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Folks,
I channel surfed thru the race for most of the afternoon, then managed to see both of the big wrecks. I was surprised to see Ryan Newman and Mark Martin scold the Wizards of Daytona Beach.
So now that we know that the COT and the Restrictor plates are not the solution......What should the wizards try next:
Discuss....
Rog
Not sure what you are asking here. What is the problem that you are seeking a solution for?
Are the wizards the NASCAR people? Are you saying that the wrecks are the problem? Do you really think NASCAR wants to get rid of wrecks? What would they have to show on Sportscenter? It is all about the wrecks - I'm sure they want them to be safe wrecks, but they want the wrecks. Wrecks = excitement = fans = sponsors = money.
I don't watch or follow NASCAR as much as I can help it, so feel free to ignore my opinion by the way. I just don't get it.
I don't watch NASCAR but was at the spring race at Talledega this year (live 30-40 minutes away) and saw the wreck that sent a couple people in the stands to the hospital to be checked out and understand the concern for fan safety. But, at the same time at what point do you restrict the cars enough that it is no longer a "super speedway"?
A chicane would do the trick.
They lost me when stock cars stopped being based on stock cars. Instead of restrictor plate racing, limit tire width and engine displacement. Run stock bodies. And don't try to "level the playing field", it is what it is. TJ is right.....Nascrap wants to have 'safe' wrecks.
The problem at Talladega was that 43 cars were flying in formation and it's boring as all get out. The only excitement comes when there's "The Big One". Those things are built like tankes, but Newman was still upset because the cage came down on his head, and there isn't any ducking when you're in one of those seats. They need a formula that allows the better built and tuned cars to pull away, without going 220 MPH. Watch some of the old races where the front 2 or 3 cars could run away and hide, but still beat on each other for the last 2 laps. It was just as entertaining. Today, NASCAR races are just as processional as an F1 race, just with bigger wrecks.There has to be a way for the best driver, in the best car, with the best crew to get a significant lead. Then there needs to be 3,4,5, whatever number of teams that are capable of that. The formula for the car has to such that the best driver can manhandle the car and come from behind, and most importantly, that has to be apparent to the fans watching. If you took all the cars and removed their numbers and painted them all the same today, can you tell who's driving?
+1 on minimac's comment. At least skin the cars with something that looks stock.
Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote:A chicane would do the trick.
I was thinking gravel traps on the apron of the track. Put it about 40 feet inside of the apron. Make it deep so the cars won't catch an edge and flip.
Other ideas..
smaller displacement engines with larger restrictor plates. But you might end up at about the same speed they are racing at now.
Make the wing on the trunk smaller. Less downforce would mean that might have to drive the cars a little bit more.
Jack the cars up some. Change the ride height so the car knocks a bigger whole through the air.
Fill Daytona and Talledega with water and hold fishing competitions?
I always thought the answer should be to ditch the restrictor plates, but make them run 87 octane pump gas in an iron-block, iron-head motor.
Either that, or bring back homogolation. They can run any motor they want, using any technology they want, but it has to be EXACTLY as found in at least 2000 sold-to-the-public, 50-state legal, road-going cars sold in one model year in the past five (so, Chevy could use the LS7, provided that sometime in the past 5 years they sold 2k Z06s in one of those years - spreading the 2k cars out doesn't count). Between CAFE standards and California smog laws, there won't be any need for restrictor plates.
I saw both wrecks and was mad. I am not a NASCAR guy, to be sure, but this used to be good racing.
Not one commentator mentioned that the roof flaps failed do do EXACTLY what they are intended to do in Newmans case - no way that car should have gone over. It was an engineering error with the design of the flaps, or the car, to allow it to have so much lift going backwards like that. The old car never did that after the roof flaps were created.
He also complained about the same stuff we all complain about here. Can you imagine how frustrating it would be to finally make it into the race series you've worked your entire life towards and find it to be that?
What really bugs me is that sometime in the mid 90's, NASCAR got complaints because of the big wrecks from the drivers. They did nothing, and attracted the ANTI GRM, monster truck folks, who come to wash cars get smashed and don't particularly care who won or why. Every time they hold a race at one of those places, they endanger the lives of all of the drivers, and some of the fans, under the guise of increased safety.
Pitiful - it made me mad.
I was wondering if the new wing keeps the flaps from working like they are supposed to.
