Ed Higginbotham
Ed Higginbotham Associate Editor
8/7/17 4:02 p.m.

https://www.youtube.com/embed/kwy7YZ5EYSs

Curbs on race tracks can be bumpy.

Ride onboard with Josh Vieira from Track Monkey Apparel as he races around Virginia International Raceway (VIR) in his 1987 Porsche 944 during our 2017 Tire Rack Ultimate Track Car Challenge.

Learn more about the Tire Rack UTCC here

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kevlarcorolla
kevlarcorolla Dork
8/7/17 5:22 p.m.

Is that shifter just sitting in a bowl of jello under the car?

I avoid all curbs with my torsen diff'd track miata,they don't like curbs much.

Stefan
Stefan MegaDork
8/7/17 5:49 p.m.

In reply to kevlarcorolla:

The 944's shifter base is mounted to the top of the torque tube, the linkage runs to the transaxle in the rear and the torque tube connects the engine to the transaxle.

The shifter is known to wear out due to the vibrations and the transaxle mounts aren't terribly strong and motor mounts can fail and not be easily noticed.

I suspect a refreshed linkage and shifter with a poly-filled transaxle mount and new engine mounts would go a long way to reducing that effect.

Vigo
Vigo UltimaDork
8/7/17 6:43 p.m.
I avoid all curbs with my torsen diff'd track miata,they don't like curbs much.

Can you describe what happens? I can vaguely imagine that it would cause a noticable symptom but i can't really figure what it is..

kevlarcorolla
kevlarcorolla Dork
8/7/17 6:47 p.m.

In reply to Vigo:

Diff go boom....

GameboyRMH
GameboyRMH MegaDork
8/7/17 8:33 p.m.

Looks like he hit many crub but no fents, burshes or bricks

With 650lb/in springs and sketchy Taiwanese shock valving, I generally keep off the curbs...

Robbie
Robbie UberDork
8/8/17 7:30 a.m.

There was a hole at a track in Colorado I used to go to (Pueblo) where there was no curb. Apex point was dirt. That dirt wore away into a hole.

If you did it right, you could hook the inside of your tires on the edge of the track surface and gain a few mph corner speed. Really unnerving though, and if you were depending on it and missed you would be off.

And I gotta believe it was hard on the car.

kevlarcorolla
kevlarcorolla Dork
8/8/17 6:37 p.m.

In reply to Robbie:

We do the same at our ice races,its a flooded track(every week) and the non studded guys will scrub the inside bank until they uncover the raised edge of the ice under the bank.

And yes if you do it just right it works great,do it wrong and lots of bad things can happen....or you break balljoints/tie rod ends and bad things happen even if you hook it just right so ya takes yer chances.

Vigo
Vigo UltimaDork
8/8/17 10:59 p.m.

In reply to kevlarcorolla:

Im trying not to make any correlations between your last post and the one previous about a blown up part.

Thanks for the reply btw. I'm still turning it over in my head..

Tom1200
Tom1200 HalfDork
8/8/17 11:28 p.m.

I actually started laughing because in the first part of the video I was trying to figure out why he was being so dainty with the curbing. I pound the curbs mercilessly but I've got built suspension and a touring car driver brain.

Tom

dean1484
dean1484 MegaDork
8/9/17 1:01 p.m.

I like my ball joints and suspension components to remain. It would b interesting to see if keeping it off the curbs and smooth is faster. Unless there is money to be had at the end I tend to think more of car preservation. I think this comes from my endurance racing background.

GameboyRMH
GameboyRMH MegaDork
8/9/17 1:06 p.m.
Robbie wrote: There was a hole at a track in Colorado I used to go to (Pueblo) where there was no curb. Apex point was dirt. That dirt wore away into a hole. If you did it right, you could hook the inside of your tires on the edge of the track surface and gain a few mph corner speed. Really unnerving though, and if you were depending on it and missed you would be off. And I gotta believe it was hard on the car.

In stage rally they call that curb/gutter/ditch hooking, and it is bad for just about everything in the suspension. Also seen on Initial D!

Huckleberry
Huckleberry MegaDork
8/9/17 1:22 p.m.
Robbie wrote: There was a hole at a track in Colorado I used to go to (Pueblo) where there was no curb. Apex point was dirt. That dirt wore away into a hole. If you did it right, you could hook the inside of your tires on the edge of the track surface and gain a few mph corner speed. Really unnerving though, and if you were depending on it and missed you would be off. And I gotta believe it was hard on the car.

The turn 3/4 combo at NJMP is like that - and when sprint racing there it's a couple 10ths worth of time. If you do it just right and gently place the tire against the inside lip it's not that hard on the car but if you come slamming into it you can bend things pretty easily. We had a for-pay driver in our enduro car ruin a wheel and unseat the tire being hamfisted with it.

If you it during an open track day though, they black flag you and yell because they don't much care for racers coming in and scaring the other drivers or throwing sand all over the track to eek out a few extra 10ths. So, you can only practice the timing in race practice. Spoilsports, the lot of them

kb58
kb58 Dork
8/9/17 1:33 p.m.
Robbie wrote: There was a hole at a track in Colorado I used to go to (Pueblo) where there was no curb. Apex point was dirt. That dirt wore away into a hole. If you did it right, you could hook the inside of your tires on the edge of the track surface and gain a few mph corner speed. Really unnerving though, and if you were depending on it and missed you would be off. And I gotta believe it was hard on the car.

There was a chunk of asphalt missing from the apex in Turn 9 at Willow Springs - a scary decreasing-radius turn taken at high speed. If you hit it just right and had the car loaded up, you wouldn't feel a thing because the tire flew right over the top of the missing section. I can only conclude that you guys just drive slow

kevlarcorolla
kevlarcorolla Dork
8/9/17 6:17 p.m.
Vigo wrote: In reply to kevlarcorolla: Im trying not to make any correlations between your last post and the one previous about a blown up part. Thanks for the reply btw. I'm still turning it over in my head..

Comparing a borked ball joint on a rusty old ice racer to the need to find another $800 torsen diff for the miata is apples to oranges.

The torsen diffs will spin the inside rear under power like an open diff after popping a curb,when it touches down it can 'splode.

I popped a curb at mosport yrs ago with my turbo AE86 and showed many people the complete underside of the car...never came closer to rolling without actually rolling.

So now I'm a little more reserved with curb useage.

GameboyRMH
GameboyRMH MegaDork
8/9/17 6:37 p.m.
kevlarcorolla wrote: I popped a curb at mosport yrs ago with my turbo AE86 and showed many people the complete underside of the car...never came closer to rolling without actually rolling. So now I'm a little more reserved with curb useage.

Ken Block popped a curb on my local track and DID flip, and that was in a GRC car!

https://www.youtube.com/embed/e2Z6vS_fMc0

(Although to be fair, this track has huge Zolder-style curbs)

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