Nashco
Nashco UberDork
10/15/15 8:13 p.m.

Hey gang! I'm putting one of my oddball cars up for sale, and since many like minded weirdos like me accumulate here I figured you wouldn't mind knowing. It's listed on BaT with no reserve:

http://bringatrailer.com/listing/1959-fiat-600-multipla/

I had big ambitions when I got this one, but something better has entered my life and the fleet is bursting at the seams so this one is getting squeezed out of the fold. Thanks for checking it out, and you won't hurt my feelings if you tell your friends about the auction too!

Bryce

markwemple
markwemple Dork
10/15/15 9:02 p.m.

I know this is essentially zero dollars right now, but should this be in the open section since multipla prices are rarely below 2015?

Jumper K. Balls
Jumper K. Balls UberDork
10/15/15 11:13 p.m.

Just forwarded this to my boss. I hope we can make this work. I build 600 based cars all the time and he has done a multipla in the past so we know what we would be up against.

His had the stow and go seating though

84FSP
84FSP HalfDork
10/15/15 11:40 p.m.

Wow - that's a very cool beast.

Nashco
Nashco UberDork
10/16/15 1:54 a.m.
markwemple wrote: I know this is essentially zero dollars right now, but should this be in the open section since multipla prices are rarely below 2015?

Sure, feel free to move it when the price gets above $2015. Running a tight ship around here! Why, back in my day, we didn't have the open classifieds...I forgot it's a thing these days!

Bryce

Wall-e
Wall-e GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
10/17/15 7:31 p.m.

Too bad you are on the wrong side of the country. I would really like one of those.

Nashco
Nashco UberDork
10/21/15 1:47 p.m.

For the record, I called off the auction after selling the car to a local friend. I contacted BaT to let them know I needed to cancel the auction and they (Howard at BaT) got pretty nasty about it. I talked to him on the phone to see what I could do to help make things right (outside of just letting the auction run to completion, which was obviously not feasible) and he wouldn't entertain the conversation any further. I posted this on the auction after we spoke on the phone:

This car is no longer available, it’s gone to a local friend of mine. I’ve asked to have the auction cancelled and spoke with the folks at BaT, I’m guessing they’re going to close it shortly. Seems I’m going to lose my ability to use the site in the future, unfortunately, so thought I’d post here while I could. Sorry for the disappointment, folks, but good luck on your future oddball vehicle hunting!

The next day, my comment and any comments who semi-condoned my post were all deleted, even though the auction was still running and bids were still rolling in. After I emailed and left a voicemail with BaT again the next day, the auction was finally withdrawn. I never got a call back. Then, this was posted by BaT:

We have withdrawn this listing because the seller (user name: nashco) has decided not to follow through with his commitment to sell the vehicle here. We have a zero tolerance policy for liars and manipulators, so this seller has been banned from any future use of our site. It is so sad how little money people are willing to trade for their integrity. Thanks for the comments and bids on this one. We’re sorry that it went this way. It is the 3rd car withdrawn in 650+ auctions so far. -BaT

I'm not much for drama, but I certainly don't think this properly represents the fact of the matter and wanted to make sure GRM folks know better, as I've been in this community for longer than Bring a Trailer has even existed. Aside from telling friends on Facebook, GRM is the only other place I posted the auction link at.

I think it's extremely unprofessional for BaT to say I'm a liar and manipulator; I included in my original ad that I'd prefer to keep the car local to Oregon if possible, but they chose to leave that out when creating the auction. They also deleted my comment saying that the car was no longer available multiple days before the auction would have ended and why. Then they called me nasty names without allowing my side of the story to exist. Sounds pretty manipulative, but not on my behalf! To say I didn't follow through on my commitment and that I'm banned from future use of the site is totally fair. Shame on me, and my decision to cancel the auction obviously shouldn't go without consequences, even if they did already collect $250 from me just to post the auction. However, to say I traded my integrity for money when money had nothing to do with it is pretty low.

In short, sorry if somebody here was gunning for this car and I ruined it by cancelling the auction. As I told Howard on the phone, my friendship with this local guy was more important to me than letting the auction run and getting top dollar. I certainly wasn't trading integrity for cash, I actually felt the opposite. My wife definitely thinks I'm an idiot for not letting it go for top dollar on the auction, she's told me more than once.

I was excited to try BaT auctions, since I've had success finding cars there and having others find my cars, and I like the variety of vehicles they showcase. It seemed like a great fit for finding a Multipla buyer. Unfortunately, it seems it wasn't a match made in heaven for me, and I should have started by asking my friends, then craigslist, then ebay, then BaT (or something like that). Maybe in the future they'll find a better way of handling this than bad-mouthing paying customers (such as charging a cancellation fee), but for now let this be a lesson to you guys considering their service and go into it with your eyes wide open.

Bryce

bgkast
bgkast GRM+ Memberand UberDork
10/21/15 2:04 p.m.

Wow, I didn't know BAT stood for Butthurt All the Time.

Glad it stayed local.

oldtin
oldtin UberDork
10/21/15 2:11 p.m.

Sorry to hear about their reaction. I think you acted with integrity and as a stand-up guy in the willingness to accept reasonable consequences. Doesn't sound like they reacted reasonably.

dyintorace
dyintorace GRM+ Memberand UberDork
10/21/15 2:36 p.m.

Wow. That's an over-the-top reaction on their part. That takes the shine of BaT more than a little bit for me.

foxtrapper
foxtrapper UltimaDork
10/21/15 2:57 p.m.
Nashco wrote: ...this one is getting squeezed out of the fold.

The visuals that go with that line. Shudder.

british_wayland
british_wayland New Reader
10/21/15 3:02 p.m.

