De Tomaso To Move Its Manufacturing Stateside

Mission AAR is a long-term, multi-stage, strategic initiative to return America’s automobile industry to its glory days of automotive design and preeminence. And it begins with our first step, which we are proudly taking today.” That’s how De Tomaso, maker of the iconic Pantera, describes its multi-stage plan—called Phases—to move its core operations to the U.S.

Currently in Phase One of Mission AAR, De Tomaso is reportedly in the process of finding a suitable location for its new operations, with discussions “well underway with multiple states.” An announcement about the selected location will be made in the coming months, with production of the P72 starting later in 2022.

De Tomaso, in a “relentless pursuit of excellence and with our sights set on an American Automotive Renaissance,” is also looking to collaborate with other notable manufacturers already operating in the U.S.—Tesla is mentioned—in order to “define the superior in automotive excellence, while renewing unparalleled pride in America’s automotive ingenuity.”

Until we get any more snippets of information, you can read more about the current state of Mission AAR over on the De Tomaso website at detomaso-automobili.com/mission-aar.

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alfadriver (Forum Supporter)
alfadriver (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
10/28/20 2:08 p.m.

2022 start up date suggests they are looking for an existing facility.  Even hand built cars need a lot of space and existing tools to do it. I wish them lots of luck!!!

nderwater
nderwater UltimaDork
10/28/20 2:26 p.m.

I’m not super optimistic about the viability of the company, but man i’d Love some of those cars on the road.

Colin Wood
Colin Wood Associate Editor
10/28/20 2:41 p.m.

In reply to nderwater :

Yeah, I'd say that I'm cautiously optimistic, especially in light of everything else going on in the world right now.

Snowdoggie
Snowdoggie HalfDork
10/28/20 2:45 p.m.

Is this the same company that build the Mangusta and the Pantera, or did somebody else just buy the name? 

Colin Wood
Colin Wood Associate Editor
10/28/20 2:48 p.m.

In reply to Snowdoggie :

More like somebody bought the name. Here's what Wikipedia says:

The rights to the De Tomaso brand were acquired by Norman Choi of Ideal Team Ventures in 2014. The new management under Choi's leadership undertook the task of reviving the brand. Five years later, the company unveiled its first product, the P72 retro-styled sports car at the Goodwood Festival of Speed, at the time of 60th anniversary of the De Tomaso brand. The car had been in development under the code name of "Project P". The new car is based on the Apollo Intensa Emozione's monocoque chassis, a car manufactured by De Tomaso's sister company Apollo Automobil and 72 units of the car will be sold.

A 401 CJ
A 401 CJ SuperDork
10/28/20 2:56 p.m.

What does Argentina have to do with it?  I see their flag.  Man that's a wild place.  Went down there one year for the Dakar.  I'm not sure I'd want to open up shop there though.  Chile maybe.  But Argentina es demasiado loco!

 

Wheels look full on Hot Wheels btw.  

Colin Wood
Colin Wood Associate Editor
10/28/20 2:58 p.m.

In reply to A 401 CJ :

De Tomaso's founder, Alejandro de Tomaso, was born in Argentina, but started the company in Modena.

Slippery (Forum Supporter)
Slippery (Forum Supporter) UltraDork
10/28/20 3:01 p.m.

In reply to A 401 CJ :

Alejandro De Tomaso was born in Argentina. 

That's why the flag is everywhere on the car. Wheel center caps, steering wheel, emblems. 

A 401 CJ
A 401 CJ SuperDork
10/28/20 3:05 p.m.

Sounds like Horatio Pagani took a page right out of Alejandro's playbook.  

Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter)
Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
10/28/20 3:24 p.m.

In reply to A 401 CJ :

Yeah, but he added a few more pages about staying in business and making a profit!

1988RedT2
1988RedT2 MegaDork
10/28/20 3:27 p.m.

I'm holding my breath for a 50th anniversary model of the original Pantera.

Snowdoggie
Snowdoggie HalfDork
10/28/20 3:51 p.m.
Slippery (Forum Supporter) said:

In reply to A 401 CJ :

Alejandro De Tomaso was born in Argentina. 

That's why the flag is everywhere on the car. Wheel center caps, steering wheel, emblems. 

De Tomaso was an interesting guy. He came from an aristocratic family in Argentina and had to leave there very quickly after trying to overthrow the Peron Regime. Yeah. The Perons that Madonna made a movie about. Then he moved to Italy, raced Formula One and started a car company. 

He died in 2003 and this company really has nothing to do with him. Some guys from Hong Kong bought the name. 

Pete Gossett (Forum Supporter)
Pete Gossett (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
10/28/20 5:56 p.m.

They're welcome to setup shop in my backyard. 

rustomatic
rustomatic Reader
10/28/20 6:25 p.m.

Did someone say 351 Cleveland?

A 401 CJ
A 401 CJ SuperDork
10/28/20 6:32 p.m.

In reply to rustomatic :

I always thought he messed up with that choice.  But I guess if Lincoln Mercury is going to sell your cars you gotta dance with who brung ya.  

Slippery (Forum Supporter)
Slippery (Forum Supporter) UltraDork
10/28/20 6:32 p.m.
A 401 CJ said:

Sounds like Horatio Pagani took a page right out of Alejandro's playbook.  

Horacio had Fangio's friendship to open doors for him. Especially Mercedes'. 
Pagani is only car manufacturer that can buy Mercedes engines directly from the factory and use them with their full support, that's thanks to Fangio. 

Slippery (Forum Supporter)
Slippery (Forum Supporter) UltraDork
10/28/20 6:33 p.m.
Snowdoggie said:
Slippery (Forum Supporter) said:

In reply to A 401 CJ :

Alejandro De Tomaso was born in Argentina. 

That's why the flag is everywhere on the car. Wheel center caps, steering wheel, emblems. 

De Tomaso was an interesting guy. He came from an aristocratic family in Argentina and had to leave there very quickly after trying to overthrow the Peron Regime. Yeah. The Perons that Madonna made a movie about. Then he moved to Italy, raced Formula One and started a car company. 

He died in 2003 and this company really has nothing to do with him. Some guys from Hong Kong bought the name. 

I was born in Argentina wink

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ PowerDork
10/28/20 6:33 p.m.

They're gonna need engineers- resume sent!

MotorsportsGordon
MotorsportsGordon HalfDork
10/28/20 7:52 p.m.
A 401 CJ said:

In reply to rustomatic :

I always thought he messed up with that choice.  But I guess if Lincoln Mercury is going to sell your cars you gotta dance with who brung ya.  

His previous cars the Vallelunga and Mangusta used ford engines aswell. Mangusta is Italian for mongoose which is the animal that can kill a cobra.

GTwannaB
GTwannaB HalfDork
10/28/20 7:59 p.m.

I think the engineers will need to understand fluid dynamics since I expect a lot of vaporware. 

pres589 (djronnebaum)
pres589 (djronnebaum) PowerDork
10/28/20 10:01 p.m.

In reply to ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ :

That same crossed my mind.  It would probaby be exciting; work on something very pretty with a lot of history and cachet to the name along with wondering if the next paycheck will bounce.

pres589 (djronnebaum)
pres589 (djronnebaum) PowerDork
10/28/20 10:07 p.m.
A 401 CJ said:

In reply to rustomatic :

I always thought he messed up with that choice.  But I guess if Lincoln Mercury is going to sell your cars you gotta dance with who brung ya.  

FoMoCo helped develop the car and I believe partially funded the factory and all sorts of things to make the Pantera a real product that wouldn't be a complete embarrassment.  Eventually they walked away.  It would be interesting to know how much money Ford burned on this little adventure.

As for the 351C, if it's 1970 and your car company had decided to go with an American engine for a mid-engined sports car, I don't know if there were that many better options out there.  Boss 302?  Some Ram Air Pontiac? 

MotorsportsGordon
MotorsportsGordon HalfDork
10/28/20 10:24 p.m.

Bruce mclarens street m6 gt used a 350 lt1 engine.

then there is the monterverdi hai 450 ss. Only 4 were built but used a 426 hemi.

 

MotorsportsGordon
MotorsportsGordon HalfDork
10/28/20 10:25 p.m.

The panteras predecessor the mangusta used 289 and 302 engines

Peabody
Peabody UltimaDork
10/28/20 11:17 p.m.

De Tomaso, in a “relentless pursuit of excellence and with our sights set on an American Automotive Renaissance,” is also looking to collaborate with other notable manufacturers already operating in the U.S.—Tesla is mentioned—in order to “define the superior in automotive excellence, while renewing unparalleled pride in America’s automotive ingenuity.”

Does anybody else see Elio as a good fit here?

pres589 (djronnebaum)
pres589 (djronnebaum) PowerDork
10/29/20 6:53 a.m.

I haven't heard what's actually better than the 351C at the time, just examples of other engines that might have worked, in cars built in extremely limited numbers.  I always like the Mangusta better anyway, myself, especially in the non-American versions with the prettier headlight setup.

alfadriver (Forum Supporter)
alfadriver (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
10/29/20 7:58 a.m.
pres589 (djronnebaum) said:
A 401 CJ said:

In reply to rustomatic :

I always thought he messed up with that choice.  But I guess if Lincoln Mercury is going to sell your cars you gotta dance with who brung ya.  

