Berkeley Bans Gas

Berkeley California becomes the first US City to Ban the Use of Natural Gas in new homes.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/berkeley-becomes-first-us-city-to-ban-natural-gas-in-new-buildings/ar-AAEt30j?ocid=spartandhp

I'm outraged at the outrage that fits my narrative.

What the Berkeley?

Berkeley that.

And here I thought they were actually trying to make things safer due to earthquakes. 

Now pondering a business plan for setting up a coal and home heating oil delivery service in Berkeley.

The money allocated for implementing the ban seems excessive. 

Sounds like something that Berkeley would do. If you said they banned gasoline powered cars, I would not be surprised at all.

For those that do not know Natural gas is pretty much ubiquitous in CA home for ovens stoves, heating and power generation (you can probably draw your own logical conclusion here). Of course, there are renewables, but they still make up a relatively small percentage.

BTW: Berkeley is build out, the number of new home build there has to be very tiny.

My first thought:  "Who is 'Bans gas'?"

aircooled said:

Sounds like something that Berkeley would do. If you said they banned gasoline powered cars, I would not be surprised at all.

For those that do not know Natural gas is pretty much ubiquitous in CA home for ovens stoves, heating and power generation (you can probably draw your own logical conclusion here). Of course, there are renewables, but they still make up a relatively small percentage.

BTW: Berkeley is build out, the number of new home build there has to be very tiny.

Basically the same here in OK, with the exception of apartment buildings. 

Would burning the same amount of natural gas in a powerplant, transmitting the electricity down the lines, and using it to run an induction cooktop give out more heat? There's a huge exergy loss by using a 2000*C heat source to heat something to 100-180*C, and if getting close to the Carnot limit in the plant and converting the electrical energy to heat at a low temperature by induction is more efficient, they might be on to something here. 

Interesting. My thoughts on it:

• This is mostly just for headline porn. Probably very little effect; if this was Charlotte or San Antonio where a new home goes up every other hour, it would matter, but here, not much. Obviously we have the first step in place for a full ban though.
• This also doesn't matter much because they don't have winter. I know it is "northern" California, but how much gas for heating do they really use? 
• In terms of actual environmental impact, this may have a negative impact. Unless they're using all renewable energy, I'd assume that the electric water heaters and stoves are being fed primarily by either natural gas or coal fired power plants. But this is an assumption, I'm not familiar with Berkely (or any California locale) power.

I don't really care what they ban in Berkeley. That is a place I would never live and doubt I would even visit at this point. They can have it.

chaparral said:

Would burning the same amount of natural gas in a powerplant, transmitting the electricity down the lines, and using it to run an induction cooktop give out more heat? There's a huge exergy loss by using a 2000*C heat source to heat something to 100-180*C, and if getting close to the Carnot limit in the plant and converting the electrical energy to heat at a low temperature by induction is more efficient, they might be on to something here. 

I don't think it's efficiency, I think it's about emissions. I'd never considered the amount of emissions that comes out of a naked natural gas flame, but I'll bet it's non-trivial. Interesting concept - but you'd never get my wife to give up her gas stove for an induction cooktop.

How will they heat their pools? Electric seems...expensive.

I think it'll have to be by nuclear fusion and reflectors. 

When I read that I thought how are they gonna do that?  What if you've eaten a burrito for lunch??  lol!

In reply to mtn :

My sister lives near Berkeley. The number of days she uses her furnace a year is bery limited. Maybe a little in the morning a couple weeks in February or so.  Probably 20 hours of use total a year?

Fueled by Caffeine said:

In reply to mtn :

My sister lives near Berkeley. The number of days she uses her furnace a year is bery limited. Maybe a little in the morning a couple weeks in February or so.  Probably 20 hours of use total a year?

Thanks for the real-world data, stops me from doing a google search! 

Guess I can't fill up my E36 M3 in Berkeley. 

They are also banning manholes and firemen.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/no-more-manholes-berkeley-california-removes-all-gendered-language-city-n1031131

dclafleur said:

The money allocated for implementing the ban seems excessive. 

Somebody’s spouse needs a Gov teat to suckle on.  

Similar thing happening in downstate NY but for different reasons.  They have maxed out the infrastructure and the utility company says no new hookups.  Guess they can't just turn up the pressure. 

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/21/nyregion/con-ed-natural-gas.html

Keith Tanner said:

How will they heat their pools? Electric seems...expensive.

Heat pump. They are very efficient. 

If their concern is reducing emissions then this makes sense.  Especially since their aim is to get all their electricity from renewable sources in a relatively short amount of time, and to stick to the paris accord to help keep this planet from melting.  My only complaint would be that cooking on a gas stove is great compared to pretty much everything else, but I'll freely admit I've never cooked on an induction stove before.  Who knows, it could be awesome.

Also I've noticed when people have to give up a tiny bit of convenience for a good cause they seem to lose their minds.  

Keith Tanner said:

....How will they heat their pools? Electric seems...expensive.

You have clearly have never been to Berkley.   I would not be surprised to find zero residential pools there.

Of note, there are no coal plants in CA, soon to be no nukes, and eventually (by plan) no natural gas plants... (insert obvious question here)