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Login to post Forums » Off-topic discussion » Not to start a E36 M3 storm

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Nov. 21, 2009 5:22 p.m. Spinout007 Reader

But my wife has the wonderful assignment of debating the legalization of Cannibus for one of her classes, and after an E36 M3 ton of research she's wanting more info. Anyone have anything to contribute? Websites can be pm'd to me if needed, to keep them off here, just really wanting facts. But opinions will be weighed as well. I figured I've got access to a WHOLE RANGE of lifestyles and education levels on here, lets see what comes of it on this subject.

Thanks in advance! And Per, if I'm crossing the line please lemme know and delete this.
Nov. 21, 2009 9:09 p.m. wbjones Reader

not much use for your research but...

I've been really curious about this as well... I work at a factory that produces parts for both military and civilian air... which means we're controlled (for all intents and purposes) by the FAA... quarterly p tests and breathalyzer, or even special tests if there is thought to be cause...

If you test positive for a banned substance you're up a creek unless you can show a prescription .... with so many states legalizing Cannabis, at least as long as you have a script... wonder what it would do for us... since it stays in your system for several weeks.... makes me wonder...
Nov. 21, 2009 9:40 p.m. MrJoshua UltraDork

All I know is we have an interesting batch of conflicting trends in laws lately. On one hand "Smoking is evil and bad and no one should be allowed to do it anywhere because it hurts the baby jesus and all of his flock." So its slowly getting outlawed everywhere. On the other hand, "Pot isn't that bad, I mean really, so what, all they do is eat lots of pizza and laugh, and its really good for stress, and its a plant so it cant be bad for you right?" And pot is gradually being legalized everywhere. Interesting.
Nov. 21, 2009 10:11 p.m. EricM Dork

shrugs
Nov. 21, 2009 10:36 p.m. xd New Reader

Here in Denver it seems as though there are dispensaries on every freaking corner. I understand people need it or whatever, But I cant spit in this town without hitting one of these dispensaries.
Nov. 21, 2009 11:40 p.m. Spinout007 Reader

wbjones

Even if you have a script for the cannibus, you're more than likely screwed. That's one of the big arguments in California and other places where it's been legalized, the DEA comes in and raids a dispensary, shuts it down temporarily and within a short time they're back up and running again as the state refuses to push any charges, while the DEA and the Feds are trying to prosecute. Even if they don't legalize it in every state, if they decriminalized it federally, the gubmint could save a ton when it comes to trying to prosecute cannibus related "crimes" in those states who have legalized it. Being a Federally "controlled" facility, the fed laws would likely take precidence. sp?

Mr. Joshua

It's really funny as Florida is trying to work out their own medical use law as we type.

xd

I'm of the opinion that the dispensaries need to be regulated along the same lines as liquor licenses. I don't know about other states but here in Florida in order to get a liquor license you pay a retainer and your name goes into a lottery system, when one establishment goes down the license goes back into the lottery system and the next name is drawn. It would cut down on the number of establishments in one area, or at least cap them.

Thanks again guys, keep it coming, those of you that don't want to comment openly here are more than welcome to pm or email me.

Just a tidbit to throw more fuel on the fire. In the year 2007, 847,863 arrests were made just involving cannibus, imagine the final bill on those arrests when you take into consideration the paychecks of the officers involved, the training hours, the prosecuting attorney's paychecks, the defense lawyers paychecks, even if they're not public defenders, the judges paychecks, and that's not counting the fuel costs to run the cars, helicopters, boats, atv's, etc. Imagine what that money could be put towards.
Nov. 22, 2009 8:36 a.m. wbjones Reader

In reply to Spinout007:

that was my guess... just 1 1/2 - 4 1/2 yrs 'til retirement.... then no more testing
Nov. 22, 2009 10:30 a.m. Dr. Hess PowerDork

It makes you stoopid, makes you think you're more creative but removes any ability to do anything with that creativity you think you have. Smoking it is bad for you and for society as a whole, as then you're a less productive worker drone. Same with the rest of the drugs. However, enforcing the drug laws has been doing more damage to our society than the drugs themselves do, and that's why we should legalize all of them and give away all to anyone who wants it. Just be sure to give away LD100 quantities and the problem will take care of itself. I don't think there is a LD100 for pot, so just decriminalize it and don't bother giving that one away.. While politicians love finding something new to tax, that's not the winning argument. The damage to our society the drug laws are causing is. When I worked in the TDC, most of the people there were in for drug crimes or drug related crimes. Most of them were nice people, just stoopid.

