Someone near me buy this and give me a ride.

The C6 Z06 Vette at a track or autocross destroys any swapped Miata that hasn't had what amounts to new Z06 Vette money put into it (it's $50k for a turn key car on top of the Miata you have to provide and that doesn't include things like fitting larger wheels), and we're talking now a mostly stock Z06 Vette vs a highly modified Miata. Give the Z06 shocks, alignment and tires and it's basically ready to go. That's all I've done to my car and I can do anything with it.

This is why the Habu is so much more appealing to me then a C6 Z06, 911T, or whatever for the money. The guy that you just passed going "but, but, but, I have a Z06, and that's just a Miata!

A big part for me.is you show up in a c6 z06 everyone knows your fast vs what looks like just another boring miata

For me, this is a huge plus for the Miata.

To me it is that I don't think the little bit of added performance you get in the Miata is worth it. For starters I am not a good enough driver. And at those limits it is no longer just a game.

The Miata is a really cool car and for all the reasons everyone has noted above I want one. But I would be just as happy in a c5 zo6 and have a good bit of cash left over.

I think this falls into the "shoulda bought a better car" thread from several weeks ago. Except in the opposite direction. If I had that kinda scratch, I think I'd choose the FM Miata over a similarly spec'd c6, not because it's "better", but because it suits my tastes more. Same goes for Porsches in that price, same as the Elise, etc. None of these are practical cars, so you might as well just get the one you like more.

I understand the desire to want to stuff a massive upgrade under a small car. I get the whole is greater than the sum of it's parts bit. I understand the value in just buying one already done well too. Especially if you have more money than skill or time.

Still... I guess a professionally built hot rod miata just isn't my cup of tea. That does not excite me one bit. I feel like if that were a 2002 or some other distinctive looking classic I'd probably be gushing but for whatever reason... I'd hate to spend that kind of money and still end up with something that looks like a Miata. Part of it is probably because I'm not really a finished project type buyer. I'd be embarrassed to admit to a crowd of onlookers that I didn't build it and blush when asked for the cost. And I wouldn't start a project like that with a Miata so really I'm projecting ... there is nothing wrong with a $36k V8 Miata. I am really just broken inside :)

Still... someone will buy that and love it. And good for them. Different strokes and all that.

The funny thing is about comparing a z06 to a v8 miata performance wise is that very few people would have the talent or opportunity to use either car at their full potential. So does it really matter if one is slightly faster than the other at the racetrack? At that kind of money buy the one that gives you the "climb the rope in gym class" feeling and dont worry about the rest.

gearheadmb wrote: The funny thing is about comparing a z06 to a v8 miata performance wise is that very few people would have the talent or opportunity to use either car at their full potential. So does it really matter if one is slightly faster than the other at the racetrack? At that kind of money buy the one that gives you the "climb the rope in gym class" feeling and dont worry about the rest.

On this board though there are a lot of road racers, instructors and general track day heros who would use every last bit of either car. So, it does matter. Maybe not directly to the Z-06 comparison... but to the performance potential in terms of lap time and dollars spent.

If I'm the one shopping - that IS a track car.

Huckleberry wrote:

gearheadmb wrote: The funny thing is about comparing a z06 to a v8 miata performance wise is that very few people would have the talent or opportunity to use either car at their full potential. So does it really matter if one is slightly faster than the other at the racetrack? At that kind of money buy the one that gives you the "climb the rope in gym class" feeling and dont worry about the rest.

On this board though there are a lot of road racers, instructors and general track day heros who would use every last bit of either car. So, it does matter. Maybe not directly to the Z-06 comparison... but to the performance potential in terms of lap time and dollars spent. If I'm the one shopping - that IS a track car.

But lets be real about it. How much better is the payout for having a car that is half a second faster at a track day? Or as an instructor? So buy the car you like. There no wrong answer of the two, but for me i would rather go fast in a car i love than go slightly faster in a car i dont love.

