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svxsti
svxsti Reader
8/27/20 2:10 p.m.

 

The final solution in super car beaters. When I first seen FFR's truck I shook my head and thought what's the point......then it hit me! Dually! All the RWD guys complain they can't keep up with the AWD guys at events with over 500hp unless you can afford a McLaren P1 to hook the asphalt. Well now I am going to take a 2400 lb track tested chassis that can hold an 800hp V8 from a salvaged LS3 for easy replacement under a bolt on supercharger and make it a dually with 6) 315/35R17×11s. Why? The 315/30R18 has proven itself on the front of Le Mans winning cars with this curb weight and under the 500hp 911 GT2, then of course the affordability and manageability on bumpy surfaces. 

Deep breath.

This is it, the street legal car I am going to lap VIR and Laguna Seca faster than anything street legal ever, but at the end of the day I think I'm still going to hop in my Renault Formula V6 powered Exige Cup just for the sound on mountain roads.

Indy "Nub" Guy
Indy "Nub" Guy PowerDork
11/18/20 1:12 p.m.

So, looks like you decided to buy a Boxster disguised as a Lambo Countach instead ?

 

BA5
BA5 Reader
11/18/20 1:33 p.m.

These posts all read like an imaginative, trying-to-be-cool-on-the-internet 13 year old.

But supposedly he's been a member since 2008.  Weird.

dherr (Forum Supporter)
dherr (Forum Supporter) Dork
11/18/20 1:56 p.m.

I looked up his profile and felt the same way. The posts are all about over the top stuff, but we will soon see if they are for real or not. But because I am in the mood, I feel the need to add to this thread the following.....

When I first saw Cadillac's Eldorado back at the Country Club when growing up, I just knew that it lacked traction front and rear. So I set out to solve that problem and the solution was so obvious I am shocked I did not think of it sooner. 8 wheels! I am sticking an LT5 ZR1 supercharged crate motor in it and figure it will run 9's and also allow me to still take the golf clubs on Sunday. smiley

MadScientistMatt
MadScientistMatt UltimaDork
11/18/20 3:12 p.m.

There's another way to solve an Eldorado's lack of traction.

Putting a Northstar in the trunk.

bobzilla
bobzilla MegaDork
11/18/20 3:22 p.m.
wvumtnbkr
wvumtnbkr PowerDork
11/19/20 2:51 p.m.

Lolz.  If it had tires that wide on the back, it would be much slower than if it had normal size tires...

 

If love to meet all these guys who are struggling to put down 500 hp.  I didn't realize that was a thing.

 

I mean, there are certain people on this board that are running 9s rwd with a budget of 2k.  

svxsti
svxsti Reader
11/20/20 8:36 a.m.
Indy "Nub" Guy said:

So, looks like you decided to buy a Boxster disguised as a Lambo Countach instead ?

 

I may not have a toy box like Jay Leno but the truck is being built on a Factory Five kit, should be ready by spring, and it will be a dually with Supercharged LS3.

svxsti
svxsti Reader
11/20/20 8:38 a.m.
BA5 said:

These posts all read like an imaginative, trying-to-be-cool-on-the-internet 13 year old.

But supposedly he's been a member since 2008.  Weird.

Yep and thats me in my avatar with a new Audi A4 Cabriolet and twins that were both Geminis too, Tatiana and Katiana.

svxsti
svxsti Reader
11/20/20 8:41 a.m.
dherr (Forum Supporter) said:

I looked up his profile and felt the same way. The posts are all about over the top stuff, but we will soon see if they are for real or not. But because I am in the mood, I feel the need to add to this thread the following.....

When I first saw Cadillac's Eldorado back at the Country Club when growing up, I just knew that it lacked traction front and rear. So I set out to solve that problem and the solution was so obvious I am shocked I did not think of it sooner. 8 wheels! I am sticking an LT5 ZR1 supercharged crate motor in it and figure it will run 9's and also allow me to still take the golf clubs on Sunday. smiley

Is that the one from the Guiness Book with a helicopter launch pad? LT5 was a Mercury Marine tank, huge waste of money. The ohv will always be the lowest lb/hp.

svxsti
svxsti Reader
11/20/20 8:51 a.m.
wvumtnbkr said:

Lolz.  If it had tires that wide on the back, it would be much slower than if it had normal size tires...

