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Oct. 22, 2009 9:56 a.m. kreb Dork

Ever since running the California Melee in my friend's Olds/Alfa I've had this hankering for a fast vintage car to play with. Visions of a Volvo 544, Alfa Duetto, and an XKE have played through my mind, then another thought:

61-63 Falcon. Small for an american car of the period. 2650 lbs. stock. Many parts directly interchangeable with 1st gen mustangs.

Hmmmmm.

I used to have a 64 Ranchero, so I pretty well know what needs to be done to make one of these civilized, but I don't have a budget yet. There are a ton of aftermarket sources out there, but the top names all seem fairly pricey. I don't want to drop a grand correcting the front suspension geometry if I can help it. Same goes for a quick-ratio steering box. Any tips from the early pony car crowd?
Oct. 22, 2009 10:11 a.m. kreb Dork

btw - there's some neat info and pictures on what one of these can be like here:

http://www.ford-forums.com/ford-falcon/14893-nz-falcon-road-racer.html
Oct. 22, 2009 10:12 a.m. Rad_Capz New Reader

Buy someones Mustang road race/ g-machine/pro-touring wannabe project they gave up on and keep what you need and part out the rest. There's a lot of abandoned projects for sale right now people spent big money to buy all the parts for but can't finish.
Oct. 22, 2009 10:15 a.m. EvanB HalfDork

I have had the same idea many times. I think it is much cooler to see a race-prepped Falcon than a similar Mustang.
Oct. 22, 2009 10:33 a.m. kreb Dork

Rad_Capz wrote:

Buy someones Mustang road race/ g-machine/pro-touring wannabe project they gave up on and keep what you need and part out the rest. There's a lot of abandoned projects for sale right now people spent big money to buy all the parts for but can't finish.

Great idea! Where would you suggest I look?
Oct. 22, 2009 11:46 a.m. BoxheadTim Reader

kreb wrote:

btw - there's some neat info and pictures on what one of these can be like here:

http://www.ford-forums.com/ford-falcon/14893-nz-falcon-road-racer.html

I likes.
Oct. 22, 2009 11:55 a.m. petegossett Dork

You could always buy my 62 Tempest LeMans. I had similar plans for it, but this building remodel will be keeping me busy for a few years. I'd sell it to another GRMer for $1750.
Oct. 22, 2009 12:12 p.m. ClemSparks UberDork

A round body 2 door falcon is on my short list of cars to own in my life. Seems like the front end is generally said to be the weakest link from a handling perspective. Seems like someone ought to make parts to make the front end work a little bit better in stock-ish configuration (IE, something that doesn't require a mustang II front end). Maybe they do...but it also seems it should be doable for not much money...

Clem
Oct. 22, 2009 12:39 p.m. 914Driver SuperDork

Is the first generation Mustang the same platform?

Dan
Oct. 22, 2009 1:05 p.m. MadScientistMatt Dork

Yep, same platform as the first gen Mustang. There's a pretty common mod that relocates the upper control arm pickup points and supposedly makes a huge handling difference - there's even templates for it on the Internet.
Oct. 22, 2009 1:09 p.m. ClemSparks UberDork

MadScientistMatt wrote: there's even templates for it on the Internet.

On the internet! Where is it?

J/K...bad "Airplane" humor

Clem
Oct. 22, 2009 2:57 p.m. DeadSkunk New Reader

Google "Shelby drop" and you should be able to find the suspension modification. On 1st gen Mustangs it moves the upper A-arm mounting holes down 1 inch and back an eighth, IIRC. Template can be made from a piece of any 1/8 flat stock.
Oct. 22, 2009 4:06 p.m. MadScientistMatt Dork

It's a distributed net of servers located all over the world, but that's not important right now.

