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Cotton
Cotton PowerDork
6/2/20 7:27 p.m.

Edit. Deleted my post.  Really trying to stay out of these.

pirate
pirate HalfDork
6/2/20 7:27 p.m.
LarsBrunkhorst said:

While I don't post much I have been a dedicated reader of the site for the last couple years, this was the last thing I expected to see on a site that has done a great job of staying on topic over the last couple years.

Being younger than most on this board probably gives me a different perspective but there were three things I felt reading all of these replies;

1. Tom, Margie and more people than I would have guessed are not only looking forward to a brighter future, but also doing something about it, and as a younger individual that brings me great joy. Unfortunately no good deed goes unpunished, and people will find issue with anything.

2. Boomers gonna boom.

3. Some of the veiled language and implied ideas being put forth by some posters have no place at ANY car race/event/show/gathering etc. I can tell you that unless the average age is above 50 you will never hear anything of the sort. (also see #2)

Maybe I'm painting with a broad stroke but what do I know? I'll be in the corner enjoying my tide pod smoothie...

Of course youth is always smarter, is always right about everything, has better ideas, etc. then in this case baby boomers. That's why you need to get out effect change as much as possible before sooner then you think you will become a dumb ass by those younger then you.

I would like to say I applaud GRM for their conviction and statement regarding equality. I also am not convinced that the SPLC was the best choice for a donation but respect GRM's right to do so. At least they are not just standing on the side line as I suspect many are. What George Floyd went through and the end result was horrific. I don't think any reasonable human being denies that. Those responsible should all be punished to the fullest extent of the law.

I am a 74 year old white male, very conservative and yes believe in all those things that would classify me to be ignorant, a racist or bigot by those on the left. But I am not any of those things. I have seen the United States through the eyes of post WWII teen through the eyes as a US Marine, through the eyes of a labor union member, through the eyes of of a middle management manager and through the eyes of a self employed business owner. I now see the US through the eyes as a retired senior citizen and don't like what I'm seeing. Never before have I seen this nation as divided as it is now. Much of it along political lines. People attack other people's character with half truths, tell out and out lies and use any other means to get their point across. What ever happened to honor and civility toward others even if you don't agree.

If we really want to eliminate racism in his country (I'm convinced not everyone wants to) it will not happen from the government, politicians who's only interest is re-election, black or white organizations, riots or protests. Eliminating racism will come at the individual level when we all believe enough is enough and start listening more then we speak, start treating each other differently and taking responsibility for our actions. We must focus on eliminating white on black, black on white and black on black crime which creates so much fear, hopelessness and division. Not an easy task and certainly not one that will be accomplished as soon as everyone would like.

 

 

LarsBrunkhorst
LarsBrunkhorst New Reader
6/2/20 7:37 p.m.

In reply to L5wolvesf :

You're goddam right I think my generation is better, because this is how you people react, with name calling, slurs, etc. Whose the little snowflake now? I'm sorry, did I hurt your fee fee's for pointing out youre yelling at someone for doing a good thing?

Why do you have such an issue with how GRM has gone about trying help? Because they didnt consult you on which charity they should donate to? How about "Hey guys thanks for doing this it means a lot, maybe next time we can try these charities because I think they might be more effective". But no, theres no rational responses, nothing constructive, its thinly veiled garbage. We're done with it.

And youre right, problems with discrimination of all kinds have been around for a long time,but guess what, we have reached a time and place in society where there are no excuses anymore. You have the whole internet at your finger tips, you can learn as much as you want, day after day. You can see how people from all walks of life, live and interact, you can experience so many things, video chat with someone on the other side of the planet. There are no excuses for this behavior anymore.

You want to get into facts? You want evidence? Pointless against you people, brainwashed by 60 years of propaganda and false rhetoric, youll yell "fake news" and point us to a BS Facebook article while at the same time asking us whats wrong with your "email" cause you opened another attachement from an unknown sender.

The overwhelming majority of those that are outwardly racist/sexist/etc. are older, you can't say otherwise. You make excuses, you come up with strawman arguments, you project. It's insulting to anyone with half a brain. I'm continuing the problem because I said were done with acting like this?

You know what you call someone who isnt racist, who doesnt think its such a problem for people to want a better life? Someone who doesnt mind helping out where and when they can simply because they have empathy? A good person.

Being a Boomer is not about an age demographic, its a disease of the mind.

