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wawazat
wawazat Dork
5/10/20 6:56 p.m.

Alright I'm not going to do the rear main seal.   I am going to do all the run out and alignment checks-flywheel, bellhousing parallel and concentricity.   I saw my parents and borrowed my dads dial indicator and magnetic base.  I'll dig in to that tomorrow.  

wawazat
wawazat Dork
5/30/20 4:06 p.m.

Well poop!   I was cleaning things up and took a better look at the oily bits I’d removed today.   The inside of the old cast iron bell was pretty gooey and with the Ford block plate separating the oil pan gasket from the bell housing the leak path must be the rear main seal.  I’ve already got the pan on and needed to drop the steering rack and front anti-sway bar to get that beastie installed.  I don’t want to ruin the clutch and nor do I want to get it on the road only to have the repair I could have done now back in my path so I’m putting it in reverse for a bit and am going to replace the rear main seal.  Yay for me!

wawazat
wawazat Dork
5/30/20 4:23 p.m.

In other news, I’ve weighed all the clutch bits and here’s the tally

Stock 1969 Ford bits

cast iron bell housing 32.4 lbs

cast iron 164 tooth flywheel 27.8 lbs

clutch and pressure plate 22.2 lbs

=82.4 lbs

Replacement bits

Fox body cast aluminum bell housing 11.1 lbs

Ram 157 tooth AL flywheel 13.8 lbs

Ram clutch and pressure plate 21.6 lbs

=46.5 lbs

Weight loss and now with fewer teeth!

The TKO I think is heavier than the top loader 3 speed which weighs 83.4 lbs (trans, tail shaft, shift linkages w/o shifter or fluid).  I’ve moved the TKO and my non calibrated lower back says it weighs more.  I’ll verify and update this post.  

wawazat
wawazat Dork
6/10/20 5:11 p.m.

After pulling the rear cap to replace the two piece seal I got some disheartening news, bearing wear on the rear main cap and the #8 rod cap.  I'm going to roll in new bearings-main and rod-and button her back up to keep moving forward with the TKO swap.  Onward and upward while rocking her like a hurricane at the advice of Angry.

Detroit guys-who can you recommend to me for machine work/rebuild on a 351 Cleveland?  I'm talking to Holbrook Racing Engines now and have quotes from two other sources-one in Lansing area and one out of state-with extensive Cleveland build resumes.  Quotes are remarkably similar and we'll see where Holbrook fits in the mix.    

 

Norma66-Brent
Norma66-Brent Reader
6/10/20 7:46 p.m.

Sucks to find that kinda damage. Good news is you will get it all addressed now and have many miles of enjoyment ahead!

jerrysarcastic (Forum Supporter)
jerrysarcastic (Forum Supporter) Reader
6/11/20 3:21 a.m.

I live on borrowed time with my 289, so I feel your pain here.  I agree the upside here is you’ll have a dead reliable powertrain you don’t have to worry about for a long time.

But yeah, it sucks when something like this throws a wrench in your progress. Keep rockin’ it!  \m/

wawazat
wawazat Dork
6/15/20 7:38 a.m.

Back to where I was again.  After specifying the correct engine of the three available Ford 351's (Cleveland, Windsor, Modified), the local parts store supplied the wrong bearings.  Yay!  New bearings would not be available thru them for a few days but Summit had them in stock.  With those now in hand I pulled all the caps and rolled out the old bearings and rolled in the new bearings.  I found a video where the poster used a section of copper tubing smashed flat to help move the bearing upper half out and that worked well.   I dropped the cap, a few light taps with a small screw driver on the edge of the upper shell to dislodge it from the tang and pushed it out.   Lifted the lower bearing out of the caps with a small pick then cleaned the caps.  I placed the bearings in position going for an equal amount of projection above the caps to ensure equal crush when clamped back up.  I used a lot of assembly lube on the bearings.  After I finished with the mains, I did the rods watching the caps alignment and then the rear main seal.  I offset the seal and used some sealant on the ends.  I torqued the mains in three steps and torqued the rod caps in two steps.  I used Permatex " The Right Stuff" and applied the pan gaskets to the block and cleaned up the oil pan inside and out due to fuzzy tumbleweed infestation from the giant poplars in our backyard.   Using the previously cleaned fasteners I installed the 4 larger corner fasteners first then installed the balance of the smaller fasteners  and tightened everything up.  

wawazat
wawazat Dork
6/15/20 7:40 a.m.

