I'm not getting into the whole patriot act flounder but I would certainly have stuck that thing to the vehicle of someone else. Like a reporter for a major news outlet.
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Oct. 9, 2010 9:58 a.m. Giant Purple Snorklewacker SuperDork
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Oct. 9, 2010 10:29 a.m. carguy123 SuperDork
slipperly slope buddy.. So you're saying.. its OK to track and kill certain citizens but not others.
YES! Because not everyone is contemplating or planning a terrorist attack. If you kill everyone you send confusing signals. You need to kill only the ones planning the attacks then no one is confused and they realize that plan or carry out a terrorist attack is BAD.
moral lesson over.
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Oct. 9, 2010 10:30 a.m. 914Driver SuperDork
Could it be that the real criminal spotted the thing under his car and just stuck it to some chick's Neon next to him in the parking lot?
Dan
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Oct. 9, 2010 11:48 a.m. ignorant SuperDork
carguy123 wrote:
slipperly slope buddy.. So you're saying.. its OK to track and kill certain citizens but not others.
YES! Because not everyone is contemplating or planning a terrorist attack. If you kill everyone you send confusing signals. You need to kill only the ones planning the attacks then no one is confused and they realize that plan or carry out a terrorist attack is BAD.
moral lesson over.
who determines who to kill.. who is a bad man? Am I a bad man if I try to run in an election against the current president? What if my political party falls out of favor or is more popular than the current president? Do they off me because I am an enemy of the state?
what happens when you have a WMD oopsie and realize that your premise for offing someone was incorrect..
no trial..
no notification that you are being charged with a crime?
Come on. We're the US we're supposed to be better than this.
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Oct. 9, 2010 12:13 p.m. poopshovel SuperDork
If it's true, it's berkeleying frightening. Though it seems the author of the article can't properly put a sentence together, so I'm wondering how legitimate the whole thing is.
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Oct. 9, 2010 1:49 p.m. tuna55 Dork
Do Iggy and I have to agree again? What is happening to us, man?
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Oct. 9, 2010 5:31 p.m. Jensenman SuperDork
ignorant wrote:
carguy123 wrote:
slipperly slope buddy.. So you're saying.. its OK to track and kill certain citizens but not others.
YES! Because not everyone is contemplating or planning a terrorist attack. If you kill everyone you send confusing signals. You need to kill only the ones planning the attacks then no one is confused and they realize that plan or carry out a terrorist attack is BAD.
moral lesson over.
who determines who to kill.. who is a bad man? Am I a bad man if I try to run in an election against the current president? What if my political party falls out of favor or is more popular than the current president? Do they off me because I am an enemy of the state?
Nope, because you are going through the established channels to make changes. You can start a political campaign and run against any politician you don't like, whoop and scream and holler and call the Prez nasty names, butcher his picture with Photoshop and send it all over the Web and in many other ways act like an immature idiot if you so choose. That is the great freedom of this country.
Now, if you decide to stick a scope on a rifle and start popping away at the Prez because you don't like his policies, you have just stepped way over the line. You have just put a target on your back.
ignorant wrote: what happens when you have a WMD oopsie and realize that your premise for offing someone was incorrect..
no trial..
Ah yes. Figured this would come up again, and again a reminder: that wonderful organization the UN decided that WMD probably existed. 'Nuff said on that one.
ignorant wrote:
no notification that you are being charged with a crime?
I would venture to guess that the guy in Yemen is pretty well aware that he's committed crimes. He has already said he sent the Detroit underwear bomber. Is that not enough?
Concerning our hero the GPS dude... as I said, we don't know the whole story. In any ongoing criminal investigation, the last thing you want is for the subject of that investigation to have any idea you are being watched very closely. Using the dope dealer analogy, should we send a registered letter to some dope kingpin in Mexico letting him know he's being watched? Or maybe putting a squad car to following a murder suspect? How about the Wall Street guys who raped the economy? Sure, shoot them an Email so they will know they are being checked out. Yeah, that would really help the investigations.
ignorant wrote: Come on. We're the US we're supposed to be better than this.
Actually, we are. We are fighting an aboveground war with the usual instruments of war. The enemy is hiding among women and children (and sometimes even sending them to do dirty work such as homicide bombing), knowing full well that any collateral damage to same is a great way to warp public opinion. THAT is the definition of slime.
If it is true the CIA has this bastard in Yemen in their sights, well, I won't shed a tear.
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Oct. 9, 2010 5:39 p.m. MikeSVO Reader
TJ wrote:
We have turned into a nation of lawless assassins. We've been essentially murdering people with our cool little remotely operated planes for years now. No trial, no arrest, no chance to defend yourself, you just all of a sudden get blowed up. It's a ok in my book if we did it as part of war, but we haven't declared a war so we are not in a war.
The reason why I sort of choose to not really take a particular stance is because you can't really be too sure of the info you read on the all knowing internet. That being said, there IS a lot of pretty (very) disturbing video out there that backs up the stuff I've read. And yes, I know, even that can only be trusted so much.
Having said that, you think WE'RE bad? The guys we're blowing up are, IMO, straight-up brainwashed, twisted mofos. Again, IMO.
