cghstang_chris
cghstang_chris Dork
5/10/19 10:36 a.m.

We're moving in a few weeks. New house is all good but the kitchen has no dishwasher. 

I get to put in a dishwasher prior to move-in.

This is the kitchen today:

This is what it looked like prior to the 'update':

 

The plan is to move the fridge back to where it was before and put a dishwasher to the immediate left of the sink.

What I don't know is how this all shakes out with the granite counter top and tile backsplash. 

I have a lot of scenario's in mind but I'm interested to hear opinions from the peanut gallery. 

The main requirements are: add dishwasher, be diy-able quickly.

Here are some other pics to add some context:

different house, same floor plan:

 

T.J.
T.J. MegaDork
5/10/19 11:10 a.m.

Wouldn't be easiest to put the dishwasher where it used to be to the right of the sink? That way, you could keep the new cabinets where the old fridge was located.

cghstang_chris
cghstang_chris Dork
5/10/19 11:22 a.m.

In reply to T.J. :

That probably would be easiest.I really don't like the idea of the dishwasher right next to the oven, just on principle.

It might even be possible to 'deconstruct' the existing cabinet in place leaving support at the end of the counter and slide in the dishwasher in without having to mess with the countertop.

More counter space is a secondary goal but not required for this go-round if it is going to complicate/lengthen the process.

TurnerX19
TurnerX19 HalfDork
5/11/19 12:36 a.m.

Who re-does a kitchen and eliminates the dish washer? Is there room between the sink and the fridge as it sits now? The photo doesn't really tell me. Otherwise between the oven and the sink wins it. Code here requires panels on either side of the dishwasher for a reason I do not grasp, so make sure you get your C.O. before you do the install.

Patrick
Patrick MegaDork
5/11/19 6:54 a.m.

If cabinet next to sink on right is 24” you’re boned and not putting it back there with an end panel, in which case your granite fails.

i’d attempt to put it left of sink, then kick PO in the junk for deleting it

code says a dishwasher must have panels because your cutout is basically an open electrical box without them since it’s legal to hotwire them with a romex whip sticking out of the wall/floor.  Romex isn’t otherwise allowed to be exposed unprotected like that.  Plus how else are you going to support a counter top? 

dculberson
dculberson UltimaDork
5/11/19 7:46 a.m.

Who in the world puts in granite counters and no dishwasher?? I hope this place was a bargain. 

SVreX
SVreX MegaDork
5/11/19 8:21 a.m.

That’s a LOT more work than you realize. 

The fisheye lens makes it a little hard to tell, but I think you have a 21” cabinet next to the sink. DW needs 24”. 

Pantry cabinet looks like a 24” cabinet. You need 36” for the fridge. 

Looks to me like they sacrificed the DW to have a farm sink. 

You have to have 24” for the dishwasher. If you don’t have that anywhere, you’re easiest solution is gonna be a free standing island with a dishwasher in it, but the drain lines are gonna be hard. 

Is this house on a slab?

SVreX
SVreX MegaDork
5/11/19 8:31 a.m.

If that cabinet between the sink and the stove is a 24” cabinet, then it’s definitely your best solution (and yes, it can be done without removing the counter)

Patrick
Patrick MegaDork
5/11/19 8:35 a.m.
SVreX said:

That’s a LOT more work than you realize. 

The fisheye lens makes it a little hard to tell, but I think you have a 21” cabinet next to the sink. DW needs 24”. 

Pantry cabinet looks like a 24” cabinet. You need 36” for the fridge. 

Looks to me like they sacrificed the DW to have a farm sink. 

You have to have 24” for the dishwasher. If you don’t have that anywhere, you’re easiest solution is gonna be a free standing island with a dishwasher in it, but the drain lines are gonna be hard. 

Is this house on a slab?

Totally forgot during my reply, while researching shorter than normal dishwashers yesterday for a customer, but they do make 18” wide dishwashers.  So it could go in a 21” cabinet space by taking the box out and door off and leaving the face frame sides and end panels.  

z31maniac
z31maniac MegaDork
5/11/19 8:55 a.m.

I guess tear out the cabinets, put the fridge there, and put a dishwasher where the fridge is now? 

 

Or just wash the dishes by hand? I can't imagine tearing all this stuff up over a dishwasher. 

mtn
mtn MegaDork
5/11/19 9:29 a.m.

They do have 18” and other sizes smaller than standard 24”. 

 

That being said, I think the best bet would either be an island, a portable, or hand washing. 

RevRico
RevRico PowerDork
5/11/19 10:14 a.m.
z31maniac said:

I guess tear out the cabinets, put the fridge there, and put a dishwasher where the fridge is now? 

 

Or just wash the dishes by hand? I can't imagine tearing all this stuff up over a dishwasher. 

This. Maybe it's because in all the places that I've lived I've never had a dishwasher that was actually good at washing dishes, but this seems like a Hell of a lot of time and money just to put one in.

Robbie
Robbie UltimaDork
5/11/19 10:17 a.m.

Yeah, moving that fridge is going to SUCK.

Apexcarver
Apexcarver UltimaDork
5/11/19 10:33 a.m.

