even own a Miata, and Im about to buy a link setup just in case I ever buy one. I wish Flyin' Miata had a sister store called Flying' 1999 Infiniti G20

 

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