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Patrick
Patrick MegaDork
12/3/19 7:32 p.m.

I'm guessing they would hand your book back for a change in budget

Bent-Valve
Bent-Valve HalfDork
12/3/19 7:33 p.m.

I'll abide by which ever, water only or antifreeze.

If you ask my opinion, well, I drove through sleet still towing the ZX2 home this last time. It was 3 days after the meet but there were still freezing temps as I got close to home. I plan (hope?) to build a drivable entry this next time.

On the other hand if you try Richard Tomlin's White Pony it picks up water, antifreeze and oil like nothing I have ever seen before. I tested it and it will pick up oil AND then pick up water. It is some seriously weird and neat stuff.

SVreX
SVreX MegaDork
12/3/19 7:37 p.m.
Patrick said:

I'm guessing they would hand your book back for a change in budget

I’m sure they would. But then:

Handwritten budgets will not be accepted. 

Makes it hard to adjust at the track. 

The documentation requirements need some work. wink

SVreX
SVreX MegaDork
12/3/19 7:43 p.m.
Patrick said:

That's not a discrepancy.  That's for teams who elect to grab their build book for concours use/display, it has to be turned back in

Then it should say “return their build book”, or “turn their build book back in” instead of “must turn in their build book”. 

As written, it looks like a discrepancy. 

Indy-Guy
Indy-Guy PowerDork
12/3/19 7:50 p.m.
Patrick said:

I do not like or agree with that one and ask you to reconsider.  Nowhere i run do they not let you use coolant.  I think it's going to turn off the gastropod type daily drivers from showing up

edit: as robbie said as well, it's easy for us to see freezing temps on the way down or back.  

Yes. Big inconvenience.  This is my Challenge car a few days after the event (returned to daily duty up North)

DeadSkunk  (Warren)
DeadSkunk (Warren) PowerDork
12/3/19 8:17 p.m.

I ran my 2017 Challenge car on water and drained it once I got home to Michigan. Added the antifreeze for the winter use. It's not a show stopper. Had I been driving it home through freezing temperatures, I suppose I could have let a bunch of water out and added antifreeze in Gainesville.

davbro
davbro New Reader
12/3/19 11:35 p.m.

I Like this section "Ways to prove fair market value include:...." as it states the criteria

Antihero
Antihero GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
12/4/19 12:46 a.m.
DeadSkunk (Warren) said:

I ran my 2017 Challenge car on water and drained it once I got home to Michigan. Added the antifreeze for the winter use. It's not a show stopper. Had I been driving it home through freezing temperatures, I suppose I could have let a bunch of water out and added antifreeze in Gainesville.

It's not,but it's not like antifreeze is only used to make stuff not freeze, it's helpful for corrosion and not overheating. 

 

Both probably very helpful in a car built for $2000 that is pushed way way harder than a normal car 

Tom Suddard
Tom Suddard GRM+ Memberand Director of Marketing & Digital Assets
12/4/19 8:17 a.m.

Okay okay, I'll allow antifreeze. But don't put it on our track!!!

I'll refine build book timing/updating wording, too.

Tom Suddard
Tom Suddard GRM+ Memberand Director of Marketing & Digital Assets
12/4/19 8:27 a.m.

And it should now be fixed.

Patrick
Patrick MegaDork
12/4/19 8:30 a.m.

Thank you, Tom.  I appreciate that you came here for input with a willingness to revise 

Stampie
Stampie GRM+ Memberand UltimaDork
12/4/19 9:32 a.m.
Stampie said:

Core charges must be included in your budget. If you return the core, the refund is considered a discount on a part’s purchase, not recoup.

We discussed this and I thought everyone agreed that cores on used parts (Junkyard) would be exempt but cores on new parts wouldn't be. 

Don’t forget this in the great antifreeze debate. 

Robbie
Robbie GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
12/4/19 10:00 a.m.

In reply to Stampie :

I don't remember that... Probably missed it.

But what I don't understand is why would that be? It's part of the cost of the part unless you have a core to trade back in, right?

Antihero
Antihero GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
12/4/19 10:08 a.m.
Tom Suddard said:

Okay okay, I'll allow antifreeze. But don't put it on our track!!!

I'll refine build book timing/updating wording, too.

Thank you

Tom Suddard
Tom Suddard GRM+ Memberand Director of Marketing & Digital Assets
12/4/19 10:59 a.m.

In reply to Robbie :

Yeah, sorry Stampie but I thought it over and core charges need to count. Even when they're blatant money grabs–just buy elsewhere. 

Robbie
Robbie GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
12/4/19 11:36 a.m.

Small clarification:

Re: Brake friction materials may be replaced with fresh ones in like for like scenarios.  (Paraphrased)

Is a turned rotor or drum treated like a "fresh" rotor or drum? 

ie is the cost of having a stock and already-in-the-budget rotor or drum turned exempt?

nocones
nocones GRM+ Memberand UltraDork
12/4/19 11:50 a.m.

Hmm..  looks like Subaru may be exhibition only..   though I intend to retain the full production bodywork just not necessarily in the same locations.  

Dusterbd13-michael
Dusterbd13-michael MegaDork
12/4/19 11:54 a.m.

Id argue that its a production body with ludicrous flares. Your good.

AngryCorvair
AngryCorvair GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
12/4/19 12:00 p.m.
Dusterbd13-michael said:

Id argue that its a production body with ludicrous flares. Your good.

agreed

Stampie
Stampie GRM+ Memberand UltimaDork
12/4/19 12:07 p.m.
Tom Suddard said:

In reply to Robbie :

Yeah, sorry Stampie but I thought it over and core charges need to count. Even when they're blatant money grabs–just buy elsewhere. 

Ok but now I'm going to run antifreeze just so I feel like I won a battle .

Tom Suddard
Tom Suddard GRM+ Memberand Director of Marketing & Digital Assets
12/4/19 12:11 p.m.

In reply to Stampie :

Maybe it will keep your car from exploding again this year. 

Stampie
Stampie GRM+ Memberand UltimaDork
12/4/19 12:18 p.m.

In reply to Tom Suddard :

Valid point .

Patrick
Patrick MegaDork
12/4/19 12:36 p.m.
Tom Suddard said:

In reply to Stampie :

Maybe it will keep your car from exploding again this year. 

Damnnnnnnnnnn

davbro
davbro New Reader
12/4/19 2:57 p.m.

So i had posted this on the old rules page

"how are OBD tuners (like HP Tuners) counted in the budget,  the entire price of the unit plus the credits or just the credits?  Technically only the credits "stay" with the car.  Also if you pay someone to flash the ecu what you would be paying for is essentially the credits that allow you to upload a tune.  Researching a future build and was curious as to how these are handled"

I have since read the new proposed rules and saw that HP Tuner credits are exempt (which makes sense as written).  Would the second sentence below also mean that the device is not included as it doesn't stay with the car?  Just trying to get some clarification

"Tool rental is not included in your budget. Buying credits for devices like HP Tuners is considered tool rental, and is budget exempt.

If a computer is in the car during competition, it and its cables/adapters are exempt from the budget provided they are easily removable, leaving every vehicle feature fully functional in their absence."

Tom Suddard
Tom Suddard GRM+ Memberand Director of Marketing & Digital Assets
12/4/19 3:10 p.m.

That's correct. HP Tuners and similar is free. 

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