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Patrick (Forum Supporter)
Patrick (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
11/1/20 6:09 p.m.

I wish i could sit here and down vote a post a billion times.  That would give me more satisfaction than any rule clarifications or updates.  

Stampie (FS)
Stampie (FS) MegaDork
11/1/20 6:10 p.m.
ckosacranoid said:

How about an idea for something that would cover everyone and put into writing a set price for the cage. If you are going to have to run a cage in a car for what ever reason why not have the magazine come out in the rules and just states point blank that if you have to run a minimum cage for a car this is the set price. 

Some sid that you can get a prr built bolt in cage for so much money. See what the price is for a basic unit and then set that price for the cost, then if you bolt it is or have to get some one else to weld it then the cost is this. If you go for a full add cage in the car then find a full cage and set that price for the full cage.

This way, yes you might be able to  get the cage super cheap and do the work your self, someone else might not have the skill to weld it in so they would have to get some one to to it for them. This way it make the cage price fixed and everyone knows what it is so they can figure it out before hand and then this is just for the bare rule cage that the rules of the NHRA. 

I think some one said it was $300 for a cage, use that price or check a couple of places and have the final ruling from GRM. 

This way it make the cost fixed and helps to get people to really make sure that they think about saving everyone grief down the road. We have to what I know only one or two people really hurt in 21 years of this event. I think  a couple of members of Wreak racing needed to medical help one year when a fly wheel blew up or a crank at the autocross and hurt them.

Because some of us do things like drive 13 hours at FL minium wage to get 80 feet of tubing for ~$150.  A big part of the Challenge is working to find/make the deal.  If you have a set price then it's not a "challenge" .  It's a spec race.

DeadSkunk  (Warren)
DeadSkunk (Warren) PowerDork
11/1/20 7:05 p.m.

In reply to Stampie (FS) :

Well said. The hunt for cheap parts is a big part of the Challenge.

Kbags
Kbags New Reader
11/1/20 8:10 p.m.

I will say I don't have the skill to build a cage from scratch but I have no problem Paying 250 for a cage from summit if I have too

Stampie (FS)
Stampie (FS) MegaDork
11/1/20 8:13 p.m.

In reply to Kbags :

You have the skill, you just don't know it yet.  

Tom Suddard
Tom Suddard Director of Marketing & Digital Assets
11/1/20 9:57 p.m.

Just dropping by to let everyone know I've been reading and listening. Keep the feedback coming, everybody. 

DeadSkunk  (Warren)
DeadSkunk (Warren) PowerDork
11/2/20 6:48 a.m.

In reply to Tom Suddard :

Off topic, but hows your health Kid? Over the Covid thing yet?

DeadSkunk  (Warren)
DeadSkunk (Warren) PowerDork
11/2/20 6:51 a.m.
Stampie (FS) said:

In reply to Kbags :

You have the skill, you just don't know it yet.  

Stampie nailed it with one simple statement, This right here is the way to view the Challenge. Test yourself too, not just a car you buy/build/modify. The actual competition is certainly entertaining and fun to watch or participate in, but stretching your own skill set is a very rewarding part of it all. Seeing the fruits of your labour actually running and competing feels pretty good.

captdownshift (Forum Supporter)
captdownshift (Forum Supporter) UltimaDork
11/2/20 10:09 a.m.

I have a rule proposal to prevent a loophole from being utilized or created (that would violate the don't be a dick rule). If you have two vehicles of the same chassis or engine. you shouldn't be allowed to purchase a new part, install it and run it on one vehicle, then swap it over onto the other a few months later and assign it fair market value for being used. 

For example, the EGT is getting pressed into daily duty through the winter since the xB was totaled. I'm refreshing some things and opted for $170 top hats with adjustable camber plates for the front. Come May or June, I shouldn't be allowed to swap those onto the 323 for a reduced value. Their value should remain $170. 

maschinenbau (I live here)
maschinenbau (I live here) SuperDork
11/2/20 10:43 a.m.

In reply to captdownshift (Forum Supporter) :

Sounds like the "don't be a dick" rule already covers that. No extra rule necessary. But now I'm watching you come Challenge time... laugh

captdownshift (Forum Supporter)
captdownshift (Forum Supporter) UltimaDork
11/2/20 11:25 a.m.

In reply to maschinenbau (I live here) :

If I utilize a loophole, it's going to be larger then that and will have a rule made in my namesake afterwards. 

captdownshift (Forum Supporter)
captdownshift (Forum Supporter) UltimaDork
11/2/20 12:36 p.m.

Also, I've been curious about the idea of having Calcuttas, both overall and within subclasses, with a twist. Think Calcuttas for a cause. Where 50% of the take would go to a selected charity or cause. 30% to the winner, 15% to second place and 5% to third place. 

In addition to overall it could be done for:

Autocross

Drags

Concourse

200tw

Official subclass 

Driven to the event (and home) 

Etc. 

