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patgizz Dork
2/22/09 10:05 p.m.

it's a shame several challenge rules prohibit my truck (the one about tube frames and the one about fenders/hood being present and installed come to mind). but at any rate, the truck rolls, the rear suspension is done except for sway bar which i've got figured out. the motor is mounted. cab is mounted, need to figure out how long i want to make the bed, and then stupid little stuff like plumbing and wiring and such.

as we go i'm $1120 or so in since i'm using crap i had laying around and filling in the blanks as frugally as possible. in the end i'll probably have around 1700 into it counting new brake lines, fuel lines, headers and mufflers, and a trans crossmember since at this point the trans-dapt $70 one gets the job done quicker than making my own and i'm on a tight schedule.

question here - anybody know of a 68-72 mustang tubular lower control arm built to delete the strut rods? they make them for mustang II but all the ones i see for the older cars(same as late 60's torinos too) retain the strut rod setup.

MrJoshua SuperDork
2/22/09 10:11 p.m.

There is the "If we think its cool!" clause. If that fails, thats one hell of a locost.

Wally SuperDork
2/22/09 11:30 p.m.

We ran the strut rod on some of our cars with no problems. I've never seen a bolt in type replacement, although on a couple cars we welded in new mounts to use a chevelle style A arm. If there is no clearence issue I'd leave what's there. Just clean it up, and grease the bearings if so equipped.

patgizz Dork
2/23/09 7:03 a.m.

wally - the strut rods just go so far forward and i'd like to cut some more off the front of the frame but they are keeping me from doing that. i'm not opposed to running them, they're just kinda "in the way of crap"

Gimp Dork
2/23/09 8:07 a.m.

I have a set of flowmasters that used to be on the Camaro. You can have 'em if you want.

ClemSparks SuperDork
2/23/09 10:22 a.m.

I've got this piano I need to move. Let me know when you get a bed on that thing and we'll set up a time...

LOL...I said the same thing to Brian Simo when he showed up at longbeach with a street legal pre-runner.


ClemSparks SuperDork
2/23/09 10:23 a.m.


and I love the engine placement. 100% behind the front spindle. Excellent!

Wally SuperDork
2/23/09 2:05 p.m.

What if you added a crossmember under the sway bar and had the strut rods end there? You may need more of a bend from where they mount to the control arm, shorten the strut rod, and put a rod end on the chassis end of the rod

patgizz Dork
2/23/09 2:24 p.m.

thats what i've been thinking - since my search turned up no off the shelf tubular replacements that delete the strut rod.

David S. Wallens
David S. Wallens Editorial Director
2/23/09 2:48 p.m.
MrJoshua wrote: There is the "If we think its cool!" clause. If that fails, thats one hell of a locost.

Yeah, you guys keep forgetting that we just want to see cool low-buck cars. All of the rules were created just to keep the others from whining.

If it's cool and cost less than $2000 to build, contact Per about running for exhibition. Or maybe we can fudge a rule in your favor.

slantvaliant Reader
2/23/09 3:01 p.m.

[homer] mmmm ... fudge .... [/homer]

Tom Heath
Tom Heath Production Editor
2/23/09 3:02 p.m.

At some point, I believe Per clarified the rules to reflect the SCCA's Solo rulebook—that is, No 4x4's, no lifted vehicles, but a 2WD pickup with a low center of gravity will be fine.

Your truck looks awfully low. I like it.

AngryCorvair Dork
2/23/09 7:22 p.m.

hey pat, the corvair LCA used a strut rod that went rearward.

PHeller Reader
2/23/09 7:54 p.m.

I wish I knew what you guys were talking about. What's a strut rod? Where's it normally found? Where are you trying to relocate it to?

Anything having to do with this truck is cooler than normal.

OOPS: A quick Google yielded that the strut rod is very similar to my 240SX tension rod.

CarKid1989 Reader
2/23/09 8:59 p.m.

PAT! I HATE YOU! Can i stop by and check it out sometime?

OH, my dad brought home a MIG today

patgizz Dork
2/23/09 9:17 p.m.

you're more than welcome to. i just got home from summit with some $40 clearance mid length headers, a couple chambered mufflers, a trans crossmember, and $6 worth of rubber motor mounts to replace the $50 worth of poly on there right now so they can go back to the engine i borrowed them from

i did get one of the bedsides cut down today, bed is going to be 65" long. dragged a galvanized piece of god knows what out of the woods to make the tailgate from, complete with bullet holes. i'm not sure quite what piece of machinery/appliance it used to be part of but at one point it was part of a makeshift wall the previous owner made between my dad's barn and garage, and my dad tossed all that back in the junk pile years ago. steel went up last year so i scrapped most of it except 2 of these panels. look like the sides of a commercial washing machine or something possibly.

