What kind of shocks are used for rallying? I have seen shocks for them but the applications for them seem limited and I haven't seen anything like the selection for Koni road racing dampers. So who makes rally shocks?
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Jan. 17, 2012 1:03 p.m. 93EXCivic SuperDork
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Jan. 17, 2012 1:06 p.m. sachilles Dork
DMS is one of the more popular ones.
important traits are durability, durability, durability. Tend to run softer than a tarmac oriented setup. Longer travel when appropriate.
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Jan. 17, 2012 1:09 p.m. fritzsch Reader
Often stock shocks are suitable from what ive heard. But of course usage is going to dictate your choice. I thikn bill caswell used oem shocks on his bmw. You might look at king and fox shocks, i know they are used extensively on the SAE Baja cars. But that application is more offroad than rally.
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Jan. 17, 2012 1:14 p.m. cghstang HalfDork
$tage Rally or Rallycross (cone squishing- not wheel-to-wheel)?
For dedicated gravel/tarmac stage rally setups there are DMS, HotBits, Reiger, ProFlex, Ohlins, Tein, and others. None of the good ones are cheap.
Custom struts housings and setups are made by a few individuals/companies using Bilstein internals.
Most cone squishing rallycross setups use stock or typical "street" aftermarket dampers.
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Jan. 17, 2012 1:27 p.m. HiTempguy SuperDork
More information needed, rallyx or stage rally being the biggest.
After that, budget. Stage rally suspension is fairly special (and has a limited market); longer strokes, big thick rods (50mm typically), different damping characteristics. This causes everything to be expensive.
K-sports are the cheapest rally specific struts you can get for $1500 (rally specific being in the vague meaning they are better than your typical strut you can buy). You can find lots of varying information on them, but what I can tell you is that a fellow competitor ran them at a very hotly contested regional and came 4th overall. Are they bad? Dunno.
After that, there are some custom solutions utilizing Bilstein inserts from a dude named JVL or allwheelsdriven.net for around $2500. Then Hotbits around $3200. I believe entry level non-adjustable RS&SP's are around the $3000 to $3500 range. Then you get into DMS at ~$5k, double adjustable RS&SP's at around $6500, Reigers, EXE-TC, Ohlins etc at $10k plus prices.
More information can be found at places like specialstage.com, rallyanarchy.com, dirtyimpreza.com.
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Jan. 17, 2012 3:26 p.m. NGTD Dork
Stock shocks will not hold up to true rallying. HiTempguy covered the rally scene well.
Rally-X - stock can be very effective - sometimes a little more spring can help, but compliant suspensions can help get the power down. Upgraded strut mounts, if available, seem to help from a durability perspective.
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Jan. 17, 2012 6:47 p.m. petegossett SuperDork
At one point several years ago Bilstein HD's were the acceptable entry-level A2 VW choice, though it seemed like 1-event was an average lifespan, IIRC.
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Jan. 17, 2012 9:28 p.m. Jay_W Dork
Stay away from KYB "heavy duty" "Rally" shocks. When we blew up the old GAB's we put a pair of those in the back of the car and turned them into "garbage" in less than 15 stage miles. The car has DMS/Bilstein customs setups in it now, cost around a couple k and are holding up just fine...
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Jan. 18, 2012 5:58 p.m. HappyAndy HalfDork
In reply to 93EXCivic: What kind of car are you planning to go rallying in? Does it need shocks at all 4 corners or struts/shocks? Is it something that's been successfully campaigned before, if so you should look into how that car was built.
I noticed that some of the previous posts were mentioning pricey competition grade shocks, I'm sure that would be completely unnecessary for solo rally-x, and probably unnecessary for an entry level stage rally car. I know that a lot of people using SAAB c900s for rallying use Bilstien HDs, which is an be rebuilt and revalved.
OTOH my advice may only be worth what you're paying for it, I have no actual rally experience, but I did grow up hooning old cars and pickup trucks through the woods and farm fields of southern NJ. One of these days I will find the time to go rally-x, I think it will suit me.
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Jan. 18, 2012 7:49 p.m. NGTD Dork
For full stage rally you can use things like HD's but by the time you are done replacing them all, you will wish that you used one of the ones that HiTempguy listed.
Or you will learn to slow down in the really rough E36 M3.
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Jan. 18, 2012 9:06 p.m. modernbeat Dork
Nobody mentioned JVAB. Also Bilstein are re-releasing their 50mm rally inserts and a DIY strut kit.
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Jan. 18, 2012 9:58 p.m. spnx New Reader
My buddy uses Hotbits.
I wish they were on the car when I was co-driving for him.
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Jan. 19, 2012 7:33 a.m. 93EXCivic SuperDork
I am not really looking for a car right now just curious.
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Jan. 19, 2012 10:25 a.m. HiTempguy SuperDork
modernbeat wrote:
Nobody mentioned JVAB. Also Bilstein are re-releasing their 50mm rally inserts and a DIY strut kit.
HiTempguy wrote:
After that, there are some custom solutions utilizing Bilstein inserts from a dude named JVL
....
I noticed that some of the previous posts were mentioning pricey competition grade shocks, I'm sure that would be completely unnecessary for solo rally-x, and probably unnecessary for an entry level stage rally car. I know that a lot of people using SAAB c900s for rallying use Bilstien HDs, which is an be rebuilt and revalved.
I keep arguing with people about this. YES, if it is keeping you from getting out on stage, run stock struts/shocks. BUT, unless you have 8 spares of each just lying around, you WILL be replacing them every rally. At that point, $1500 for K-Sports (which ARE a legitimate entry level rally strut, you just need to replace the springs with much softer ones) start to become a real bargain when you are replacing $400 worth of struts every rally. K-sport inserts are $160 to replace broken stuff, it really isn't a bad deal.
We are racing. When somebody races, I suggest to them the bare minimum to compete. I've saw K-Sports finish 4th overall in a regional on a STi, and the dude was fast (I don't say many people are fast).
Love the jellybean, very underrated rally car. Everyone loves sentras, and the jellybean is just as good IMO!
Edit- And this is from a completely stage perspective. Rallyx? Run stock stuff IMO.
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Jan. 19, 2012 11:26 a.m. GameboyRMH SuperDork
K-sports are rebranded D2s and a friend of mine got a regional class 1st on those (on a Mitsu Colt).
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Jan. 19, 2012 11:30 a.m. 92CelicaHalfTrac SuperDork
Can you get the KSports/D2s to go high enough to give sufficient travel/clearance?
I've never personally messed with a set that didn't have a hell of a time getting UP to stock height.
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Jan. 19, 2012 11:50 a.m. GameboyRMH SuperDork
92CelicaHalfTrac wrote:
Can you get the KSports/D2s to go high enough to give sufficient travel/clearance?
I've never personally messed with a set that didn't have a hell of a time getting UP to stock height.
I guess the ground clearance depends on the car. I'd go check the thread space on my 'rolla running D2 RSes but it's in the shop for super serial bodywork.
Here's a pic of the friend's Colt:
