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  Feb. 2, 2009 11:01 a.m. Dr. Hess PowerDork

  So, as I sit around the house without power, I start thinking about how this ain't gonna happen again. I think what I need is about a 20 HP motor hooked up to a HF generator (not motor-generator, just the stand-alone generator that you attach to a motor or PTO). I know almost nothing about Jap bikes, but seems to me that there should be one about that size I could use. I'm looking for:

  Ultra reliable (probably a Honduh)

  Less than 30 HP, at least 15 HP. I'd like to keep the RPM's low.

  Water cooled

  Inexpensive

  Quiet with a big muffler

  Electric start

  Fuel injection would be nice.

  I'm thinkin' eBay for one wadded into a ball, but I dunno what to look for. I thought about a small industrial Diesel, but it has to be able to start at 0F, and I'm not too sure a Diesel will do that easily, whereas a gas probably will. I think that a small bike engine will be better than a Briggs & Stratton type for reliability and gas "mileage". Any ideas?

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  Feb. 2, 2009 11:02 a.m. 16vCorey SuperDork

  Maybe an engine off of a Rebel 250?

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  Feb. 2, 2009 11:05 a.m. 16vCorey SuperDork

  On second thought, I'm pretty sure those are still air cooled.

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  Feb. 2, 2009 11:34 a.m. 4cylndrfury Reader

  My old bosshad a Bambardier ATV thats water cooled?!? prolly more than 30 HP though.

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  Feb. 2, 2009 12:04 p.m. Xceler8x HalfDork

  The Rebel motors are air-cooled. Then again, if air is circulating they should do ok. Is there a reason to spring for the added complexity of water cooling? I would think just about any motor over 200 cc's would do the trick.

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  Feb. 2, 2009 12:06 p.m. Grtechguy SuperDork

  yz250? 2-stroke....water cooled.. should fit the bill.

  edit: peaked out its 48hp.... not sure if the yz125 is lc or not

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  Feb. 2, 2009 12:29 p.m. aircooled Dork

  Even if it is water cooled, it will still need a fan and airflow.

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  Feb. 2, 2009 12:36 p.m. Dr. Hess PowerDork

  I should add 4 stroke, not 2. I want water cooled because it is easier to manage the cooling on a water cooled stationary engine than an air cooled one. I've Megasquirted an air cooled bike (Sportster), so I've watched the temp climb up as it just sits there at idle, not even under a load, and drop down with a box fan on it. I want a thermostat in there regulating temp. I also have this idea of running the water lines up into the house and attaching a radiator inside, so I can use the waste heat to stay warm (my new hobby). I mean, if the motor is 40% efficient and putting out 10 HP under load, that means there's 15 HP (11KW) of power lost to heat. Some out the exhaust, some out the radiator, some to convection off the head/block. If I can trap the radiator portions of that, woo-hoo, I stay warm.

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  Feb. 2, 2009 12:41 p.m. jdmae92 Reader

  I can give you a Ninja 250 engine for free but I have never ran it and it has no carbs and the clutch plates are off (bought it as a parts bike). Not sure if it would be worth it to ship to you.

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  Feb. 2, 2009 1:04 p.m. Mental UltraDork

  If you need an underpowered motor to idle and produce 20 HP, don't you have 2 Harley's? Oh wait, you want reliability and water cooled.

  Oh thats right, I went there.

  But seriously, the old ninjette motor should do it. Dead reliable and very quiet at idle with a pair of mufflers.

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  Feb. 2, 2009 1:06 p.m. Kramer Reader

  I've thought about buying a wrecked bike and converting it to a genset. I wonder about governing/throttling the engine to keep up with the generator demand.

  My uncle has a PTO-powered generator that he attached to a 3-point hitch and his Kubota tractor. That seems much more sensible (except that Kubota tractors are expensive).

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  Feb. 2, 2009 1:13 p.m. Dr. Hess PowerDork

  Thanks for the offer, jdmrolla, but I think I would like to start with something complete, unless you're driving distance from NW Arkansas. I take it the ninja-things are water cooled. I would like EFI, but that's always do-able. Better to use a factory unit because then I don't have to buy all the pieces separately ($$). This is the generator I'm thinking of: 7.2KW, 3600 RPM, 30 amp 220V. I think I can rig up something to act as a governor. Servos and a spare computer to control it off the parallel port or something simple like a B&S engine uses (fan and a vane hooked to the throttle).