(Even worse "Airplane" humor.)
Oct. 23, 2009 1:01 a.m. CLNSC3 Reader

Sounds like an awesome project! I look forward to seeing updates if you decide to go through with it!
Oct. 23, 2009 8:14 a.m. HappyAndy Reader

I love '63 falcons! I will have one some day and my dream is to make it a LaCarrera rally car. BTW you might want to check with the experts before trying to start swapping mustang parts because they are similar, but not all parts are directly interchangable, also the Shelby drop can be done to an early falcon, but I wouldn't assume that the same template for a mustang is the one to use for a pre '65 falcon; post "65 is probably 100% interchangable execpt for the front shocks (different upper mounts). I've had several vintage mustangs and one falcon, the falcon is the only one that I miss dearborn classics is a good source for sixties falcon parts, they are actualy pretty good for all '50s/'60s/'70s note-worthy fomoco cars that aren't mustangs.
Oct. 23, 2009 9:46 a.m. kreb Dork

The question is whether to try to stay period to be eligible for vintage classes or go restomod and do what you want. That's a tough one. It'd be fun to build up a race 260 and track down vintage speed parts, but it'd be cheaper and less hassle to not concern oneself with rules or classes and just shoot for having a fun fast car.

Edit: It seems to me that one could take a Locost approach. Fab new front suspension members from scratch. throw a Panhard, paralel links and coilovers on the rear, blow out the tranny tunnel and move the motor rearward, throw a used 5.0 roller motor.....shouldn't have to be that expensive at all.

I'm starting to warm to this!
Oct. 23, 2009 3:18 p.m. pres589 Reader

To Kreb: How much "fun" would this fab new front suspension members idea be? I'm sitting here wondering if Miata isn't the answer again, swap the whole thing over, or at least as much as possible... that said, the Akerman would be screwed up, wheelbases different, etc etc so maybe this is a bad idea...

Is there an aftermarket company like Hotchkiss that supports these things? Hotchkiss doesn't, I already checked, at least a quick glance through the Fords they offer parts for doesn't include the early Falcons. I'd like to think some company does a nice front end for this thing for those of us that wouldn't want to engineer their own hardware solution.
Oct. 23, 2009 4:25 p.m. fiat22turbo UltraDork

Two words: Supra Falcon

Suprang

Or would that be Supralcon?

That is all.
Oct. 23, 2009 4:55 p.m. 4eyes Reader

Global West used to make trick upper A-arms, don't know if they still do.
Oct. 23, 2009 5:39 p.m. pres589 Reader

In reply to 4eyes:

Looks like it;

http://www.globalwest.net/1964-73_Mustang_tubular_upper_control_arms_-_Negative_Ro...

Ignore the years mentioned in the URL, they list a part back to 1961 Falcons, and it does carry it's own part number. Not cheap but not stupidly costly for what you get, I think.

Team that with this; http://www.globalwest.net/1964-73_Mustang_performace_lower_control_arms.htm

There are other bits there besides this but I think this starts to paint a prettier picture. I don't know what spindle these things require or what's available, I would want to convert to a decent sized disc brake setup at the same time, and there's the question of inline six parts vs. V8, etc etc to answer.
Oct. 24, 2009 5:40 a.m. ultraclyde Reader

Man, that's FANTASTIC. I wanna play, I wanna play! Next you're going to suggest starting with a 63 ranchero and running long exposed cage bars into the bed with high mounted auxillary radiator and fan...
Oct. 24, 2009 7:36 a.m. DeadSkunk New Reader

So, Global West uses the same part number for early Falcons and the 1st gen Mustang. They also send the template to relocate the A-arm mounting holes, which I'm assuming is the same as the "Shelby drop" for both vehicles. Pretty easy way to make a Falcon handle better,whether you buy their tubular A-arms or not.
Oct. 24, 2009 12:00 p.m. 4eyes Reader

I can vouch for Global West's quality. Back in the early '80s when I built my '65 fastback, I used their a-arms with '67 Shelby disc brakes and spindles. I out performed '85 Mustangs and TA's in all aspects. Of course I used an export brace, monte carlo bar, bigger sway bar and lowered stiffer springs. If you lower stock a-arms it will bust the ball joints at full droop.
Oct. 25, 2009 1:07 a.m. Opus Dork

MadScientistMatt wrote:

It's a distributed net of servers located all over the world, but that's not important right now.

(Even worse "Airplane" humor.)

Surely you cant be serious
Oct. 25, 2009 1:09 a.m. Opus Dork

kreb wrote:

btw - there's some neat info and pictures on what one of these can be like here:

http://www.ford-forums.com/ford-falcon/14893-nz-falcon-road-racer.html

Like the car, but that falcon looks different from the US model. May be the NZ in the address.

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