On 9/12/2001, I emailed President Bush, suggesting that it would be the perfect time to decriminalize all drugs, as that was the major source of funding for Al Quida et.al. He didn't listen to me. Now Afganistan is still a problem and the poppy plant and hash labs are funding that problem because druggies on the streets of Detroit keep stealing whatever is left from whoever couldn't escape Detroit, selling it for pennies on the dollar, and sending that money to the shiny happy people in Afganistan. No one listens to me, not even The W.

And hey, all you kids that voted for The O. Did he legalize pot? How's that hopey-changy thing working out for you?
Nov. 22, 2009 11:01 a.m. Spinout007 Reader

Dr. Hess wrote:

And hey, all you kids that voted for The O. Did he legalize pot? How's that hopey-changy thing working out for you?

HAHAHHAHHAHHHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA HA

Thanks Doc, I was hoping you would chime in on this one.
Nov. 22, 2009 11:27 a.m. ignorant PowerDork

Dr. Hess wrote:

And hey, all you kids that voted for The O. Did he legalize pot? How's that hopey-changy thing working out for you?

You're just coming off as a bitter old man, you know that right?
Nov. 22, 2009 12:45 p.m. alex Dork

The US attorney general announced recently that federal prosecution of state-authorized medical marijuana dispensaries will be ceased, unless the dispensaries violate both state and federal law. Just so's you know.
Nov. 22, 2009 12:50 p.m. curtis73 HalfDork

Misconceptions about weed are abundant. Pot is so much less harmful than tobacco, but tobacco is big business so we can't upset the delicate capitalist infrastructure.

Its much like gay marriage. We all know it will be legal soon, why are we fighting it?

I'm a libertarian and I approve this message.
Nov. 22, 2009 1:07 p.m. ReverendDexter HalfDork

Dr. Hess wrote: Smoking it is bad for you and for society as a whole, as then you're a less productive worker drone.

Eh, I somewhat disagree with this. Yes, it makes you a less productive worker, but I'd argue that it makes you a much more productive drone, especially if you're "too smart" for the work you're doing.

I think this falls under the "Brave New World" argument that not everyone can be an Alpha Plus, you need to have Betas and Deltas and Gammas for the world to work, and putting a Beta to work at a Gamma job only leads to misery. (Or, for the "Office Space" crowd, if no one had to work for money, there wouldn't be any janitors).

Just as an example, I worked for RGIS (the inventory people), and there were quite a few employees on the crew I worked on (myself discluded) that would just about double their productivity if they were high. By dumbing themselves down, they were much better able to do the monotonous job they were put to.
Nov. 22, 2009 1:08 p.m. ReverendDexter HalfDork

curtis73 wrote:

Misconceptions about weed are abundant. Pot is so much less harmful than tobacco, but tobacco is big business so we can't upset the delicate capitalist infrastructure.

Its much like gay marriage. We all know it will be legal soon, why are we fighting it?

I'm a libertarian and I approve this message.

As if it had been stripped from my own cranium, Curtis. If this board had rep, I'd be repping you about nowish.
Nov. 22, 2009 2:16 p.m. Josh HalfDork

MrJoshua wrote:

All I know is we have an interesting batch of conflicting trends in laws lately. On one hand "Smoking is evil and bad and no one should be allowed to do it anywhere because it hurts the baby jesus and all of his flock." So its slowly getting outlawed everywhere. On the other hand, "Pot isn't that bad, I mean really, so what, all they do is eat lots of pizza and laugh, and its really good for stress, and its a plant so it cant be bad for you right?" And pot is gradually being legalized everywhere. Interesting.