Their response was incredibly unprofessional. Makes me think twice about buying through them now

Ransom
Ransom GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
10/21/15 4:11 p.m.

Jeez, what did the auction agreement look like? Seems like a case they'd need to have a clause for... In any case, filing you under "liars and manipulators" for selling to a friend files them under "overreactors and hotheads" for me, and disappointingly removes them from the list of ways I was considering parting with my E28...

I don't see anything in the terms about cancellation excepting that BaT can do so. Moreover, this part makes it sounds like cancellation is covered:

Refund Policy Seller listing fee is not refundable once the listing goes live. Buyer fees are not refundable.

I read that to say "If you cancel your auction after it goes live, we keep the listing fee." If they want other penalties, their terms need more bullet points.

I'm a little disappointed.

markwemple
markwemple Dork
10/21/15 5:48 p.m.

Really sorry about what happened. I'm calling bs on Bat on this. I wonder how to file a formal complaint against them. This is slander, afterall.

JThw8
JThw8 UltimaDork
10/21/15 6:08 p.m.

Shocking, another car blog that's gotten too big for its britches.

ultraclyde
ultraclyde UltraDork
10/22/15 6:50 a.m.

Wow. From that description it really does sound like BaT is acting like an ass. Sure diminishes my opinion of them and makes me less likely to deal with them in the future.

Slippery
Slippery GRM+ Memberand Dork
10/22/15 7:34 a.m.

I dont know guys. I bought a car throught BAT auctions and I am in the process of listing one throught them, they are VERY clear that the car should not be advertised elsewhere.

They ask you if the car was previously listed as well.

I dont know the BAT guys but I can understand where they are coming from.

Not selling this car really did not affect their bottom line ... how much did they lose? $500 if it would have sold for $8k ...

If I was Nashco, I would have had his friend put his offer as a bid and discount the BAT fee from the bid ... Or split that and pay half of the fee.

This could have been arranged to run its course through BAT and everyone would have been happy.

I side with BAT this time ....

bearmtnmartin
bearmtnmartin GRM+ Memberand Dork
10/22/15 9:34 a.m.

I also think that if you commit to a auction you need to follow through. It makes the auction house look pretty cheesy if listing cannot be relied upon.

Nashco
Nashco UberDork
10/22/15 12:44 p.m.
Slippery wrote: I dont know guys. I bought a car throught BAT auctions and I am in the process of listing one throught them, they are VERY clear that the car should not be advertised elsewhere. They ask you if the car was previously listed as well. I dont know the BAT guys but I can understand where they are coming from. Not selling this car really did not affect their bottom line ... how much did they lose? $500 if it would have sold for $8k ... If I was Nashco, I would have had his friend put his offer as a bid and discount the BAT fee from the bid ... Or split that and pay half of the fee. This could have been arranged to run its course through BAT and everyone would have been happy. I side with BAT this time ....

To be clear, BaT asks, "Have you listed it anywhere else for sale since you've owned it?"

I'll play along with your theory, because you're not the first person to say, "You should have just made sure they were they high bidder so BaT wouldn't have been wise to it, probably happens all the time!" So let's just say I told my buddy to keep bidding through the roof to be sure he wins the auction and I'll still sell it to them for the same amount. Let's say that goes to $20k to be super generous, which means that adds $1000 to Bring a Trailer's bank account. The car still goes to the same guy, and BaT gets a pile of cash, but the auction isn't any more legit than just completely cancelling it. The only difference is that some people THOUGHT they had a chance (but didn't) and BaT gets more money. The auction is actually much less honest because it appears to be something it's not, and the only person that is better for it is the auction house which gets the increased buyer's fee.

So, isn't that trading integrity for money...on the auction house's behalf?

Seems it would be a lot more logical to just charge a significant auction cancelation fee to create incentive to let the auction run if they think it's so critical to the success of the business model that auctions run to completion (so they don't look "cheesy"). My car wasn't listed elsewhere before BaT, nor did I put it up on any other sites like craigslist or ebay. I started spreading the word with friends after I had already put it up on BaT. Surely this won't be the first time this ever happens, so perhaps they could work on a slight tweak to the terms and conditions rather than trash-talking paying customers and 100% filtering anything sellers say that they don't want people to hear.

I said above that I've enjoyed BaT in the past and I think they've got a good niche. Had they not called me out as a liar and manipulator after deleting my comment explaining what happened, that would have been the end of the story. They could have simply removed, "liars and manipulators, so this seller has been banned from any future use of our site. It is so sad how little money people are willing to trade for their integrity," from the comment and still conveyed that I've been banned from the site and the auction is cancelled. In my eyes, that's an individual representing a business clearly crossing the line, when personal attacks are fabricated and made without justification.

Bryce

TeamEvil
TeamEvil Dork
10/22/15 4:57 p.m.

Don't know about anyone else, but I sure feel lied to and manipulated . . .

bastomatic
bastomatic UltraDork
10/22/15 6:02 p.m.

I've dealt directly with BAT multiple times in the past few years. Professional, they are not.

wearymicrobe
wearymicrobe SuperDork
10/22/15 6:38 p.m.
bgkast wrote: Wow, I didn't know BAT stood for Butthurt All the Time. Glad it stayed local.

They are epic bad people. I sll classic all the time and I hate when one of them gets picked up by BAT. I have had to send a note to the owner several times to pull the ad down as I get calls from Europe all the time when they do asking to ship when I have US only sales. I get lip from them every single time, they are some of the biggest butt sniffers on the internet. Plus the one freaking time I bought a car from one of there sellers it ended up being the biggest turd I have ever bought and the car almost had to go back to the seller, no response from them on that as well.

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