They are testing some efi systems for the near future. They should work much better with restictor plates (Look at many road racing series that run them) so hopefully that will solve the problem, but I don't know. Part of the reason you didn't have this in the past was that there were fewer good teams. After 100 miles the top 6-7 cars were laps aheasd of everyone else. While every gets excited that 43 cars have a shot at winning when you put that many cars that close together there will be some contact.
And then you get guys like JJ who rides around in the back so he can avoid the wrecks and then takes advantage when the wrecks happen or maybe it is just being clever.
I am sure the new car has aerodynamic properties that don't let the flaps work as well, but can you imagine how much money they spent on this pile? Can you imagine then not throwing it in a wind tunnel backwards?
NASCAR: Professional Wrestling with tires.
I do end up watching some of the races, because my favorite neighborhood tavern runs a "pool" on race day, and all the TVs are tuned to them. But really, I haven't enjoyed "stock" car racing in about 20 years. Call me an old fart or a fuddy-duddy (correct on both accounts), but I long for the days when tough guys drove cars that actually looked like stock cars that you could actually buy.
pitbull113 wrote:Fill Daytona and Talledega with water and hold fishing competitions?
Drain Daytona once a year for the GRM party...erm....Rolex 24.
ReverendDexter wrote:I always thought the answer should be to ditch the restrictor plates, but make them run 87 octane pump gas in an iron-block, iron-head motor.
Either that, or bring back homogolation. They can run any motor they want, using any technology they want, but it has to be EXACTLY as found in at least 2000 sold-to-the-public, 50-state legal, road-going cars sold in one model year in the past five (so, Chevy could use the LS7, provided that sometime in the past 5 years they sold 2k Z06s in one of those years - spreading the 2k cars out doesn't count). Between CAFE standards and California smog laws, there won't be any need for restrictor plates.
voted up for TRUTH
tuna55 wrote:Ain't that the truth! NASCAR has strayed too far from its roots and become another lame big-money sport. As NYG95GA said, it's pretty much professional wrestling with tires.I am not a NASCAR guy, to be sure, but this used to be good racing.
Maybe they should run 2.73:1 gears and be governed at 55 MPH? Or, if it's become that big an issue, just stop racing!
The common template was the beginning of the end to me. The new car finished it off. I don't even watch Cup races anymore. Now that the Nationwide series is going to a COT, I guess that'll free up my Saturdays (before football season) too.
A Jump!!!!
or
Build exact duplicates of Superbirds and make them all race on bias ply tires.
or
Drive STOCK CARS!!!!!!, as noted above.... what a concept!!!!
tuna55 wrote:I am sure the new car has aerodynamic properties that don't let the flaps work as well, but can you imagine how much money they spent on this pile? Can you imagine then not throwing it in a wind tunnel backwards?
It wouldn't surprise me if that was overlooked. Somewhere online there was footage of the original tests that were fun to watch. They used a jet to blow cars around at an airfield so they didn't have to worry about damaging a wind tunnel with flying parts.
NASCAR has alot of problems. Still despite all these they still bring in huge crowds to the events, more on TV and lots of merchandising. All that brings sponsors and as such gives the teams money.
Big bag wrecks in fact bring in more publicity. I am not a NASCAR fan and it would take alot to make me one. Still I don't seen anything changing.
joepaluch wrote:NASCAR has alot of problems. Still despite all these they still bring in huge crowds to the events, more on TV and lots of merchandising. All that brings sponsors and as such gives the teams money.
Big bag wrecks in fact bring in more publicity. I am not a NASCAR fan and it would take alot to make me one. Still I don't seen anything changing.
Come on, imagine the following:
Whatever car whichever manufacturer wants to bring, so long as it meets safety regs.
It must race with a variant of the engine/transmission it came with (with reasonable modifications)
75% road courses
You wouldn't watch that???
There are several series like that already, and relatively few people are lining up to watch them.
tuna55 wrote:Come on, imagine the following:
Whatever car whichever manufacturer wants to bring, so long as it meets safety regs.
It must race with a variant of the engine/transmission it came with (with reasonable modifications)
75% road courses
You wouldn't watch that???
As drivers, we would watch that. Joe America won't. He wants to see Doh-metstic small blocks turning 8,000 rpm going 200mph and gosh-darnit who let that damn tie-yoda out thar?
One thing about NASCAR is it's set up to be VERY spectator friendly. You can get your 128oz Coors light, sit down in the bleachers, and watch the whole race without moving. With a road course, you're only going to be able to see so much of the track from any one point.
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