Well, for the most part the difference in attitudes is because nobody smokes three packs of joints a day, or takes a break from work every couple hours to get their weed fix, or makes me walk through a haze of their pot smoke to get in and out of the mall, or smokes so much weed that they die prematurely of lung cancer, etc, etc. Cigarette smokers are a much, much greater burden on those who choose not to smoke anything than pot smokers.
Nov. 22, 2009 4:29 p.m. MrJoshua UltraDork

Josh wrote:

MrJoshua wrote:

All I know is we have an interesting batch of conflicting trends in laws lately. On one hand "Smoking is evil and bad and no one should be allowed to do it anywhere because it hurts the baby jesus and all of his flock." So its slowly getting outlawed everywhere. On the other hand, "Pot isn't that bad, I mean really, so what, all they do is eat lots of pizza and laugh, and its really good for stress, and its a plant so it cant be bad for you right?" And pot is gradually being legalized everywhere. Interesting.

Well, for the most part the difference in attitudes is because nobody smokes three packs of joints a day, or takes a break from work every couple hours to get their weed fix, or makes me walk through a haze of their pot smoke to get in and out of the mall, or smokes so much weed that they die prematurely of lung cancer, etc, etc. Cigarette smokers are a much, much greater burden on those who choose not to smoke anything than pot smokers.

But would they if it were legal?
Nov. 22, 2009 5:15 p.m. Josh HalfDork

Probably not, because it doesn't exhibit the same physical addiction characteristics as nicotine. Even the tiny fraction of users who aim to be baked 24/7 don't need to have a joint hanging from their mouths all day long like some tobacco smokers do. I might never be able to attend an outdoor music festival again, but then again I'm not sure that the air can support higher concentrations of THC than I've already seen.
Nov. 22, 2009 6:42 p.m. aircooled SuperDork

Dr. Hess wrote:

....And hey, all you kids that voted for The O. Did he legalize pot? How's that hopey-changy thing working out for you?

I believe he specifically stated he had no plans to legalize pot (something like "its not the time for that") I am pretty sure that was before the election. The federal government did recently stop federal raids on "legal" pot stores didn't they? Which is far more then any other administration has done. I don't know if that came down from the top, but everything else that people don't like seems to, why not this?

...Just trying to keep thing "fair and balanced"...

For me: I find it highly hypocritical (as many do) that pot is such a controversy when it is pretty clear alcohol is FAR more dangerous, to the user and society.
Nov. 22, 2009 7:04 p.m. tuna55 Reader

Dr. Hess wrote:

It makes you stoopid, makes you think you're more creative but removes any ability to do anything with that creativity you think you have. Smoking it is bad for you and for society as a whole, as then you're a less productive worker drone. Same with the rest of the drugs. However, enforcing the drug laws has been doing more damage to our society than the drugs themselves do, and that's why we should legalize all of them and give away all to anyone who wants it. Just be sure to give away LD100 quantities and the problem will take care of itself. I don't think there is a LD100 for pot, so just decriminalize it and don't bother giving that one away.. While politicians love finding something new to tax, that's not the winning argument. The damage to our society the drug laws are causing is. When I worked in the TDC, most of the people there were in for drug crimes or drug related crimes. Most of them were nice people, just stoopid.

On 9/12/2001, I emailed President Bush, suggesting that it would be the perfect time to decriminalize all drugs, as that was the major source of funding for Al Quida et.al. He didn't listen to me. Now Afganistan is still a problem and the poppy plant and hash labs are funding that problem because druggies on the streets of Detroit keep stealing whatever is left from whoever couldn't escape Detroit, selling it for pennies on the dollar, and sending that money to the shiny happy people in Afganistan. No one listens to me, not even The W.

And hey, all you kids that voted for The O. Did he legalize pot? How's that hopey-changy thing working out for you?

I agree in that it is stupid, is bad for you, makes people stupid and less productive. I hate tobacco for many of the same reasons, as well as being addictive.