FoMoCo helped develop the car and I believe partially funded the factory and all sorts of things to make the Pantera a real product that wouldn't be a complete embarrassment.  Eventually they walked away.  It would be interesting to know how much money Ford burned on this little adventure.

As for the 351C, if it's 1970 and your car company had decided to go with an American engine for a mid-engined sports car, I don't know if there were that many better options out there.  Boss 302?  Some Ram Air Pontiac? 

In theory, the assistance can happen again.  Back a decade ago, we were supplying information to a company in LA that was planning on putting the 3.5l GTDI engine from the SHO into a mid-engined hybrid super car.  I think they got as far as making a prototype.  We were supporting their efforts, as best we could- and I think we would have stepped in to help some of the emissions work, too (at least I think we would have).

The  question would be who's powertrain would they use?

stafford1500
stafford1500 Dork
10/29/20 8:10 a.m.
alfadriver (Forum Supporter) said:
pres589 (djronnebaum) said:
A 401 CJ said:

In reply to rustomatic :

I always thought he messed up with that choice.  But I guess if Lincoln Mercury is going to sell your cars you gotta dance with who brung ya.  

FoMoCo helped develop the car and I believe partially funded the factory and all sorts of things to make the Pantera a real product that wouldn't be a complete embarrassment.  Eventually they walked away.  It would be interesting to know how much money Ford burned on this little adventure.

As for the 351C, if it's 1970 and your car company had decided to go with an American engine for a mid-engined sports car, I don't know if there were that many better options out there.  Boss 302?  Some Ram Air Pontiac? 

In theory, the assistance can happen again.  Back a decade ago, we were supplying information to a company in LA that was planning on putting the 3.5l GTDI engine from the SHO into a mid-engined hybrid super car.  I think they got as far as making a prototype.  We were supporting their efforts, as best we could- and I think we would have stepped in to help some of the emissions work, too (at least I think we would have).

The  question would be who's powertrain would they use?

I have some friends that worked on a project that sounds very similar to what you describe (including the manufacturer tie in). Astronomical name... The lead engineer is now involved with some electric muscle car project you may have heard of.

Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter)
Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
10/29/20 9:09 a.m.
Slippery (Forum Supporter) said:

Horacio had Fangio's friendship to open doors for him. Especially Mercedes'. 
Pagani is only car manufacturer that can buy Mercedes engines directly from the factory and use them with their full support, that's thanks to Fangio. 

Aston Martin?

alfadriver (Forum Supporter)
alfadriver (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
10/29/20 9:16 a.m.

In reply to stafford1500 :

I'm sure it's the same thing.  A quick google search suggests that they are still in business, but I've honestly have never seen any single item from Kepler Motorcars.

It's not a secret- they point out the 3.5 EB engine in the rear.

With Chevy now making a mid-engine Vette, and Ford just finishing a mid engined GT40, American based powertrains are out there.

Which would avoid one of the major costs of Elio.

Slippery (Forum Supporter)
Slippery (Forum Supporter) UltraDork
10/29/20 9:47 a.m.
Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter) said:
Slippery (Forum Supporter) said:

Horacio had Fangio's friendship to open doors for him. Especially Mercedes'. 
Pagani is only car manufacturer that can buy Mercedes engines directly from the factory and use them with their full support, that's thanks to Fangio. 

Aston Martin?

Pretty sure MB has a stake in Aston. 

STM317
STM317 UberDork
10/29/20 9:48 a.m.
alfadriver (Forum Supporter) said:
pres589 (djronnebaum) said:
A 401 CJ said:

In reply to rustomatic :

I always thought he messed up with that choice.  But I guess if Lincoln Mercury is going to sell your cars you gotta dance with who brung ya.  

FoMoCo helped develop the car and I believe partially funded the factory and all sorts of things to make the Pantera a real product that wouldn't be a complete embarrassment.  Eventually they walked away.  It would be interesting to know how much money Ford burned on this little adventure.

As for the 351C, if it's 1970 and your car company had decided to go with an American engine for a mid-engined sports car, I don't know if there were that many better options out there.  Boss 302?  Some Ram Air Pontiac? 

In theory, the assistance can happen again.  Back a decade ago, we were supplying information to a company in LA that was planning on putting the 3.5l GTDI engine from the SHO into a mid-engined hybrid super car.  I think they got as far as making a prototype.  We were supporting their efforts, as best we could- and I think we would have stepped in to help some of the emissions work, too (at least I think we would have).