 

As they're common in angling tournaments, I suspect that there wouldn't be any issues regarding the legality within the state of Florida, especially with 50% of the calcutta entry going towards a charitable donation. The only potential issue, everybody who takes part in the calcuttas would need to agree that the results are "a game of chance" due to weather and atmospheric conditions. This is important for two reasons, first being taxation if skill is involved, second being protest and whining beyond standard challenge procedure and operating protocol. 

 

I expect this proposal to likely get shot down in a ball of flames and I'm okay with that, but I still wanted to bring it up. It would be an opportunity to raise a few dollars before some causes that are near and dear to us, but I acknowledge that as soon as side pots and additional investment get thrown in it brings out the worst in some people.

Andy Neuman
Andy Neuman SuperDork
11/2/20 12:56 p.m.

In reply to captdownshift (Forum Supporter) :

I'm fine if you FMV the item after use as long as it is the method of finding 3 adds with the same item for sale. 
Having us lowballers assigning FMV is kind of a cheaty way of doing things. That basically allows junkyard or scrap prices for everything. 
 

I think the roll bar rule has been way over discussed barely anyone actually needs one for their challenge car. 

solfly
solfly Dork
11/2/20 1:10 p.m.

I've never competed but I noticed this in a build thread, commented then deleted as I didn't want to stir anything up.

Builder mentioned slipping parts from the junkyard into a pocket or hiding inside another part.

Wondered what the rules were on that since I see other guys counting $.03 worth of washers or whatever.

Like I said not involved just caught my eye at one point.

 

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
11/2/20 1:29 p.m.
solfly said:

I've never competed but I noticed this in a build thread, commented then deleted as I didn't want to stir anything up.

Builder mentioned slipping parts from the junkyard into a pocket or hiding inside another part.

Wondered what the rules were on that since I see other guys counting $.03 worth of washers or whatever.

Like I said not involved just caught my eye at one point.

 

If you steal something, you must budget it at FMV. But there is a rule where if you get a handful of small stuff 'free' at a junkyard with an entry fee or whatever, you can budget the connector or relay or used air freshener etc at the entry fee price. 

Cooter
Cooter UberDork
11/2/20 1:50 p.m.

I honestly don't even understand the point of "pocketing" parts from junkyards.   I show them all the small stuff, and even the medium stuff, and 9 times out of 10, they wave me out the door for free.

Stampie (FS)
Stampie (FS) MegaDork
11/2/20 2:11 p.m.

In reply to Cooter :

Me too.

Mr_Asa
Mr_Asa SuperDork
11/2/20 2:13 p.m.

In reply to Cooter :

Depends on the yard and who is working the desk.

I know a couple guys that will charge for everything they can.  A couple that will overlook a lot.

Stampie (FS)
Stampie (FS) MegaDork
11/2/20 2:17 p.m.

In reply to solfly :

I wouldn't hide a part inside another part but would I present it in a way they might assume the parts belong together?  Yep.  For example, and this might be what you were talking about, I bought a hub and 2 brackets for the 350z.  The brackets both had a hole perfect to fit over a wheel stud.  I put the hub with the two brackets on the counter in plain sight.  She didn't charge me for the brackets.  But it goes both ways.  I had the manager charge me for a "sensor" that was actually just the vacuum nub off the intake I was buying.

Cooter
Cooter UberDork
11/2/20 2:33 p.m.

In reply to Mr_Asa :

This is all over the country, from Pennsylvania to Portland.   I travel a lot.


Regardless, I don't see that as an excuse to steal.   

Brett_Murphy (Ex-Patrón)
Brett_Murphy (Ex-Patrón) MegaDork
11/2/20 3:11 p.m.

Not challenge related, but with brand new 4 cylinder factory cars capable of running 13.9 off of the showroom floor and showroom V8s running in the 12s, I'm wondering how drag strips handle that sort of timing with no roll cage.
 

Andy Neuman
Andy Neuman SuperDork
11/2/20 3:15 p.m.

In reply to Brett_Murphy (Ex-Patrón) :

You can run an 11.50 without any additional roll protection in a fixed roof car. 

Most tracks will ask you nicely not to come back without proper safety gear after running faster. 

 

Patrick (Forum Supporter)
Patrick (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
11/2/20 3:31 p.m.

In reply to Brett_Murphy (Ex-Patrón) :

most of these new hardtop cars have their own addendum to the rules that let them go 10.0 without additional protection, believe it's 2008+ cars running slower than 9.99 and 135mph are exempt

 

Brett_Murphy (Ex-Patrón)
Brett_Murphy (Ex-Patrón) MegaDork
11/2/20 5:35 p.m.

Thanks Andy and Patrick. 

wheels777
wheels777 UltraDork
11/2/20 6:57 p.m.
DeadSkunk (Warren) said:

In reply to Stampie (FS) :

Well said. The hunt for cheap parts is a big part of the Challenge.

True

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