CarKid1989 Reader
2/23/09 10:26 p.m.

when are you gonna be free?

CarKid1989 Reader
2/23/09 10:42 p.m.

and ummmm pat...could this be a legit DD?

thatsnowinnebago HalfDork
2/23/09 11:18 p.m.

will you be leaving the bullet holes?

patgizz Dork
2/24/09 7:22 a.m.
CarKid1989 wrote: when are you gonna be free?

thursday or friday probably anytime, saturday i'll be in akron in the morning and shaker hts early afternoon for work doing measures, sunday might be cool anytime.

i'm finishing up a big $ kitchen for a customer but my tile guy is going to be there thurs/fri so i'll probably end up back there monday.

as far as being a legit DD - i guess it depends on your tolerance. i'm not putting a radio in and may or may not do a heater. i do not have a heater in the 54 and i'm going to remedy that because in the fall the windows get frosty and that's the best time to go to the track. i'm undecided on seats but will not go with bare bones "bomber" style seats - my back needs good seats so i'll probably hit the pullapart to find some. i'll put seatbelts in it because i feel unsafe without them. it will have turn signals and stuff for safety reasons but no fancy column or anything - as it goes i'm reusing the column from the stock car which is just a 3/4" deal with hex end, quick release hub, etc... also reusing the dual master cylinder setup from the stock car if i can get rebuild kits for them.

the 42 is going to be more of a daily driver truck, i foresee using it for non winter use when done relegating the P71 to winter beater status. vortec 4200 w/ EFI, 4L60-e, heat, comfortable interior, ride of a stock c10.

bullet holes are staying

patgizz Dork
2/25/09 10:17 p.m.

got some stuff done today. pics to follow. trans crossmember in, one frame dimension corrected(took for granted that the original frame was square when i put the new rails in but they built it 3/4" off)

bought a radiator shell/grill from a 1917 willys overland truck, figured out what i'm doing with the front strut rods, test fit the clearance $40 headers and only have to modify the drivers side one.

tomorrow i'm going to try to build the driveshaft tunnel and bed and mod the header.

also: high bidder on the following:


thatsnowinnebago HalfDork
2/26/09 1:04 a.m.

nice, you've got a pretty sweet collection of old trucks going

Luke Dork
2/26/09 4:02 a.m.

Awesome project! A proper grassroots rat-rod type build.

And good luck on that panel van auction. In its current state of disrepair, and with no side windows, that old heap looks positively scary.

wheels777 HalfDork
2/26/09 6:33 a.m.

The single most important rule is rule number 1. It is an editorial event. It should be taken with a certain spirit in mind. You should play well with others. You should not behave poorly.

Rule #1. This Challenge is designed and run as an editorial event for a privately owned magazine. As such, the rules and event should be taken with a certain spirit in mind. In other words, all entrants should play well with others. It will make the event much more pleasant for all of those involved. Grassroots Motorsports reserves the right to refuse entry to any individuals or teams. Individuals or teams that behave in a manner that reflects poorly on this event or the magazine will be immediately disqualified and their entries will be removed from the editorial write-up.

That said. Read rule number 8 carefully.

Rule #8. All major body panels of the car that are being used as a foundation for the Challenge car must be present on the car. This includes the floor pan, inner fender panels, hoods, fenders, roof, sills, etc. Bumpers may be removed or replaced. Full frame cars must retain their full frame, while unibody or subframe cars must retain their full floor pans, subframes and the like. Exceptions to this rule are listed in Rule #9.

The last sentence says “Exceptions to this rule are listed in Rule #9.

Rule #9. Modifications may be made to the original unibody or body and body panels and frame for engine and suspension swaps and modifications, but only to the extent neccessary to perform the change. This can include removing portions of the stock unibody and frame and replacing them with corresponding sections from a donor production car.

Read a little deeper, if you swap the engine or modify the suspension (Rule #9) you can remove portions of the body to the extent necessary to perform the change. If you use portions of the original body panels to complete the engine or suspension swap, the pieces are present and on the car (Rule #8). The extent necessary is subject to interpretation. However, you have to own the vehicle when the event is over and you want to invest your time in something you want (Rule #1). If it is not what you want, are you going to invest the time and make it worth writing about? (Rule #1). If you build what you want within the guidelines of the rules, the end product is more fun and you will likely finish it (Rule#1).

IMO, “extent necessary” includes safety, and chassis stiffness to handle the engine swap (more power) and suspension mods (more forces). Ultimately, Per has the only vote, but I want to see you compete. Your car is under $200X. Reread rule #1. FWIW, Rat Rods and Jalopies are appreciated in this crowd.

wheels777 HalfDork
2/26/09 6:33 a.m.

Double post

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