I dont have to pretend to be better, I know my generation is better, because we get it, and y'all dont.

 

dxman92
dxman92 HalfDork
6/2/20 7:44 p.m.

All I will contribute to this is a phrase from Honest Abe Lincoln:

You can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can’t please all of the people all of the time.

Snowdoggie
Snowdoggie Reader
6/2/20 7:52 p.m.
Tom Suddard said:

Anybody opposed to locking this thread at 10pm ET? We opened the floor, people had their say, and now it might be time to refocus the discussion. 

Hot sauce. We need to turn this thread into another thread about hot sauce. I like mine spicy and Cajun.

stuart in mn
stuart in mn MegaDork
6/2/20 7:54 p.m.

Whenever I see the words "you people..." in a post, I think of the old standby cartoon:

L5wolvesf
L5wolvesf Reader
6/2/20 7:58 p.m.
LarsBrunkhorst said:

In reply to L5wolvesf :

You're goddam right I think my generation is better, because this is how you people react, with name calling, slurs, etc. Whose the little snowflake now? I'm sorry, did I hurt your fee fee's for pointing out youre yelling at someone for doing a good thing?

 

Learn to read dumbass

L5wolvesf said:
Staff of Motorsport Marketing, Inc. said:

We stand against racism. We stand against violence. We stand for inclusion. We stand for a free press. We stand for speaking out, together.

This I agree with 100%.

I find it interesting that none of those who don't like the SPLC have not provided any links to their claims. 

L5wolvesf
L5wolvesf Reader
6/2/20 8:08 p.m.

In reply to AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) :

I was going to post this earlier in response since the floor was opened . . . But I was called out by a clown who can’t comprehend words. Anyway . . .

 

Good informative and thought out post Anthony. We agree on some things differ in others my positions are in bold.

 

Politics: I hate it because I hate dishonest, corrupt, deceitful people, which is what 99% of politicians, and those in the political arena, are. That includes any and all political parties – federal and state. It is about controlling people not “being of service” to the citizenry. IMO, politicians use ‘divide and conquer’ tactics to gain power – being racist is part of the dividing of people who should be united. Saying the United States has been replaced by saying America.

 

Religion: the organized types – the name or beliefs don’t really matter. Like politics it is about controlling people not “being of service”. It is also a tool for politicians. It is part of the foundation of hate and intolerance. It starts with, ‘my god is better that your god’.

 

Education: Factually educated people are a threat to politicians and religions. So education gets defunded and shifted to religious groups. The citizenry over time has become increasingly ignorant. And here we are.

 

1) Abortion, your body your choice. You decide with your partner, family, leaders etc. Agreed but only to this point. Don't lay your murderous ways at my feet though.

 

2) LGBTQ. Again your body, your choice. I really don't care. I don't choose to participate, but that's my choice. Agreed

 

3) Budget: Yah conservative as all get out; balance it baby. Add 100% transparency and accountability on a criminal prosecutorial level.

 

4) Military: I served 10 years. I chose to never work in the defense industry after for good reasons. I also have come to realize this country was never intended to have a large standing military force, because it is too dangerous.

 

I haven’t served, draft ended about the time I was old enough (Vietnam), not sure if I would have gone. Interesting point re “never intended to have a large standing military force, because it is too dangerous.” What would we (the US) have done about WWII?

 

5) Drugs: These people need help. Locking them away in prison is not helpful, unless you are trying to train career criminals. Prison is like a PhD for crime. Legalize marijuana. I wish people were using this more now; less violence more munchies. Agreed, I personally don’t use marijuana.

 

Prisons have also become a business politicians profit from and they do a terrible job at what they are supposed to do with criminals – keep them incarcerated in accordance with the laws of this country. Our criminal justice system has effectively failed too.

 

6) Racism. By and large this is an education and child abuse issue. It is a taught, learned behavior. Agreed

 

I feel the SPLC is complicit in this and is the problem and not the solution.

SPLC: Their charity ratings say they do well. Their enemies (groups who hate) hate them – not surprising. Are there problems yes, no organization, or person, is perfect. I haven’t see/heard of another or better organization that does what they do.

 

I have never seen a racist child, ever. I've seen racist teens and adults my entire life and seen racist societies. It was learned. It is the lowest common denominator of human intelligence and is used as a tool to control and destroy. Agreed, and see my comments on education.

