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CAMikaze
CAMikaze Reader
11/10/14 10:13 p.m.

I'm thinking of testing out some of the Ferrari Challenge cars tomorrow night. Anyone interested in joining in?

CAMikaze
CAMikaze Reader
11/12/14 2:10 p.m.

After some testing on more of the Ferrari's and chatting with Dean, I may need to do some consideration on maybe adding a spec minimum weight to the series or a spec Power-to-Weight ratio. I have yet the 599 and the California to put through their paces at Monza and will probably have the cars do some laps on Suzuka, Grand Valley and Fuji (F) tracks as well to see how they compare.

CAMikaze
CAMikaze Reader
11/13/14 6:49 p.m.

If anyone is up for testing some of the Ferrari cars, I have a lobby open right now

1472-4711-0167-3381-8642

550 Max. PP and 1350 kg. minimum weight.

The Ferrari's I'm currently looking at are..

  • GTO '84
  • SP1 '08
  • 458 Italia '09
  • F430 '06
  • 430 Scuderia '07
  • California '08
  • 599 '06
CAMikaze
CAMikaze Reader
11/13/14 9:10 p.m.

Here's the Fastest Lap Times I got for the cars on Monza...

  • GTO '84: 1'51.366
  • 599 '06: 1'51.626
  • 458 Italia '09: 1'51.853
  • 430 Scuderia '07: 1'52.497
  • F430 '06: 1'52.835
  • California '08: 1'53.423
  • SP1 '08: 1'53.578

These cars were run to the spirit of the regulations of the current seasons Muscle Car series with the following criteria...

  • Sport Soft Tires
  • 550 pp max
  • 1350 kg minimum weight
  • 90% Power limiter max
  • No suspension tuning
  • Stock brakes
  • No weight reduction
  • No adding weight*
  • No NOS or Superchargers
  • No upgraded dif (clutch and driveshaft mods not used though this might change after the first rounds of testing are completed)

(*) The exceptions to this are the GTO '84 and the 458 Italia '09 so that they could make the PP limit

It's hard to say at this point if I have a ringer car in the GTO '84 with maximum ballast, but I have 3 or 4 other tracks I would like to test these cars on.

dean1484
dean1484 UltimaDork
11/13/14 10:45 p.m.

Lots of good ideas to think about.

Advan046
Advan046 Dork
11/17/14 9:03 a.m.

If you want to do a spec endurance series like the gtr then lets use one of the new to GT6 cars.

My two votes would be for:

  • Lancer Evolution X Rally Car
  • R8 LMS ultra or whatever version allows paint and numbers

Both would be maximum power build then open tuning, but you must use maximum power all the time. The only PP will be weight.

An honorable mention would be the SLS AMG GT3 car again built to max power and see what happens.

CAMikaze
CAMikaze Reader
11/17/14 8:47 p.m.

Grand Valley Speedway Fastest Lap times for the Ferrari Challenge cars...

  • 458 Italia '09: 1'56.156
  • 430 Scuderia '07: 1'56.201
  • SP1 '08: 1'57.083
  • F430 '06: 1'57.245
  • GTO '84: 1'57.487
  • California '08: 1'57.819
  • 599 '06: 1'58.244

To me, the GTO was a bit of a handful at times while some of the more recent MR models had a more controllable feel. I'll see if I can get times in for Fuji and Suzuka before Wednesday nights RM races.

Advan046
Advan046 SuperDork
11/22/14 8:11 p.m.

dean1484 wrote:

Ok after alot of testing tonight everyone should get a MR2 1600 1986. DO AN OIL CHANGE Do NOT rebuild engine. Get the car and put my tune in it below and if you are not up to the pp then do the oil change. I usually don't do them but I had used this car before so I am not sure.

the tune is to 460 pp

the following tune us a very good place to start. Stock these cars are diabolical tail happy things.

90/90 ride height

suspension

5.41/6.32

5/1

5/1

5/1

.05/1.1

-0.08/.15

fully adj trans speed set to 143

Triple plate clutch.

Standard Dif. Note that this will be adjustable to fine tune the car but I did not need it.

Power 96.9

Stage 3 engine tuning

Sports Computer

Racing exhaust

Isometric exhaust manifold

standard cat

intake tuning

High Rpm turbo

no nos

ballast weight of 82kg

ballast position -50

Stage 3 weight reduction.

carbon hood

window weight reduction

this should net you

460 pp

274 hp

1019 kg

50/50 weight

206 ft lbs

3.71 kg/hp

I would like to run some races with these next Sunday. So paint them up and add wheels as you please.