That's not to say we're saints! I know we're not. I wish we could just back off and make them not want to blow us up anymore. I'm sure there's some really awesome political reason why we can't do that. I'll be the first to tell you that I'm not exactly aware of the entire situation.
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Oct. 9, 2010 6:55 p.m. Strizzo SuperDork
the original story i read said the guy's late father was "involved in the muslim religious community and was being watched closely by the fbi" it also said that the kids car had been impounded by the fbi for three months, which is when he thinks it was placed on the vehicle.
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Oct. 10, 2010 6:38 a.m. ignorant SuperDork
Jensenman wrote:
ignorant wrote:
no notification that you are being charged with a crime?
I would venture to guess that the guy in Yemen is pretty well aware that he's committed crimes. He has already said he sent the Detroit underwear bomber. Is that not enough?
Then charge him extradite him and put him up for trial.. Or do some backdoor rendition crap.
I also didn't mean to bring up the WMD stuff to poke at an old wound, the point is people make mistakes and our courtsystem (while not perfect), helps to filter some of that out.
again, who has the right to kill another american citizen without being charged for murder in an undeclared war?
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Oct. 10, 2010 6:38 a.m. ignorant SuperDork
tuna55 wrote:
Do Iggy and I have to agree again? What is happening to us, man?
ha ha..
nothing. I just like arguing.
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Oct. 10, 2010 7:44 a.m. Jensenman SuperDork
Charge/extradite? Back door rendition? The guy is hiding in the mountains in Yemen. He picked that spot because he won't be easy to find, just like Osama bin Laden. OBL is the reason we are doing Predator strikes in Pakistan. al-Awlaki is the reason the same thing is happening in Yemen, with the cooperation of that country's military.
Also, the alleged CIA list is called a 'kill/capture' list. Meaning it's very possible that he could be captured and returned to the US for trial. Of course, if they drop him and break him on the way home, no tears from me. In fact, I have a really big glue trap and dustbin that I'll happily donate.
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Oct. 10, 2010 8:06 a.m. moparman76_69 None
In reply to Strizzo:
I'd call BS, if the FBI had his car for three months it would have been so hidden nobody would ever find it.
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Oct. 10, 2010 10:02 a.m. ignorant SuperDork
Jensenman wrote:
Charge/extradite? Back door rendition? The guy is hiding in the mountains in Yemen. He picked that spot because he won't be easy to find, just like Osama bin Laden. OBL is the reason we are doing Predator strikes in Pakistan. al-Awlaki is the reason the same thing is happening in Yemen, with the cooperation of that country's military.
Also, the alleged CIA list is called a 'kill/capture' list. Meaning it's very possible that he could be captured and returned to the US for trial. Of course, if they drop him and break him on the way home, no tears from me. In fact, I have a really big glue trap and dustbin that I'll happily donate.
Ok.. so now it's ok to kill american citizens without a trial. If it happens, Then it's legal precedent. Great... W000000. Yay America.
Would it have been ok to do the same thing to Koresh? or those Montana Militia guys? Probably not, I mean they are on american soil and we have some appereces to keep up.
Crap like this is exactly why people hate us around the world.. We speak out of both sides of our mouths. We're the freedom loving great country that accepts the rule of law and a bunch of rights in the constitution (1)...
- Void where prohibited by undisclosed persons with undisclosed agenda
Really if this guy is such a bad dude, then present the case in court... Revoke his citizenship then kill him. but don't go around killing citizens.. This E36 M3 wouldn't fly in any state and it shouldn't fly around the world.
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Oct. 10, 2010 8:07 p.m. Jensenman SuperDork
'YOU'LL NEVER TAKE ME ALIVE, COPPERS!'
Just grantin' his wish.
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Oct. 10, 2010 9:56 p.m. Appleseed SuperDork
Throw it in a septic tank.
"I know where it is. But you guys aren't gonna like it."
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Oct. 11, 2010 7:42 a.m. spitfirebill Dork
Toyman01 wrote:
You'd think the FBI could afford something a little smaller.
Or at least hide it better.
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Oct. 11, 2010 7:56 a.m. FlightService New Reader
He should have taken it immediately to the news and asked the owners to contact them at the studio.
Would have been fun.
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Oct. 11, 2010 8:02 a.m. John Brown SuperDork
"What if" someone found it on their vehicle and hastily strapped it under Affifis vehicle like we were joking about strapping it under a bus. There are various reasons that can be attributed to how the device came to be on his car. The trick is to find out WHO was reading the location.
BTW, if I am not mistaken, it is much easier to track someone through their GPS unit than adding another piece on to the car.
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Oct. 11, 2010 11:50 a.m. jeffmx5 Reader
John Brown wrote:
"What if" someone found it on their vehicle and hastily strapped it under Affifis vehicle like we were joking about strapping it under a bus. There are various reasons that can be attributed to how the device came to be on his car. The trick is to find out WHO was reading the location.
BTW, if I am not mistaken, it is much easier to track someone through their GPS unit than adding another piece on to the car.
A GPS nav unit is receive-only, there is no way to track a Garmin nuvi. Your cellphone or OnStar on the other hand is a handy tracking device with bonus points for doubling as a covert microphone.
