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  • bigwrench

    Feb. 6, 2009 4:37 p.m. bigwrench Reader

    Auto hobbyists, collectors and parts suppliers are lining up to oppose federal legislation that would take older cars off the road and into the crusher.

    The so-called “Cash for Clunkers” vehicle scrappage bills, introduced recently in the Senate andHouse, would reimburse drivers of cars or trucks with credits up to $4,500 for scrapping vehicles with economy ratings under 18 miles per gallon. The credits would be in the form of vouchers to purchase new, fuel-efficient vehicles or use mass transit.

    The legislation, first introduced in the Senate by Sens. Diane Feinstein (D-CA), Susan Collins (R-ME) and Charles Schumer (D-NY), is designed to spark sales of new vehicles to help the sagging auto industry while lowering U.S. fuel consumption and air pollution.

    Outspoken scrappage opponent Bill Gilmore, a legislative lobbyist for the Arizona Auto Hobbyists Council, an umbrella group of auto-hobby groups, said the legislation would result in “a vehicular holocaust” without any positive results.

    “It is estimated that over six million used pickups, SUV's, high-performance cars, large-displacement motorcycles and collectable vehicles of all years and models would be crushed over the next four years in this twisted attempt to spur newer car sales,” Gilmore said. “Believe me, our beloved car and motorcycle hobby will never be the same, and we will all be disproportionately affected.”

    Arizona legislators had attempted a similar state law several years ago but were dissuaded by the efforts of hobbyists and the collector-car industry. The state has many older private cars and trucks still in regular use, preserved by the dry climate.

    “Those so-called ‘clunkers’ are cars that other people might love to own and potentially restore,” said Robert Stinnett in a blog on a car-hobbyist web site. “Just because something is old doesn’t mean it isn’t useful. This is a wasteful program that does nothing but waste taxpayer dollars and encourages people to go further into debt buying new.”



    Rated at just 15 mpg, this 2007 Chrysler 300C SRT8 could be targeted by the scrappage bill. » More Photos Officials of SEMA, a trade group of aftermarket manufacturers and dealers as well as professional auto restorers, customizers, racers and car clubs, said the plan would threaten the availability of valuable parts for repairs and restorations, and “risk destroying classic, historic and special-interest vehicles, our American heritage.”

    “The program will fail to achieve its goal of improving fuel efficiency and stimulating car sales, but will increase unemployment and the cost of used cars and parts,” SEMA said in a press release.

    SEMA ticked off a number of reasons why the program would be a bust with adverse effects:

     Given the minimal $1,500 – $4,500 voucher value, the program will lure rarely driven second and third vehicles that have minimal impact.  The program will reduce the number of vehicles available for low-income individuals and drive up the cost of the remaining vehicles and repair parts.  The program will remove the opportunity to market specialty products that are designed exclusively for the targeted pickups and SUVs, including equipment that increases engine performance and fuel mileage. This would eliminate jobs and reduce business revenues.  The program also will hurt thousands of independent repair shops, auto restorers, customizers and their customers across the country that depend on the used-car market.  The program fails to acknowledge driver needs, such as the ability to transport a family, tow a trailer or rely upon the performance, safety and utility characteristics associated with the larger vehicles.

    As conceived, the program would operate for four years and would encourage the scrappage of about one million vehicles per year. The targeted vehicles would be those with overall EPA mileage ratings under 18 mpg, no matter what year, and the vouchers would be good for vehicles earning at least 25 percent more mpg than its overall class.

    Vouchers also could be redeemed for local transit fares.

    “We face real challenges with trying to encourage drivers to trade in their older, less fuel efficient vehicles—particularly in this tough economic climate,” Sen. Feinstein said in introducing the legislation. “If enacted, this bill would be an important part of helping getting America’s struggling automobile industry back on its feet—and help consumers who are concerned about covering the cost of buying a more fuel-efficient vehicle.”

    Bob Golfen, Automotive Editor for SPEEDtv.com,

  • bigwrench

    Feb. 6, 2009 5:15 p.m. bigwrench Reader

    Taken from Speed tv.

  • neon4891

    Feb. 6, 2009 5:16 p.m. neon4891 SuperDork

    repost

  • bamalama

    Feb. 6, 2009 5:23 p.m. bamalama Reader

    I've never understood these bills. I scrap my prefectly good car that I "recycled" into service, to get a $1500-4500 voucher toward the purchase of a $20,000 car that I can't afford in the first place. If I'm somehow able to avoid getting it repossessed and pay it off, I wind up with a net loss of (not counting interest) $15,500-18,500. That'd buy a hell of a lot of fuel.