Advan046
Advan046 SuperDork
11/25/14 2:26 p.m.
CAMikaze wrote: Grand Valley Speedway Fastest Lap times for the Ferrari Challenge cars... - 458 Italia '09: 1'56.156 - 430 Scuderia '07: 1'56.201 - SP1 '08: 1'57.083 - F430 '06: 1'57.245 - GTO '84: 1'57.487 - California '08: 1'57.819 - 599 '06: 1'58.244 To me, the GTO was a bit of a handful at times while some of the more recent MR models had a more controllable feel. I'll see if I can get times in for Fuji and Suzuka before Wednesday nights RM races.

GTO was a joy to race maybe a ringer unless we do more than just the weight HC.

The Scuderia was fun after I put the proper tires on! DOH! 1400 minimum seems ok

Need a lot more testing to determine if we have parity. Monza didn't seem to be the right place for that. We should test at a track like Motegi East, Apricot Hill, or Rome Reverse where we have close battles in other series.

CAMikaze
CAMikaze Reader
11/25/14 7:47 p.m.
Advan046 wrote:
CAMikaze wrote: Grand Valley Speedway Fastest Lap times for the Ferrari Challenge cars... - 458 Italia '09: 1'56.156 - 430 Scuderia '07: 1'56.201 - SP1 '08: 1'57.083 - F430 '06: 1'57.245 - GTO '84: 1'57.487 - California '08: 1'57.819 - 599 '06: 1'58.244 To me, the GTO was a bit of a handful at times while some of the more recent MR models had a more controllable feel. I'll see if I can get times in for Fuji and Suzuka before Wednesday nights RM races.

GTO was a joy to race maybe a ringer unless we do more than just the weight HC.

The Scuderia was fun after I put the proper tires on! DOH! 1400 minimum seems ok

Need a lot more testing to determine if we have parity. Monza didn't seem to be the right place for that. We should test at a track like Motegi East, Apricot Hill, or Rome Reverse where we have close battles in other series.

The Monza track we raced on Sunday night was the '80's track. I was testing on the more current configuration of the track earlier this month.

Maybe setting the power limiter on the GTO to 95% or lower might make it more equal to the rest of the lineup?

Advan046
Advan046 SuperDork
12/29/14 10:36 a.m.

Ok so here we are.

Series for Sunday

  • MR2 Spec Series
  • ?

Series for Wednesday

  • Beetle?
  • ?

Some thoughts on a SSS series for Sunday and Wednesday.

  • SSS Nissan Fairlady Z (Z34) '08 Very fun in stock form
  • SSS Infiniti Vision car Very fast and not so bad stock
  • SSS Corvette or Viper

An idea for a tuner series if we want. It is basically to use the hard work of the GTPlanet guys for their GT3 series. Their Season 3 setup is below. We could test these as a sprint series and as an endurance series.

FIA GTWC | Season 3 | GT3 Machines V3.0

Car/hp/weight/pp/Installed parts

  • BMW Z4 GT3/499/1315/582*/N/A - Power Limiter 93.7%
  • Niss. GT-R NISMO GT3/540/1350/599/N/A - Power Limiter 87.1%
  • Audi R8 ALMS/522/1350/592*/N/A - Power Limiter 94.3%
  • Mercedes SLS AMG/505/1350/597/N/A - Power Limiter 84.6%
  • Ford GT LM Test car/466/1317/575*/Racing Brake Kit - Power Limiter 75.2%
  • Ch. Corvette Z06 C6 LM/501/1290/569*/Full LSD, Carbon Propeller Shaft - Power Limiter 72.9%
  • SRT Viper GTS-R Oreca/480/1280/575*/N/A - Power Limiter 77.8%
  • NSX-R P. LM Race Car/480/1270/544*/N/A - Power Limiter 89.4%

All cars are supposed to run with fresh oil.

Body rigidity improvement is optional.

Nissan - Only N24 Schulze Motorsport and Team RJN are available.

Audi - Only Team Phoenix '12 is available

Ford - Manufacturer of this car is Gran Turismo, not Ford.

*These values can be altered to ± 1pp, depending of the ballast position. pp's on this table are with ballast position at 0%

dean1484
dean1484 UltimaDork
12/29/14 1:45 p.m.

Anth,

If Air does not elect to run the Spec RUF series stepping up every 2nd race to the next more diabolical RUF car. I would consider that for the SSS series on Sunday.

The other two series I have been thinking of are.

  • The 423 series with the "claim" rule. The winning car gets permanently eliminated from competition. No tuning of any kind to the cars other than adjustments to power (add or limit) to get to the 423 PP. Use a spec tire (probably SM)

  • The 2.27 Series Instead of PP use the power to weigh as the spec series with a spec tire. Street cars only and no other tuning other than to get the proper power to weight through power adjustments only (no adding weight or adding lightness). I would probably consider the same rule that the 423 series will use in that the car that wins (based on Airs Spread sheet) is then eliminated from competition. I am thinking that the 2.27 is probably to fast a spec for this. I will probably want to look at raising this a bit as cars for this could / would get pricy as you are primarily dealing with supper cars at this spec.

