I know that super sticky Hoosierdaddies don't go against my Challenge budget but they still really hit my REAL wallet super hard. I really want a set but the reality is that $h!tbarge doesn't see enough autocross action to warrant a $1000 investment. 

I does get hooked around from he to work and down (the empty section of) East MN Dragway and public street. 

I propose for those like me, an opportunity to buy the crappiest new tires eBay and Amazon offer and compete on a completely new playing field. One of ice and danger.

Let's work it out! Some parameters/rule:

Must not be a popular manufacturer, and by popular I mean no Mickey Thompson, Hoosier, Goodyear etc. I'm talking tires like the Cosmo MuchoMacho or the Achilles ATR or even the Forceum Hena!

Let's have some sketchy fun out there!

DeadSkunk  (Warren)
DeadSkunk (Warren) PowerDork
2/5/21 8:12 a.m.

You trying to turn the autocross competition into a Drift Kings event?

captdownshift (Forum Supporter)
captdownshift (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand UltimaDork
2/5/21 8:21 a.m.

This is an opportunity for a team to gain product sponsorship, seriously. 

If you were to reach out to a Zestino distributor with regards to the challenge, the usual tires that teams run, highlight that tires AREN'T part of the budget but offer to utilize their product against the likes of MTs and purple crack, that may yield a set of four tires in exchange for some decals and a write up. Double bonus if someone else is running that same bolt pattern and size wheels and tires allowing you to swap out for unofficial runs for comparison purposes. 

If I were a vendor, I'd totally be on board with this. 

nocones
nocones GRM+ Memberand UberDork
2/5/21 8:24 a.m.

I actaully would enjoy finding a tire that is tolerant of heavy track use, long lasting, Linear in feel..      And has grip I guess. 

I've ran good feeling 320 TW tires at track days before and it destroys them quickly enough that their longer inherent wear is overcome by accelerated shoulder wear/chunking/graining.

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
2/5/21 10:18 a.m.

ummmmm, gastropod?

I've thought for a long time that a fun subclass would be a 'spec tire' class. 

Catch22
Catch22 New Reader
2/5/21 10:45 a.m.

There is a 200 treadwear option!

I ran went that route for last years Challenge for the same reasons listed above.  I don't do many/any Auto-x events so I can't justify the super stickies either.  But I do partake in track days and the 200 TW tires will get some additional use there!  There was at least 2 of us, but I have no idea how many others were running in the 200 TW class?

I've also had good luck with 300 TW tires on a heavy TSX wagon on 6 track days, with good results.  One set got me 30,000 miles and 3 track days of fun.

John Welsh
John Welsh Mod Squad
2/5/21 1:27 p.m.

In reply to QuasiMofo (John Brown) Forum Supporter :

For me, when I had the second Infiniti Q45, that took 10th place overall, I went with RE-71s, a 200tw tire as my only tire.  I knew that this car would only sse good weather driving so having a summer only tread didn't bother me.  As for durability, I had about 1500 miles on the tires when I left for Gainesville.  That was 1500 street miles that included two drag strip nights and one autocross where the Q45 served as a two driver car.  I then drove these RE-71s another 1,000 miles of interstate down to Gainesville.  This means I hit The Challenge with about 2,500 road miles on the tires...took 10th and with a 25 year old stock suspension too.  After the event I then drove another 1,000 miles home.  Over the next few summers I autox'ed and dragged the car often.  When I sold the car to Pat there were probably 7,000 miles on those tires.  

So, my advice is buy 200 tw tires and just drive the damn things everywhere.  This gave me tires that would perform how I wanted the car to perform as well as still be able to take the infrequent road driving that I did with the car.   

In short, I could have bought pedestrian tires and treated them wrong with track use.  Instead, I bought track tires and treated them wrong with pedestrian use.  

After mounting costs, the 200tw tires probably cost me less than 1.5x what total crap, pedestrian tires, would have cost.  

 

I just went over to tire rack and guessed at the popular size of 225/45/17

$666 for 4 RE-71s, 200tw
$500 for 4 Falken 200tw
$300 for 4 Firestone Firehawk close outs

Mounting will cost the same for either so only $200 to $300 savings to have tires you don't want.  

$250 for some brand named Solar  and WestLake brand were still near $300 for 4 on the simpletire website.  Not worth the savings to me.  

eastsideTim
eastsideTim PowerDork
2/5/21 1:55 p.m.

I thought there was already a street tire class?

DeadSkunk  (Warren)
DeadSkunk (Warren) PowerDork
2/5/21 5:02 p.m.
eastsideTim said:

I thought there was already a street tire class?

There is, but John is advocating a "crappy street tire" class.

In reply to Robbie (Forum Supporter) :

I think that is basically my idea. 

I have $70 285/35r18s on my car currently. I truly wanted to see what those tires did to the likes of Cuttita and companies 300, Whitaker's RX7 and any other 5x4.5 bolt circle car out there (I started to type all the cars faster than mine but realized they all were).

I think driving a car past the limitations of the tire is nearly as fon as driving at the limit. 

In reply to John Welsh :

Drive it? Like on the road? You didn't get to see the building we hauled $h!tbarge down in did you? devil

 

Yes, I probably should just try buy some 200tws or my alternate idea was a set of 315/35r17 Drag Radials on the rear and a set of stickies up front and just send it.

SVreX (Forum Supporter)
SVreX (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
2/7/21 6:16 a.m.

My best performances at the Challenge (including 3 autocross podium finishes) have all been on used race cast-off tires, which I was able to INCLUDE in my budget. 
 

I did bring a car once with brand new autocross rubber, and it did perform very well, but I am not convinced it was good enough to justify the expense. 
 

Great rubber will always help, but it's really not necessary at the Challenge. It's a competition of compromises, and the sum total of all the compromises determines the finish.  Great tires on a crappy car can improve its performance, but can also mask its flaws. 
 

It's different if you are running 10 second quarter mile passes and spending your "free" tire budget on drag tires, but only a couple teams are doing that. 
 

 

mazdeuce - Seth
mazdeuce - Seth Mod Squad
2/7/21 7:47 a.m.

I figured out a few years ago that nobody is making me run good tires anywhere. So now I don't unless I have a reason to. Nobody is stopping you from running 400TW tires at the Challenge and setting the driftiest times on the AX course. Be that guy. Have fun. 

In reply to mazdeuce - Seth :

I managed to locate the limit of 400tw Achilles ATR2 285/35zr18s as the entire car drifted off ate four cones (they technically ended up parked on top of the splitter) and came to a stop where the corner worker was hanging out. 

It inspired this whole idea.

 

slowbird
slowbird UltraDork
2/7/21 10:29 p.m.

600tw class ftw! laugh

SVreX (Forum Supporter)
SVreX (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
2/8/21 5:36 a.m.

Extra points if you show up rolling on 4 donut spares. 

bobzilla
bobzilla MegaDork
2/8/21 6:12 a.m.

Westlakes. It's what I have on the tib still from the challenge and damn they're terrible at everything. They're stupid cheap and available in a ton of sizes on amazon

mazdeuce - Seth
mazdeuce - Seth Mod Squad
2/8/21 6:44 a.m.

Westlakes installed by my sketchy neighborhood tire guy for $5 a tire including disposal is my jam. 

bobzilla
bobzilla MegaDork
2/8/21 6:46 a.m.

In reply to mazdeuce - Seth :

Their truck tires are actually really good for the money. We bought sone for her Sierra and they've been great in rain, snow and ice. 

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