TopNoodles said:I find it bizarre that people associate yellow emojis with white skin. I know it happens but my skin is not even close to that color. It's just odd to me.
I don't. Ever watched the Simpsons? They're CLEARLY white, even though Matt Groening went out of his way to make them chrome yellow with blue hair. Dr. Hibbert is black, Apu is brown, and everyone 'white' is 'yellow'.
I ask this question honestly. Is this ad explicitly racist, or just appealing to a certain market?
I'm bothered people finding something to bitch about in everything even if it's not there.
But if this is the new outrage, must mean Covid is dying down.
Streetwiseguy said:I ask this question honestly. Is this ad explicitly racist, or just appealing to a certain market?
Maybe anyone that has a dream of being a star?
Streetwiseguy said:I ask this question honestly. Is this ad explicitly racist, or just appealing to a certain market?
Unfortunately it will get explained as targeting a certain market (and there is nothing wrong with that) but if you did the same thing targeting a "White" market, it'll be called racist. You can target anything except a White market, because people will say "all other ads target the white market so there is no need for a specific one"
Duke said:TopNoodles said:I find it bizarre that people associate yellow emojis with white skin. I know it happens but my skin is not even close to that color. It's just odd to me.
I don't. Ever watched the Simpsons? They're CLEARLY white, even though Matt Groening went out of his way to make them chrome yellow with blue hair. Dr. Hibbert is black, Apu is brown, and everyone 'white' is 'yellow'.
This isn't about the actual hue of your skin. It's human nature to assign catagories, and that's what we've done with anyone that looks different. Race is an invention.
The problem is that it was, and still is used for exclusion and exploitation.
What color is my Dad? Self portrait, c. 1950.
I think the use of the word "constant" in the title of this thread is a bit inappropriate. There are a few instances of less than overt racism (likely regional marketing directors decisions) for a very large company. I don't think I would call that "constant".
I do wonder if marketing people are going to learn from this.... as in, if we make a bit of a "mistake" in our advertising, we can get a lot of publicity.
Oh good, we must have provided clean water to everyone on the planet, since we're worrying about this now.
In reply to Brett_Murphy (Forum Patrón) :
Always, I prefer a healthy open dialog. We're all ignorant about something, especially about how things make different people feel.
In reply to yupididit :
While we are having an open dialog, as a white, heterosexual man i feel like there are a lot of people and organizations looking at me as the bad guy just for being me. Happens ALL the time. I started listening to hip hop back in the Fat Boys, RUN DMC and Egyptian Lover days for the record, lol. I live in Alabama and regularly get verbally assaulted, cut off in traffic, get called racial names and receive middle fingers for being in the wrong neighborhood despite being there to instal life saving medical equipment. Guns have been pointed at me 3 ti.es in the last 2 months I have never ever seen or heard it go the other way, it would be bedlam. There is a "Black business owners" group, and many other groups with black or African American in the name but i can assure you if there was a "United Caucasian College Fund" there would be massive outrage.
Why do i say all this? It goes both ways. Why do i have to be a "white guy" and you be a "black guy"? Why cant we just be guys?
Justjim75 said:Why do i say all this? It goes both ways. Why do i have to be a "white guy" and you be a "black guy"? Why cant we just be guys?
It goes both ways, like you said.
You've had guns pointed at you 3 times in the last 2 months.
Did you get shot any of those times?
Were you killed?
It goes both ways... sorta.
Enough people don't want to "just be guys" that anybody who does gets drowned out because we're not busy shooting at each other and calling each other racist. It's one of those leftover crutches that we as a species never seem to be able to give up.
This may sound dumb to some of you but...
I grew up in a very affluent New England town full of "old money" white people. I was not one of them. There was not much cultural diversity there; I could count the number of non-white kids in my class on one hand. Even so, they found the next best thing to marginalize and make fun of: me.
Why me? Because I was Italian.
I was bullied, teased, and taunted, just because of my name. I looked the same, but my NAME was different, and that was enough to spur hate. And when it comes to advertisements, there are tons of blatantly stereotyped ads depicting "greasy Italians" being mobsters, having broken English Italian accents, etc. It bothered me greatly as a kid to see that on top of all of the other things I had to put up with. Later, I learned that ths was just the tip of the iceberg, and other cultures dealt with much worse. At first, I tried being like them, marginalizing other subsets of culture for my amusement. But I soon realized that made me just like the people that were treating me terribly, so I cut that right out.
Ignorant people are out there everywhere in just about every capacity, and they will attack anything that doesn't conform with their world view. It's wrong, and I wish there was a sure-fire way to get them to understand that acting this way isn't pushing humanity forward.
Tony Sestito said:I wish there was a sure-fire way to get them to understand that acting this way isn't pushing humanity forward.
"Pushing humanity forward" is not a selling point to the ignorant prejudiced crowd. They don't want anything to move forward. They want everything to stay exactly the way it was when they became aware of it - or to revert to the fictitious "good old days" they were raised to believe in.
Justjim75 said:In reply to yupididit :
While we are having an open dialog, as a white, heterosexual man i feel like there are a lot of people and organizations looking at me as the bad guy just for being me. Happens ALL the time. I started listening to hip hop back in the Fat Boys, RUN DMC and Egyptian Lover days for the record, lol. I live in Alabama and regularly get verbally assaulted, cut off in traffic, get called racial names and receive middle fingers for being in the wrong neighborhood despite being there to instal life saving medical equipment. Guns have been pointed at me 3 ti.es in the last 2 months I have never ever seen or heard it go the other way, it would be bedlam. There is a "Black business owners" group, and many other groups with black or African American in the name but i can assure you if there was a "United Caucasian College Fund" there would be massive outrage.