For both these series since the car goes away that is the HC (no PP or tire HC will be used)

I also REALLY like an FD series. However I would like this as a tuner series similar to the Miata series we did that emulated a SCCA spec Miata series. That series was a blast!!!!

Last night we tested the RUF 3400 and that was a great car to drive in stock form. It would make a good SS car (no tuning).

We will see With the MR2 series it would be nice to have what ever races with it to be similar. Why I think the stepped RUF series would generally complement the BUG series.

Advan046
Advan046 SuperDork
12/29/14 1:53 p.m.

I agree with Matt/Sauce's statements of the past, in that too much MR and RR isn't my cup of tea. I would rather have the MR2 stay and use something with no tuning or searching required for me to just jump in and race. A pure SSS series with an AWD or FR drivetrain. A 423pp or 2.27 Hp/Kg series would be very hard for me and is more tuning than the MR2 or Beetle series. I would have to spend hours trying to figure out what car to bring that week on top of tuning the MR2 and Beetle.

Since we are doing an AWD series in the Evo series and MC on Wednesday I think we should go back to an 80's or newer FR car for the SSS next season. I agree with your RX-7 idea of having it be a tuner series so lets avoid using one of them.

e30Matt
e30Matt HalfDork
12/29/14 2:18 p.m.

Spec S2k? They're good in stock form, just need to not be on comfort tires.

Advan046
Advan046 SuperDork
12/29/14 4:32 p.m.
e30Matt wrote: Spec S2k? They're good in stock form, just need to not be on comfort tires.

Sport Hard? I think we need that low traction for the challenge.

failboat
failboat UltraDork
12/29/14 5:12 p.m.

+1. I enjoy SH for cars under 450pp.

A Nissan Silvia series would also offer a lot of car choices.

e30Matt
e30Matt HalfDork
12/29/14 6:17 p.m.
Advan046 wrote:
e30Matt wrote: Spec S2k? They're good in stock form, just need to not be on comfort tires.

Sport Hard? I think we need that low traction for the challenge.

That was my thought. SM or SS would be way too grippy.

Autolex
Autolex Dork
12/30/14 9:55 a.m.

I had an interesting online experience the other day that made me consider a suggestion:

PRANCING MOOSE SPECIAL

  • C30
  • No engine mods other than oil change
  • No weight mods
  • Any tire SS or less (I ran SS out front and SM out back, worked well)
  • No suspension Mods or driveline mods (other than brakes listed below)
  • Any wheel/Color combo your heart desires
  • Racing Brakes
dean1484
dean1484 UltimaDork
12/30/14 10:03 a.m.

In reply to Autolex:

On snow...

dean1484
dean1484 UltimaDork
12/30/14 10:07 a.m.

The 423 series is supposed to be a fun thing. Jump in s car and adjust the power and go. It is not meant as a serious thing. I would promote a points bonus award for the goofiest car. Really if you spend more than 5 min selecting your car you would be doing it wrong.

Spoolpigeon
Spoolpigeon UltraDork
12/30/14 2:24 p.m.

Spec s2k and 423 sounds fun.

May I suggest that you can only use a 423 car ONCE. That would promote a ton of variety each race!

dean1484
dean1484 UltimaDork
12/30/14 7:58 p.m.
Spoolpigeon wrote: Spec s2k and 423 sounds fun. May I suggest that you can only use a 423 car ONCE. That would promote a ton of variety each race!

And the winners car retired permanently. I like it!!!!!!

Spoolpigeon
Spoolpigeon UltraDork
12/30/14 10:17 p.m.

That's also a good idea. It would keep folks from showing up in whatever won the previous week.

Advan046
Advan046 SuperDork
1/7/15 9:18 a.m.
dean1484 wrote: The 423 series is supposed to be a fun thing. Jump in s car and adjust the power and go. It is not meant as a serious thing. I would promote a points bonus award for the goofiest car. Really if you spend more than 5 min selecting your car you would be doing it wrong.

I guess my main issue is that I don't have a very big garage. Most of my cars are:

  • What came with the preorder.
  • What I bought or won during the Campaign mode.
  • What I bought for our two Driver's Choice series and other series.
  • Every Evolution.

That is why I suffer during the tests. I maybe have a few cars that work at 423pp and maybe a few more than that for the 2.27 HP/kg setup. So simply don't have the fleet to support it.

dean1484
dean1484 UltimaDork
1/12/15 7:42 a.m.

Spec S2000

Must be a street car

Power to weight of 3.50 kg / hp

Tuning of power only by adding mods or adjusting the limiter to no more than 90%

Custom wheels are allowed.

No other modifications.

SM tires

This is basically the same regs as the EVO series just that we are going to a power to weight spec not a pp spec.

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