 

7) Gun control: It's a tool. Learn to use it properly; your life could depend on it. Also the worlds "shall not be infringed," have absolutely zero to do with hunting. I should be able to own an M1 Abrams tank and park it in my driveway if I can afford it, as it falls under "arms" as in armaments. And armed population is far more valuable (and polite) and safe than any standing army.

We were given the right to bear arms for when the government(s) become oppressive and or unconstitutional. There is a lot of video, and other forms of evidence, from politicians and law enforcement officers, that indicates we’re there.

 

Fascism: as defined by

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fascism

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism

 

Neither of those definitions work within the Constitution of the United States. Given those definitions I am anti fascist. I am also anti Nazi, anti authoritarian/dictatorship, anti racist, anti violence,  

 

I'm hardly conservative, by any means. Agreed

MrFancypants
MrFancypants Reader
6/2/20 8:11 p.m.
Subscriber-unavailabile said:

In reply to MrFancypants :

https://www.kvue.com/mobile/article/news/local/antifa-austin-target-looting-protests-dps/269-547a9c6a-9fe7-4ec7-9cee-0b986a76c43f

I'm looking and not finding what I requested.  No convictions, no specific criminal charges.  Hearsay.

AAZCD (Forum Supporter)
AAZCD (Forum Supporter) Dork
6/2/20 8:19 p.m.

TIL many of the members of the forum are not real people. Most of the ones I know are real have the same first name, "Patrick".

bigben
bigben Reader
6/2/20 8:24 p.m.

In reply to Tom Suddard :

I tried to pass the baton and get this going in a productive direction, but apparently I dropped it instead too bad.

Vehement people on both sides of the argument here have made some good points that should be considered by the opposite side. It's too bad that it's easier to be blinded and deaf by our own pride than it is to learn from someone who we think we disagree with.

I'm convinced much of the strife we see today is not a result of bad people, only bad communicators. 

Floating Doc (Forum Supporter)
Floating Doc (Forum Supporter) UltraDork
6/2/20 8:33 p.m.

In reply to LarsBrunkhorst :

You're goddam right I think my generation is better, because this is how you people react, with name calling, slurs, etc. Whose the little snowflake now? I'm sorry, did I hurt your fee fee's for pointing out youre yelling at someone for doing a good thing?

Quite the rant. Haven't learned anything from this thread, have you?

Really? Using the phrase "You people!" 

We stood up against the war in Vietnam, and some of us died for that. Kent State.

We  went to register voters and some of us died for that. Neshoba county, Mississippi.

My brother and I were the plantifs in the Federal lawsuit that finally desegregated the schools in our county. We had a berkeleying cross burned on our lawn. 

And we're not unique! 

Trash a whole group of people according to your personal prejudice, and you don't see the irony in doing it on this discussion? 

We stand against racism. We stand against violence. We stand for inclusion. We stand for a free press. We stand for speaking out, together.

 

Thank you GRM for taking a stand-I couldn't be more proud to be a supporter of the magazine.

Apexcarver
Apexcarver UltimaDork
6/2/20 8:42 p.m.
Tom Suddard said:

Anybody opposed to locking this thread at 10pm ET? We opened the floor, people had their say, and now it might be time to refocus the discussion. 

Probably wise Tom.  Some people need to take a step back and reflect a bit. Try to understand and respect each other's views. 

 

Had a good conversation with a conservative friend of mine yesterday before all the military involvement stuff went down. He began rather outspoken about rioting and destruction. Was hyper focused on that as a bad thing. I asked him what he proposed they do. At every turn, he suggested things that have been tried for decades and got nowhere or got somewhere to just be battled and erased or achieve little to no lasting change. He began to understand that these violent acts are acts of frustration. The what would you do question got him to see the corner they are painted into. Violent destruction isn't right, we all can agree. But it's better to take a step back and try to understand why we are here. Many if not most of us would agree from there, escalation isn't the answer to stop the rioting and it doesn't bode well for any lasting change.

 

Guys, cool down. Achieve peace in your mind before responding. Angry slapbacks won't accomplish anything. 

Tom1200
Tom1200 Dork
6/2/20 8:49 p.m.

Yes for god sakes lock this thread.

759NRNG (Forum Partidario)
759NRNG (Forum Partidario) UltraDork
6/2/20 8:49 p.m.

good night .....love your neighbor as your self.....the second is like unto it.....peace out

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