Why do i say all this? It goes both ways. Why do i have to be a "white guy" and you be a "black guy"? Why cant we just be guys?
My point of view and me just being honest:
Being a white heterosexual male (WHM to save typing), throughout the past 1000+ years or so the WHM has oppressed murdered colonized and waged terror on most of the world. The WHM has also completely erased cultures and groups of people off the face of the earth simply because they weren't a WHM. Think about it. After hundreds of years of this going on, it takes a toll and establishes a perception of WHM's. Your ancestors were scary and down right evil to their fellow humans. Cause and affect. I think as the progress in this world and as non-WHM gain the same positional power, it threatens the normal privileges of being a WHM. I feel like it may cause some WHM to feel defensive and or like they're being punished. It isn't the case it's just the playing field is being equalized more and more.
Listening to hip-hop or liking some culturally black things didn't absolve you of possibly not being racist or get you any points. I know why some throw it out there but it doesn't do anything lol.
What you've gone through in Alabama, I'm sorry you've had to experience the hate that people have in their hearts. You don't deserve it. Now think about this.....Imagine that as a consistent threat to your daily peace since childhood. Now imagine that your govt and people in positions of power as well as police force, press upon you the same hate or perpetuate it. Now picture while that's going on, institutionalized racism and oppression that's been in place for hundreds of years affects you today. Because, it destroyed your ancestors ability to establish generational wealth, secure education, the ability establish that we are equals, and have proper representation, as well as broken up families and left your people contributions out of history. Now picture having to raise a child who will unfortunately still be affected by those things for reasons he cannot control. Maybe they don't happen to him as much as they happened to you and so on, but it creates trauma. Trauma that is passed down generation to generation. The civil rights movement wasnt THAT long ago, and though things are "equal", all those policies and hate that oppressed the people before, trickles down in their own way to today. A lot of people who are racist were raised by the same people who forced those policies and hate 40 years ago etc.
There are many groups for the advancement of various races etc. That's because we were not allowed to operate on the same level as white people. Nor do we get the representation in those aspects that'll inspire people to support and establish our own businesses etc. Even the perception and image of success and beauty is a clean cut white person, that's been the case for 99% of American history. So, yeah those groups are necessary to support the disenfranchised that were put down.
Yes, you may not be racist and you may feel like you're unfairly treated because of the berkeley-ups of the people before you... but you aren't the only one who is suffering from pass transgressions. None of us should suffer, but until this are truly fixed then we all will suffer in some way.
Suffrage is truly traumatic and cannot be dismissed or recognized.
No you're not the bad guy because you're a white dude. Just like I'm not bad or inferior because I'm black. But American history and policies etc sure do say that I'm still not your equal.
This is something to think about. Watch this:
You think some black kids feel this way today?
In reply to Duke :
Yeah, that's a good point. I actually have this conversation with my dad all the time. It never goes anywhere good.
In reply to yupididit :
I think I actually saw that episode when I was a kid. No way any network would play that now because of the N-word. As much "progress" has been made since the era of the civil rights movement, i feel we taken as many steps backwards sometimes. Thanks for your words, I couldn't have said anything any better.
Duke said:I don't. Ever watched the Simpsons? They're CLEARLY white, even though Matt Groening went out of his way to make them chrome yellow with blue hair. Dr. Hibbert is black, Apu is brown, and everyone 'white' is 'yellow'.
Akira and Dr. Nick are yellow as well.
It's a cartoon.
I checked the paint sample aisle. I'm not white, I'm "shiny kettle"
We hit the high point on understanding race relations here:
It's all gone now. Everyone has to be angry.
In reply to yupididit :
Don't stop what you are doing, because you are doing it well.
In reply to tuna55 (Forum Supporter) :
Blazing saddles is the most pointed anti bigotry movie ever made, but it can't be shown because of one word, which was critical to the power of the movie. Is that an advancement?
OHSCrifle said:In reply to yupididit :
Don't stop what you are doing, because you are doing it well.
Quoted for emphasis.
93EXCivic said:Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) said:After Hitler split, the company became a privately-held company. There may be racist entities at VW, but not "because Hitler."
If you were referring to my post, in no way was that serious.
Nah, I was just being clear about my opinion that I personally don't equate any perceived racism at VW to be originated by the dictator who ran the country at the time.
Streetwiseguy said:In reply to tuna55 (Forum Supporter) :
Blazing saddles is the most pointed anti bigotry movie ever made, but it can't be shown because of one word, which was critical to the power of the movie. Is that an advancement?
That's exactly my point. That was literally the high water mark for understanding racial issues. That movie was genius.
As a WHM, I can never claim to be an expert in racism, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.
I'm kidding
I do feel as if I have a bit of a unique perspective on it as someone who has worked in theater and performing arts for more than half of his life... in 13 U.S. states, 10 countries, and three continents over nearly three decades. I can't speak to other professions, but performing arts is a berkeleying crucible of induced awareness. The differences in racist perceptions across states is bizarre enough, let alone across countries and continents.
So, while I'm not a minority, I do feel sensitivity to racist advertising. Whether or not it is warranted is irrelevant. It's entirely possible that not a single minority person was offended by it, but it raises my hackles because of my perception that it might.
Alas, I'm a financially-stable, lower-middle class, pasty white, cisgendered, straight man, so I might never truly know.
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