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  • dankspeed

    Jan. 15, 2012 7:34 a.m. dankspeed Reader

    Just some thoughts on this debate. In reality if manufacturers and corporations stopped outsourcing jobs to other countries and more americans could be put back to work and unemployment would return to a more acceptable percentage then the noise we're all making over illegals would go away or at least quiet down. There's plenty of blame to go around.

    1. I think it's perfectly reasonable for a state to require you to show your license if you're behind the wheel and you get pulled over. Driving is not a right given to you by the constitution.

    2. Why should driving without a license only be a fine? How can that officer be sure who he is giving that fine to is going to pay it? If the person he pulls over has stolen that vehicle or has borrowed a neighbors car what is to stop that person from showing the officer the registration and insurance papers he found in the glovebox. Fortunately for him he didn't have to show a state issued document that also has his photo that can be matched up his address. He'll just pitch the ticket and go on his way with the actual owner getting stuck having to go thru the courts and having to pay hundreds or thousands having to right this and prove himself innocent because others feel it's their right to not have to follow the laws and prove who they are.

    3. Are the people complaining in internet forums writing their state reps or governor about this? I doubt most are.

    4. The governor is trying to drive illegals out of his state the easiest way he can. Although there might be better ways to do so I would suggest he is trying to help the common working person in his state.

    5. The only other way to drive illegals out is to push mass fines on the corporations that hire illegals and carry out raids in order to prove they're hiring them. Sadly this will only drive those corporations to another state that is less likely to fine and carry out raids. So now you get to drive around your state without a license and feel good about it but now you have have have no where to drive to because your job went bye bye.

    6. Write your elected officials and put pressure on them to pass laws that tax corporations less and make it more desirable to not move they're workforce out of the us. Notice I say less and not at all. I'm all for closing loop holes that make it possible for some corporations to pay zero taxes.

    7. Stop buying goods made in other countries, stop buying from stores that only stock goods made in other countries. I realize those goods are more expensive but you're voting with your dollar and if we all did it we'd see us and our neighbors benefit.

    That is all. Again just my thoughts.

  • Salanis

    Jan. 15, 2012 7:40 a.m. Salanis SuperDork

    DaewooOfDeath wrote:

    I've studied this a lot, and aside from the "we don't like them because we don't like them" and "laws are perfect and sacred" arguments, there's really not much of a reason to go after illegals at all.

    Dey tuk er Jerrrrrrbs!

  • wbjones

    Jan. 15, 2012 9:08 a.m. wbjones SuperDork

    dankspeed wrote:

    1. I'm all for closing loop holes that make it possible for some corporations to pay zero taxes.

    only one disagreement with any of what you wrote....

    regardless of loop holes or no loop holes corporations don't pay taxes.... whether those taxes are high or low... they just incorporate them into the final price of whatever product of service they're selling ... the consumer or the next level manufacturer has to absorb the tax ... if it's a next level manufacturer then it's a: taxed again and b: passed on again ....

    corporations don't pay taxes

  • dankspeed

    Jan. 15, 2012 9:25 a.m. dankspeed Reader

    wbjones wrote:

    dankspeed wrote:

    1. I'm all for closing loop holes that make it possible for some corporations to pay zero taxes.

    only one disagreement with any of what you wrote....

    regardless of loop holes or no loop holes corporations don't pay taxes.... whether those taxes are high or low... they just incorporate them into the final price of whatever product of service they're selling ... the consumer or the next level manufacturer has to absorb the tax ... if it's a next level manufacturer then it's a: taxed again and b: passed on again ....

    corporations don't pay taxes

    I get what you're saying but they still pay taxes they just take what ever money they have to pay and build that into the cost of manufacturing their good or providing their service. I get that but they still pay it. In theory if a corporation is paying 15% instead of 30% in taxes then the cost they pass along to the consumer is less. NOTICE i say "in theory" because I'll admit some corporations will fail to pass that savings they'll receive onto the consumer. This is all off topic from the original topic so I'll stop now.

  • BoxheadTim

    Jan. 15, 2012 11:04 a.m. BoxheadTim SuperDork

    Otto Maddox wrote:

    I don't want to live where I have to carry identification in order to...well, live, basically.

    Some of us already have to - by law I have to carry my Green Card everywhere and can get into a lot of trouble and expense in a lot of cases (IIRC the fine is something like a grand or so) if I don't, yet I'm under the impression that the police can't ask to see it in a lot of cases, even though they can ask to see my drivers license. USCIS aka La Migra obviously can ask to see my GC.

    And a Green Card is much harder and a lot more expensive to replace than a drivers license, so a lot of perfectly legal immigrants loathe to carry it.

    That's not a complaint by the way, I knew this beforehand. Having grown up in Germany I'm kinda used to carry an ID card even though I grew up during the leftie terrorist scare of the 70s and 80s that brought out some of the worst "stick a submachine gun into the perps, errr, citizen's face and ask to see the papers" type excesses.

    To lighten the mood a little, did you know that the recent Green Cards come with an official tinfoil hat? My understanding is that they're RFID enabled and they come with a metal lined little envelope that's you're supposed to carry it in.

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