  • Supercoupe

    Feb. 7, 2009 9:24 a.m. Supercoupe New Reader

    Wow....Soylent Green for cars.

    Why don't we just scrap old people that just use up our Social Security and Medicare money and give a $4500 dollar credit towards a new one.

    Robert Stinnett in a blog on a car-hobbyist web site. “Just because something is old doesn’t mean it isn’t useful.
  • curtis73

    Feb. 20, 2012 9:47 p.m. curtis73 SuperDork

    Mmmm.... fresh canoe.

  • fast_eddie_72

    Feb. 20, 2012 9:48 p.m. fast_eddie_72 SuperDork

    I suspect it has less to do with the environment and fuel economy and more to do with the economic economy.

    Remember about 10 years ago - the outcry about how bad television looked? Remember writing to your Congressman and demanding that they legislate new, better looking television? Oh, you didn't? Neither did anyone else. So why did they pass legislation that virtually forced everyone to buy a TV that cost twice as much as the old one? Oh, they wanted the frequencies back, so they said. But have they used the spectrum? No, they wanted to dump a load of money into the economy.

    Well, same deal. If you get rid of all the old cars, people will buy new cars- just about the time we're trying to get the auto industry going again. Yeah? Yeah, that's my guess.

  • novaderrik

    Feb. 20, 2012 9:52 p.m. novaderrik SuperDork

    fast_eddie_72 wrote:

    I suspect it has less to do with the environment and fuel economy and more to do with the economic economy.

    Remember about 10 years ago - the outcry about how bad television looked? Remember writing to your Congressman and demanding that they legislate new, better looking television? Oh, you didn't? Neither did anyone else. So why did they pass legislation that virtually forced everyone to buy a TV that cost twice as much as the old one? Oh, they wanted the frequencies back, so they said. But have they used the spectrum? No, they wanted to dump a load of money into the economy.

    Well, same deal. If you get rid of all the old cars, people will buy new cars- just about the time we're trying to get the auto industry going again. Yeah? Yeah, that's my guess.

    i don't remember being forced to buy a tv that costs twice as much.. in fact, i'm still using the same tv i bought brand new in the spring of '02, and i could buy a tv with a better picture, bigger screen, 1/4 the mass, and with a digital tuner built into it for less money than i paid for my ancient tv a decade ago.

  • Vigo

    Feb. 20, 2012 10:45 p.m. Vigo SuperDork

    Remember about 10 years ago ...legislation that virtually forced everyone to buy a TV
    i don't remember being forced to buy a tv ...in fact, i'm still using the same tv i bought brand new in the spring of '02

    LAWL

  • Keith

    Feb. 20, 2012 11:06 p.m. Keith SuperDork

    I had to buy a new TV? Didn't realize, sorry. I think I got mine in 1997. Still works as well as it did then.

  • SlickDizzy

    Feb. 21, 2012 12:23 a.m. SlickDizzy SuperDork

    I think he's referring to the switch to digital public TV broadcast and the need for a digital tuner.

  • ddavidv

    Feb. 21, 2012 5:58 a.m. ddavidv SuperDork

    This thread:

  • Keith

    Feb. 21, 2012 8:16 a.m. Keith SuperDork

    SlickDizzy wrote:

    I think he's referring to the switch to digital public TV broadcast and the need for a digital tuner.

    I know. But you could get those boxes for $40, and even then if you don't use an antenna it made no difference. So why did I "need" to buy a new tv again?

  • pres589

    Feb. 21, 2012 8:26 a.m. pres589 Dork

    In reply to fast_eddie_72:

    Eddie, unless your employer has changed, I'm not sure if you should really be complaining about people watching TV.

  • Feb. 21, 2012 11:43 a.m. Knurled Dork

    SlickDizzy wrote:

    I think he's referring to the switch to digital public TV broadcast and the need for a digital tuner.

    Funny, cable and satellite and PlayStation and my DVD player all work exactly the same. So does my VCR.

    I guess I wasn't home when the jackbooted thugs came in and forced me to buy a new TV.

  • dculberson

    Feb. 21, 2012 12:04 p.m. dculberson HalfDork

    They also had those coupons.. helped a neighbor use hers, I don't have much use for TV.

  • Datsun1500

    Feb. 21, 2012 12:55 p.m. Datsun1500 SuperDork

    Brought back from 2009. Everyone, 1 drink.

 
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