The  question would be who's powertrain would they use?

For what it's worth, this DeTomaso will be powered by a 700hp supercharged 5.0 from Ford/Roush.

The parent company uses the same carbon monocoque in another vehicle with a Ferrari V12 powerplant too.

MotorsportsGordon
MotorsportsGordon HalfDork
10/29/20 10:12 a.m.
pres589 (djronnebaum) said:

I haven't heard what's actually better than the 351C at the time, just examples of other engines that might have worked, in cars built in extremely limited numbers.  I always like the Mangusta better anyway, myself, especially in the non-American versions with the prettier headlight setup.

Back then the best option would have probably been the Chevrolet zl1 427. Ultimate big block power numbers for the day with the advantage of aluminum block weight. Plus lots of experience in mid engine use with it in can am and endurance racing.

Snowdoggie
Snowdoggie HalfDork
10/29/20 10:56 a.m.

I remember back in 1970 when the Pantera came out in Lincoln Mercury Dealers. There was an ad in the back of Road and Track showing a yellow Pantera and a price of ten thousand dollars. My parents would take us out to dinner on Eldorado Street in Stockton, California where the car dealers had plate glass showrooms. Gene Gabbard Lincoln Mercury had a Pantera in the front window and a couple of German Capris towards the back with the big Mercurys and Lincolns. Across the street at Travale Porsche Audi a 911S was on display along with a 914-6 and an Audi 100LS. On the other side of town Norman Nock Motors offered brand new Jaguar XKEs, Triumph TR6s, GT6s and Spitfires as well as MGBs and Midgets plus lots of sports car racing swag and applications to join the local SCCA Chapter. Across the street from the British Flag at Stockton Datsun you could test drive the new 240Z.  

Cars were so much cooler back then. Sports cars were everywhere and nobody knew of Minivans and SUVs. 

iceracer
iceracer MegaDork
10/29/20 6:02 p.m.

In reply to MotorsportsGordon :   The 427 big block of that  day was all cast iron, there were aluminum heads available.

 

pres589 (djronnebaum)
pres589 (djronnebaum) PowerDork
10/29/20 6:07 p.m.

The ZL1 might be up there but that's another "they made dozens of those, not hundreds" situations.

It doesn't really matter 50 years on anyway.

A 401 CJ
A 401 CJ SuperDork
10/29/20 6:50 p.m.
MotorsportsGordon said:
A 401 CJ said:

In reply to rustomatic :

I always thought he messed up with that choice.  But I guess if Lincoln Mercury is going to sell your cars you gotta dance with who brung ya.  

His previous cars the Vallelunga and Mangusta used ford engines aswell. Mangusta is Italian for mongoose which is the animal that can kill a cobra.

That makes sense.  A Cobra at heart so it can kill itself.  Now, maybe it swallowed the Cobra.  That I could believe.

MotorsportsGordon
MotorsportsGordon HalfDork
10/29/20 7:08 p.m.
iceracer said:

In reply to MotorsportsGordon :   The 427 big block of that  day was all cast iron, there were aluminum heads available.

 

The zl1 is all aluminum 

MotorsportsGordon
MotorsportsGordon HalfDork
10/29/20 7:11 p.m.
pres589 (djronnebaum) said:

The ZL1 might be up there but that's another "they made dozens of those, not hundreds" situations.

It doesn't really matter 50 years on anyway.

The engine could be bought/ordered over the counter at any Chevy dealership though.

A 401 CJ
A 401 CJ SuperDork
10/29/20 7:35 p.m.

I think a 340 Mopar would have worked well.  Lightweight and still made half decent power after smog.

Or 401 AMC.  Those always ran better than they had any right to.  I’m talking post smog of course.  Everything ran pretty well in 1970.

MotorsportsGordon
MotorsportsGordon HalfDork
10/29/20 8:09 p.m.
A 401 CJ said:

I think a 340 Mopar would have worked well.  Lightweight and still made half decent power after smog.

Or 401 AMC.  Those always ran better than they had any right to.  I’m talking post smog of course.  Everything ran pretty well in 1970.

The AMX/3 body mold was sent to Italian grand tourer maker Giotto Bizzarrini, whose Turin facility hand made driveable mid-engined, steel bodied cars. Built on a 105.3 in (2,675 mm) wheelbase, the Bizzarrini prototypes used the AMC 390 cu in (6.4 L) V8 and an Italian OTO Melara four-speed transaxle. The AMX/3 is considered one of Bizzarrini's car-masterpieces.[106]

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