If you guys want a track car, we can build a track car. We've done one that is campaigning and winning championships in a NE endurance series. The owner says the 911 GT3s are pesky. And he's having a hell of a lot of fun doing it in a car that cost considerably less than a 911 GT3.

This one isn't a track car, it's a street car. Like the vast majority of Z06s It's got the capability (like the vast majority of Z06s), but this particular one was built for street giggles. If you've ever rolled into the gas at 2000 rpm, heard the roar of the big engine and felt the hammer of Thor hit you in the back - in a Miata - then you don't need it explained. Or bounced your head off the headrest on a 3-4 shift. Our goal is not to provide the absolute best random parameter per dollar ratio, but to provide a huge amount of fun. Mission accomplished.

Oh, one advantage this car has over a C6 Corvette is improved oil control. If you pull 1.3g in a left hand turn for more than a couple of seconds in a C6 Corvette, you'll lose the engine. Not in our cars.

Huckleberry, if this doesn't float your boat, that's fine. Sounds like you don't get much appeal out of anything that isn't half-built and comes at a massive discount, or is a pure hard-core zero compromise track car, or isn't going to embarrass you because it's old but not old enough. There are other options out there. The fact that these cars rarely come up for sale and sell for this sort of price would indicate that those that like them, like them a lot.

gearheadmb wrote: There no wrong answer of the two, but for me i would rather go fast in a car i love than go slightly faster in a car i dont love.

It's trap!

You cannot go really fast in any car you love. You have to have an indifference to destroying it!

Huckleberry wrote:

gearheadmb wrote: There no wrong answer of the two, but for me i would rather go fast in a car i love than go slightly faster in a car i dont love.

It's trap! You cannot go really fast in any car you love. You have to have an indifference to destroying it!

And this is why potential "performance" is a moot question, for most of us, because we can't afford to write off either the Habu or the ZO6, and if you can, the argument over 'value' has a lot less weight.

Like I said early on, buy the one that makes you smile more and that has little to do with hard numbers and rational choices.

Keith Tanner wrote: Huckleberry, if this doesn't float your boat, that's fine. Sounds like you don't get much appeal out of anything that isn't half-built and comes at a massive discount, or is a pure hard-core zero compromise track car, or isn't going to embarrass you because it's old but not old enough. There are other options out there. The fact that these cars rarely come up for sale and sell for this sort of price would indicate that those that like them, like them a lot.

It is not fair to say I have a problem spending money on things I like. I've certainly dwarfed the cost of that car on tires alone. Nevermind stupid cars that have come and gone.

It is fair to say that does not float my boat because the value proposition for going fast isn't there and I don't want to do anything else with it. It's appeal to others - people who will drive around with the top down or take it to Cars and Coffee is there. I won't ever do that. For what I do with a track car these days - it's slow and expensive. I wasn't the one comparing it to the Z-06. Mine is a much more terribly unfair comparison.

Which is why I went out of my way to say I get it... it's just not for me a few posts above.

Sounds like what you need is a formula car. Lots of opportunity to buy something that needs work, and the speed/dollar for a track car is probably going to be unbeatable.

gearheadmb wrote: The funny thing is about comparing a z06 to a v8 miata performance wise is that very few people would have the talent or opportunity to use either car at their full potential. So does it really matter if one is slightly faster than the other at the racetrack? At that kind of money buy the one that gives you the "climb the rope in gym class" feeling and dont worry about the rest.

I bought my Z06 to do local and national level events in autocross. I attempt to wring as much performance out of it as possible.

From that perspective the Habu has no real appeal since for autocross it's an XP car, but it's not an XP car since the whole point of the thing would be lost if you added massive fender flares and big aero to it so you could actually compete in XP.

penultimeta wrote: I think this falls into the "shoulda bought a better car" thread from several weeks ago. Except in the opposite direction. If I had that kinda scratch, I think I'd choose the FM Miata over a similarly spec'd c6, not because it's "better", but because it suits my tastes more. Same goes for Porsches in that price, same as the Elise, etc. None of these are practical cars, so you might as well just get the one you like more.