If it's not on a slab, how do you feel about putting an island back in? Put the dishwasher in the island. Just seems like such an easy solution, it's worth considering. Also net gains you working space and possibly A smidgen of storage.

 

The plumbing and electrical may not be too bad. Plus build one cabinet, not tear out and rebuild. Plus any flooring implications 

cghstang_chris
cghstang_chris Dork
5/11/19 1:01 p.m.
SVreX said:

If that cabinet between the sink and the stove is a 24” cabinet, then it’s definitely your best solution (and yes, it can be done without removing the counter)

Can you expound on this?

Is it along the lines of what I posted earlier:  'deconstruct' the existing cabinet in place leaving support at the end of the counter and slide in the dishwasher in without having to mess with the countertop?

Kitchen is over an unfinished basement. 

Cabinets are lowes 'in stock' Diamond NOW Arcadias. Between the sink and oven is a 24" unit. Left of the sink is a 12".

SVreX
SVreX MegaDork
5/11/19 2:28 p.m.
mtn said:

They do have 18” and other sizes smaller than standard 24”. 

That’s true, but who would want one?  Those are only good for bar sinks or mobile homes. 

SVreX
SVreX MegaDork
5/11/19 2:46 p.m.
cghstang_chris said:
SVreX said:

If that cabinet between the sink and the stove is a 24” cabinet, then it’s definitely your best solution (and yes, it can be done without removing the counter)

Can you expound on this?

Is it along the lines of what I posted earlier:  'deconstruct' the existing cabinet in place leaving support at the end of the counter and slide in the dishwasher in without having to mess with the countertop?

Kitchen is over an unfinished basement. 

Cabinets are lowes 'in stock' Diamond NOW Arcadias. Between the sink and oven is a 24" unit. Left of the sink is a 12".

Yes. You have basically described what you need to do. 

Here’s the challenge...

First off, you need an end panel next to the stove. This means you need a little more than 24”. If that counter has a 1” overhang, then you’re golden. 

The counter is not easy (but it is doable). That counter will want to break on that thin back edge. When it was delivered, it would have been installed with the sink cutout ALMOST cut out (to avoid breakage). After installation, the cuts were finished, and the edges polished. It was never intended to be moved again. 

Additionally, the counter is glued to the cabinet.  If you try to pry the counter off the cabinet, it will almost surely break.

Also, the tile backsplash is probably on top of the counter. That makes it harder to pry. 

I would give a pro 40% odds of breaking that counter if he tried to remove it and replace it. Harder for a DIYer. 

But it CAN be done. 

The best choice is to not move the counter AT ALL, and don’t pry on it. You want to deconstruct the cabinet as carefully as possible. Support the counter well, cut the cabinet it into little pieces,  and scrape the pieces off the bottom of the counter carefully without moving the counter at all. 

Then make an end panel to slip in between the DW and the stove at the end of the counter. Sliding the DW under the counter is easy. 

This is tricky, but can be done. It will require a lot of patience.

Curtis
Curtis UltimaDork
5/14/19 9:11 a.m.

Keep this one thing in mind...

A 24" cabinet is 24" to the outside.  A 24" dishwasher needs a 24" opening.  So you can't just gut a 24" cab and stuff a dishwasher in.

I just did this a few months ago.  I put a dishwasher in where a 24" cabinet used to be, and I had to very carefully not encroach into my doorway because I was adding 3/4" thickness for an end panel.

SVreX
SVreX MegaDork
5/15/19 12:20 p.m.

In reply to Curtis :

He said “deconstruct” the cabinet. I’m pretty sure that means remove the ENTIRE cabinet, not just gut the interior. 

That will leave exactly 24” for the dishwasher. Hopefully the counter has an overhang, so he can also fit an end panel under the existing counter. 

KyAllroad (Jeremy)
KyAllroad (Jeremy) UltimaDork
5/15/19 2:22 p.m.

No pic handy but when I moved into my current house I had no dishwasher.  Being a modern guy I wanted one so the 24" base cabinet was demoed with countertop in place.  Honestly it wasn't even hard and took me very little time.

Re-the 18" dishwashers.  Skip them, they are annoyingly bad, loud, too small, and generally frustrating things.

cghstang_chris
cghstang_chris Dork
5/16/19 8:05 p.m.

 

This is a more direct view of the area in question. It looks like there is a filler between the sink and base cabinet to right of the sink. 

There is essentially zero counter overhang between the cabinet and the oven. I'm hoping the filler gives me enough room.

So the next question (for now) is: white, stainless, or 'panel ready' dishwasher?

Robbie
Robbie UltimaDork
5/16/19 9:58 p.m.

I think the panel ready will look the best if you can put a matching color panel on it.

But it may not be worth the extra $$.

cghstang_chris
cghstang_chris Dork
6/10/19 6:38 a.m.

We had the big stuff moved over Thursday and stayed at the new house that night.

Dishwasher arrived Saturday morning.

First cycle; no issues.

I thought I was going to need to make a panel to mount the old cabinet door/drawer to but the template has instructions for two separate pieces and their combined weight is within the spec'd range. So... this is close to what it will look like, hopefully later this week. Don't mind the panel gaps :)

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