 

If love to meet all these guys who are struggling to put down 500 hp.  I didn't realize that was a thing.

 

I mean, there are certain people on this board that are running 9s rwd with a budget of 2k.  

I've been to autocross events where anything over 500hp just spins the RWD cars out and the AWD cars dominate. Asphalt is much different than a race track, you can actually feel your feet stick the race track when you walk across it, and with racing tires RWD cars work, unless you have the electronics of a McLaren P1. 

The Dually concept on a 2400 lb kit truck will simulate the traction of a racing slick on a racetrack at autocross events on DOT tires.  Will be fun to watch. 

Indy "Nub" Guy
Indy "Nub" Guy PowerDork
11/20/20 9:15 a.m.
svxsti said:
Indy "Nub" Guy said:

So, looks like you decided to buy a Boxster disguised as a Lambo Countach instead ?

 

I may not have a toy box like Jay Leno but the truck is being built on a Factory Five kit, should be ready by spring, and it will be a dually with Supercharged LS3.

Sweet!

Can you post some in-process build pics?  I'd like to follow along.  What size tires and rims and how are you attaching the rims together?  I assume you're not just going to use HEAVY Truck wheels and tires.

 

Javelin (Forum Supporter)
Javelin (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
11/20/20 9:30 a.m.
svxsti said:
BA5 said:

These posts all read like an imaginative, trying-to-be-cool-on-the-internet 13 year old.

But supposedly he's been a member since 2008.  Weird.

Yep and thats me in my avatar with a new Audi A4 Cabriolet and twins that were both Geminis too, Tatiana and Katiana.

I call bull E36 M3 again. There is no A4 cabriolet, it's an A5 with a drop top. As someone who actually owned 3 A4's and an S4, I know this. Just stop kid.

svxsti
svxsti Reader
11/20/20 10:21 a.m.
Indy "Nub" Guy said:
svxsti said:
Indy "Nub" Guy said:

So, looks like you decided to buy a Boxster disguised as a Lambo Countach instead ?

 

I may not have a toy box like Jay Leno but the truck is being built on a Factory Five kit, should be ready by spring, and it will be a dually with Supercharged LS3.

Sweet!

Can you post some in-process build pics?  I'd like to follow along.  What size tires and rims and how are you attaching the rims together?  I assume you're not just going to use HEAVY Truck wheels and tires.

 

To avoid the cost of custom wheels we found some new 6 bolt 18x12 Fuel Wheels for $325 each for a 315/30R18s. They are a bit heavy, 45 lbs each.

BlueInGreen - Jon (Forum Supporter)
BlueInGreen - Jon (Forum Supporter) UltraDork
11/20/20 10:28 a.m.

The concept of something with an extra wide dual axle attempting to navigate cones in a parking lot is actually pretty hilarious.

svxsti
svxsti Reader
11/20/20 10:45 a.m.
Javelin (Forum Supporter) said:
svxsti said:
BA5 said:

These posts all read like an imaginative, trying-to-be-cool-on-the-internet 13 year old.

But supposedly he's been a member since 2008.  Weird.

Yep and thats me in my avatar with a new Audi A4 Cabriolet and twins that were both Geminis too, Tatiana and Katiana.

I call bull E36 M3 again. There is no A4 cabriolet, it's an A5 with a drop top. As someone who actually owned 3 A4's and an S4, I know this. Just stop kid.

Off topic posts should be sent in a pm, maybe then we can video chat and see what's real, because my avatar hasn't changed in 12 years and I only post photos of myself. That is not an A5, it is in fact a portly 2007 2.0T that I reflashed for 250hp and whistled at full throttle, still only a 15s car, but fun in the snow and over 100mph in the rain. I never looked at Audi the same again after that car, 3900 lbs. Then the R8 V10, talk about a rebadged Lamborghini that had an even higher redline. Models do like Audis though.

svxsti
svxsti Reader
11/20/20 10:49 a.m.
BlueInGreen - Jon (Forum Supporter) said:

The concept of something with an extra wide dual axle attempting to navigate cones in a parking lot is actually pretty hilarious.