That being said. Who the heck cares what I think? If they do it inside, and don't infringe on the rights of others, why do I care? Someone gets high and drives, hit 'em like you'd hit a drunk with crazy high fees and jail time for risking the life of everyone else on the road. It's a libertarian thing. If they don't infringe on the rights of others, why should the government get involved?

I have never tried it, by the way, and don't intend to.
Nov. 22, 2009 7:05 p.m. tuna55 Reader

In reply to tuna55:

And I totally agree with the hopey-changey thing, and I am 27, so I am not an old fogey just yet.
Nov. 22, 2009 7:15 p.m. wbjones Reader

tuna55 wrote:

Someone gets high and drives, hit 'em like you'd hit a drunk with crazy high fees and jail time for risking the life of everyone else on the road.

+1 on the DWI....

but I would say if my only two choices are to meet someone on the highway who has been drinking or some one who has been smoking, I'd much rather meet some one who has been smoking...yes their reflexes have been greatly impaired (as have the drinkers) but in the vast majority of the cases the smoker will been much less aggressive ....

on a lighter note can anyone guess what a pot smoker thinks the greatest automotive invention is ?
Nov. 22, 2009 7:50 p.m. Jensenman MegaDork

Dunno what the pot smoker's favorite automotive invention is, but I've seen windshield washer setups which have been turned into vodka dispensers.

About legalization: I'm torn. I see both sides of the argument and lean towards legalization for medical use. (FWIW, cannabinoids are already used to treat some mental conditions and so is cocaine.)

Not so sure about everyday use. The alcohol comparison thing won't wash; just because booze is legal and causes problems doesn't mean we should automatically legalize any and every other mood altering substance out there.
Nov. 23, 2009 9:54 a.m. RX Reven' Reader

Jensenman wrote:

Dunno what the pot smoker's favorite automotive invention is, but I've seen windshield washer setups which have been turned into vodka dispensers.

About legalization: I'm torn. I see both sides of the argument and lean towards legalization for medical use. (FWIW, cannabinoids are already used to treat some mental conditions and so is cocaine.)

Not so sure about everyday use. The alcohol comparison thing won't wash; just because booze is legal and causes problems doesn't mean we should automatically legalize any and every other mood altering substance out there.

Bhaha…when I was in High School, a friend of mine had a Opel GT that he’d modified the windshield washer reservoir on to serve as a bong. Perfect cover “You know, these feren’ cars aren’t very reliable and I need to take a look under the hood to see where the smoke is coming from.

In terms of the alcohol comparison…I have a friend that experienced a nearly complete elimination of his alcohol consumption which had previously been somewhat significant when he began using medicinal cannabis to treat his chronic pain. He’s also a cigarette smoker and indicated that he’s cut his pack a day habit in half.

He disciplines himself to one gram per month so in addition to reducing his chronic pain, he’s drinking about a case less beer and smoking about fifteen fewer packs per month which way, way, way more than makes up for any cost / health consequences of the cannabis.

To me, this is just another example of how the government needs to stay a bazillion miles away from meddling in folks lives…buy a house you can’t afford - LOSE IT…cannabis works for you - USE IT.
Nov. 23, 2009 10:42 a.m. Ian F HalfDork

I grew up with pot and drugs (product of my parents' hippy period...), so therefore I don't use it (don't even like drinking that much). That said, I'm all for legalizing it... to my mind, it's a huge tax revenue we aren't collecting. However, I agree corporations should be allowed to keep their own rules about drug use, if desired (as someone who has been a contractor for pharma companies and has to do a pee test now and then).
Nov. 23, 2009 11:08 a.m. Kramer HalfDork

tuna55 wrote: I agree in that it is stupid, is bad for you, makes people stupid and less productive. I hate tobacco for many of the same reasons, as well as being addictive.

That being said. Who the heck cares what I think? If they do it inside, and don't infringe on the rights of others, why do I care? Someone gets high and drives, hit 'em like you'd hit a drunk with crazy high fees and jail time for risking the life of everyone else on the road. It's a libertarian thing. If they don't infringe on the rights of others, why should the government get involved?

I have never tried it, by the way, and don't intend to.

Same beliefs/thoughts here.

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