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  Feb. 2, 2009 1:14 p.m. minimac Dork

  There are a few Chinese liquid cooled scooters that are copies of the Yamaha and Honda motors. My dad also has a an old liquid cooled Honda 500 parts bike (that runs) that he picked up for $50. It seems that either of these would do what you want, but being no stranger to power outages here, my 6500 watt(peak)10 h.p. Briggs powered generator does just fine . I picked it up a few years ago for $450 or so and it has more than paid for itself. Right after I bought it, we were hit with an ice storm and Mrs. Mini and the Mini kids had to fend for themselves for five days-I was out of town working. They had lights, heat, refrigerator, stove and limited TV. The only problem was they had to refuel every 7-8 hours. The new mini house will have a natural gas whole house automatic setup. A bit pricey, but it will be worth it and be an additional selling point when we finally cut the cord to the northeast.

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  Feb. 2, 2009 1:22 p.m. aeronca65t Reader

  You really don't need watercooling.

  ~THIS~ Honda stationary engine will do fine. You can get gasoline or propane version. Lots of other choices on:

  www.smallenginewarehouse.com

  as well. The Hondas are US built, by the way.

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  Feb. 2, 2009 1:40 p.m. Dr. Hess PowerDork

  Humm. While I like doing projects, sometimes just throwing money at it: http://www.smallenginewarehouse.com/product.asp?PN=PBHG7000-R&desc=Briggs%20&a... is the easier solution. Honduh motor, 7KW, two wheels and handlebars, one large.

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  Feb. 2, 2009 2:02 p.m. Woody Dork

  From your initial description, it sounds like you want a late 70's- early 80's Honda CX500, V-twin (Guzzi style), water cooled, shaft drive, cheap and plentiful. Also available in 650 under the Silver Wing but much harder to find.

  ...and, no, don't even think about the CX650 Turbo.

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_CX_series

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  Feb. 2, 2009 2:21 p.m. stuart in mn Dork

  If you're planning this just for the challenge of building it yourself that's one thing, but otherwise I'd really recommend saving yourself a lot of headaches by buying a complete engine/generator. It will already be designed and built and tested and guaranteed to work. Honda, Onan, Generac are good names in the size you're looking for. Good quality generators run at 1800rpm, and you're going to have a hard time finding a motorcycle engine that will be happy doing that.

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  Feb. 2, 2009 2:30 p.m. Dr. Hess PowerDork

  Woody, I'm familiar with the CX500. My dad had one until he got pushed over a lane by a passing truck in L.A. Then he bought a GL11. I think the HP requirements might not put it in the efficient range of the motor, but I dunno.

  Stu, with a transmission and some gearing, it would be easy to run the engine at any speed that it likes. Like 2K engine speed or 3K, add some sprockets and pick a gear that seems about right. I am starting to agree with you on the store-bought advantages, though. Expecially if I can get it to the house for a grand with an oil filter and a Honduh motor.

  And the good news is: We Got Power!! Woo-Hoo!! Only 6 days without.

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  Feb. 2, 2009 6:23 p.m. porksboy HalfDork

  Thanks for bringing this up Dr. I live in the woods with electric utility only. Loose power and we also loose water and gate access. I would also consider going "off grid" if I could get eficeint enough.

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  Feb. 2, 2009 8:04 p.m. townsend7 New Reader

  Kawasaki KLR250. Water cooled, cheap and mostly bulletproof.

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  Feb. 2, 2009 9:03 p.m. ignorant PowerDork

  no no no no no.. bike engine no...

  http://www.listeroid.com/ <---- YES YES YES YES..

  A listeroid is dead nuts simple, will run off basically any oil, has a very simple cooling system, and they flat out work.

  http://www.f1-rocketboy.com/lister.html With those big flywheels and shot of ether she'll start.. come hell or high water. (and maybe a propane torch to warm it)

  http://www.listerengine.com/
  

  4 out of 5 militia members agree.. It's the thing to have when TSHTF

  even run it off gassified wood chips http://www.powercubes.com/listers.html

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  Feb. 3, 2009 7:16 a.m. spitfirebill HalfDork

  Why does stuff made in India have to be remanufactured to be any good? re: Listeroid deisel.
  

  I recall they had to (and may still) redo the old Matchless single cylinder bikes to make them any good.

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  Feb. 3, 2009 8:10 a.m. ignorant PowerDork

  Do not understand completely your question?
  

  but.. I'd assume part of it has to do with our relentless pursuit of the cheapest stuff on earth...

  I can point to parts today that come from India with submicron tolerances and are beautiful.... just wonderful actually.

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  Feb. 3, 2009 8:29 a.m. Jensenman UltimaDork

  Doc, don't you have a tractor? If so there's your powerplant. There are shaft drive gennies which are designed as an easy add on to pretty much any PTO and the tractor throttle is easily set to any RPM you want.

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  Feb. 3, 2009 9:43 a.m. stumpmj Dork

  Yep. A small tractor or riding lawnmover engine is what you need if you're building your own generator. They can actually run and make power at say 3600 RPM (you can use a belt to step that down to 1800 RPM for your generator). The bike engines just aren't made to put out as much power as you need in the way (constant load) or the engine speed that you need.

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