That's me, taking chances, making mistakes, getting messy, but the width without a body will be no wider than a Lambo ;)

Indy "Nub" Guy
Indy "Nub" Guy PowerDork
11/20/20 11:11 a.m.
svxsti said:
Indy "Nub" Guy said:
svxsti said:
Indy "Nub" Guy said:

So, looks like you decided to buy a Boxster disguised as a Lambo Countach instead ?

 

I may not have a toy box like Jay Leno but the truck is being built on a Factory Five kit, should be ready by spring, and it will be a dually with Supercharged LS3.

Sweet!

Can you post some in-process build pics?  I'd like to follow along.  What size tires and rims and how are you attaching the rims together?  I assume you're not just going to use HEAVY Truck wheels and tires.

 

To avoid the cost of custom wheels we found some new 6 bolt 18x12 Fuel Wheels for $325 each for a 315/30R18s. They are a bit heavy, 45 lbs each.

If you want others to play along a home, you have to answer all questions above.

  • How are you going to attach these rims together to create your "dually"? 
  • How about some in-process build photos?
Indy "Nub" Guy
Indy "Nub" Guy PowerDork
11/20/20 11:23 a.m.

Did you get the idea from this Dirt Every Day episode?

BlueInGreen - Jon (Forum Supporter)
BlueInGreen - Jon (Forum Supporter) UltraDork
11/20/20 12:04 p.m.

Let’s do a real life test. There’s two 3500 Ram trucks at my work, one’s a dually. When it snows I’ll put the regular axle truck in 4wd and the dually in 2wd. They will have equal traction if I try to cross the field in back of the shop, right?

svxsti
svxsti Reader
11/20/20 12:25 p.m.
BlueInGreen - Jon (Forum Supporter) said:

Let’s do a real life test. There’s two 3500 Ram trucks at my work, one’s a dually. When it snows I’ll put the regular axle truck in 4wd and the dually in 2wd. They will have equal traction if I try to cross the field in back of the shop, right?

This would be a good test only if it were 60' times on tarmac. Assuming the tire sizes, cab and bed are the same the dually should be lighter. Would be better with a chassis cab.

BlueInGreen - Jon (Forum Supporter)
BlueInGreen - Jon (Forum Supporter) UltraDork
11/20/20 12:48 p.m.

In reply to svxsti :

Why? The laws of physics aren’t different between snow and a prepped track.

nocones
nocones UltraDork
11/20/20 12:57 p.m.

But that's not really how tires work.  You will have half the normal force on each tire.  At the same temperature, camber, and slip angle they will generate marginally more then half the amount of traction as a single tire.   This is becasue tire traction is not quite linear with increasing load.   

But you will be hauling around ~150 more lbs (90lbs of rim, 10lbs of dualy adapters, 60 lbs of tire) of rotational mass

And in cornering either your car will be 630mm wider, or you will have 25% higher rear weight transfer (Assume 60" TW before duallys added inboard).   Wider track impacts laptimes the severity of that impact is dependant on course, and increased rear weight transfer reduces overall grip at that end again because tire grip is not linear with incrasing load.  

And you will be unlikely to have equal temperatures in the tires compared to singles unless the vehicle is very heavy.    

This concept could work if the tire widths were optimized for vehicle weight distribution and the entire car designed to accommodate the unique design.  The Nissan Deltawing worked (We can argue later about how effective it was) and it's rear tires were almost 3 times wider then the fronts.   But the Deltawing looked nothing like a normal car with dual rear tires, nor was it designed like one.  It really was more like a 3 wheeler in dynamic design.  

There was a tire company that actually developed dual individual tires as a concept but ultimately determined that the weight was not worth any gains.  

Low contact pressure is a real thing.  I've seen 2WD Dualy's get stuck in level wet grass.  

The end result if executed well will look unique and certainly turn heads in a STANCEBOI sort of way but will not offer a performance advantage over properly selected individual tires.  

johndej
johndej Dork
11/20/20 1:06 p.m.

Found some of those secret toybox garage shots

New York Nick
New York Nick New Reader
11/20/20 1:16 p.m.

 

I've seen 2WD Dualy's get stuck in level wet grass.  

I've done it, with a dually and with a semi. It is shockingly eay to stick a semi in wet grass. Also fairly easy to remove if you don't sink in...

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