For $36k it's not a bad deal, but yeah, it's all personal preference. I'd rather have a Porsche, Corvette or Elise. Though actually of all those choices, including the Habu, the Elise is the least practical. The thing literally has no room at all inside and almost no storage.

For $50k + car to build one from new... I dunno if I would ever do that for anything other than an ND version and I'd want it in an RF if I'm spending my invisible money.

In reply to Keith Tanner:

You are not far off the mark - what I really want next is probably a C sports racer or it's equal. I've got one son entering college shortly and another right behind him, along with some aging parent relocation expenses looming so fielding a competitive race car isn't in the cards for a bit. I can never just dabble so I'm sitting out until I can dive in :)

Keith Tanner wrote: Oh, one advantage this car has over a C6 Corvette is improved oil control. If you pull 1.3g in a left hand turn for more than a couple of seconds in a C6 Corvette, you'll lose the engine. Not in our cars.

09 Z06s have the upgraded capacity dry sump and go for under $40k with low miles. Pretty much kills that issue and lose the engine is a bit of an overstatement since people have actually gone out and measured the loss of pressure without losing the motor. Maybe in the regular C6?

I've heard more about the valve guide issue with the Z06 than oil starvation. The valve guide problem is also solvable pretty easily.

I know that the LS3 failure problem in Corvettes was so bad that dry sumps are legal in NASA ST1. A bit of looking around will show the magnitude of the problem - pay attention to wtknight1 on corvetteforum.com. You don't always get to keep the motor when the oil pressure goes away. And by "lose the engine" I mean in the dramatic, shut down the track whilst we clean up the oil way.

But again, this isn't a Z06. It does things the Z06 cannot. The Z06 does things this car cannot. Why can there only be one choice?

Harvey wrote: For $50k + car to build one from new... I dunno if I would ever do that for anything other than an ND version and I'd want it in an RF if I'm spending my invisible money.

Me too. The ND version is a different beast than the NB, and the RF is something else. We're building one for a customer right now, I can't wait to drive it. I've seriously thought about buying an RF and then gutting the Targa Miata for the drivetrain.

I like it.

Keith Tanner wrote: I know that the LS3 failure problem in Corvettes was so bad that dry sumps are legal in NASA ST1. A bit of looking around will show the magnitude of the problem - pay attention to wtknight1 on corvetteforum.com. You don't always get to keep the motor when the oil pressure goes away. And by "lose the engine" I mean in the dramatic, shut down the track whilst we clean up the oil way. But again, this isn't a Z06. It does things the Z06 cannot. The Z06 does things this car cannot. Why can there only be one choice?

Yeah, I gather the Z06 has a less of an oil pressue issue because of the dry sump, but apparently it still happens to some extent in the 06-08 cars. Kind of an edge case if you're just doing DE on street tires though. The valve guide swap is legal in street class autocross because it doesn't add to the performance of the car and pretty much everyone has done it.

Even though I have a Z06 I didn't bring up Vette vs Habu, someone else did and then it was said that this particular one does everything better than a Vette, which I think we both agree is not the case. There are things that the Miata does better though and then there are just the intangible things that people have noted in here that modify their preference.

Keith Tanner wrote: Me too. The ND version is a different beast than the NB, and the RF is something else. We're building one for a customer right now, I can't wait to drive it. I've seriously thought about buying an RF and then gutting the Targa Miata for the drivetrain.

Yes, you should do that with your Targa car.

The ND came out the gate really strong in Solo. C-Street and STR are both seeing strong competition from them. It seems like a real nice platform overall. I like it a lot better than the NC.

Now an ND RF... done by fm. I'd pay lots for that. I'm not too into the miata before the nd. Maybe that's why I dont think this car makes sense to me.

But, I've only owned two practical cars in my whole life. And one of them is questionable and the other is my wifes dd.

Well, this Miata is for someone It's sold.

The seller says he got two calls within an hour of the listing going up. He's got five seriously interested people, and one has sent a deposit. It went for the full asking price.

And Harvey, if you want a ride in one, just stop in