BTW-On the main bearings, I only saw copper on the lower half of the rear cap.  On the rod bearings I saw it on the top of 4 of the cylinders caps.  Not a bad job and glad I did it.  I'll post some pics later today.  

AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter)
AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
6/15/20 8:27 a.m.

In reply to wawazat :

motherberkeley a poplar right in its mouth.  that fuzz-ball E36 M3 gets everywhere!

wawazat
wawazat Dork
6/15/20 10:58 a.m.

Now on to the pics!

Copper tool.

Copper tool in use.  Most just needed some gentle pushes to get them moving and then gravity and oil film pulled them right to the bottom of the journal.  The groove shows that this is a top bearing.

So the rod bearings wouldn't feel left here is a pic of one of the uppers being coaxed along.  I used the pick on the back of the shell and lightly pried it against the rod.  Most walked right on out on the oil film.

Most of the tools

Bearing lube.  There is a bubble not a foreign contaminant shown.  Blood was shed though not on the bearings.

All buttoned up now

My Dad and I were texting back on forth during the day.  I took this shot about 11:00pm and sent it to him.  Notice the exhaust situation.  He asked if I was gonna fill it with oil and fire it up.  I declined.

wawazat
wawazat Dork
6/18/20 9:45 p.m.

I lifted up the motor last night to pull the 1” spacers I put in last year and watched the motor mount on the DS separate.  Crap.  Convertible motor mount bases/pedestals in 1969 and 1970 were different (lower) than coupe versions and the motor mount for coupe (and an E36 M3 TON of other Ford products) won’t work on the convertible pedestals.  No one offers the motor mounts for the convertible pedestals so I need to swap those out.  NPD MI has them in stock so tomorrow I’ll pick up new pedestals and motor mounts and swing them in place.

I did the exercise above to check clearance between the collector and the steering shaft.  Exactly one RCH.   I saw a fab shop close to my place while driving one day and gave them a shout.  Owner said yup, bring them in.  Today I stopped in at Dunn’s Welding with my marked up header and I should have it back Monday.  I pulled the pass side header tonight and they both go to ceramic coater next week.  

I met Patrick today and handed him some cash for a set of wheels and tires for upcoming matter transfer shows-turning solids into gasses with healthy application of throttle.  

AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter)
AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
6/19/20 8:34 a.m.

In reply to wawazat :

Sometimes one RCH is enough

wawazat
wawazat Dork
6/19/20 4:17 p.m.

I'm fine with none, one, or a bunch of themwink

I got a call this morning from Dunn's that the header mod is done!  Dropped it off at 3:00pm Thursday and at 8:15am Friday it's done.  Very nice!



Nice work with a comment that any mods needed won't be charged extra.   Again, highly recommend Dunn's Welding in Southfield if you need fab work!

wawazat
wawazat Dork
6/19/20 4:22 p.m.

I then made a road trip out to NPD for the motor mounts.  I need to install these to verify figment of the headers before getting them in for coating.  This weekends tasks include motor mounts, header fitment check and removal, flywheel runout and bellhousing runout checks then clutch install, clutch fork and throw out bearing and slave cylinder install to bellhousing then on to clutch hydraulic system install and pedal mods (remove worn out bushings and replace with bearings).

wawazat
wawazat Dork
6/19/20 4:27 p.m.

Wheels from Pat fit well enough for smoke shows though will probably get some thin spacers just to move them away from inner wheel wells.   Here's what happens when backspacing and offset aren't taken in to consideration.  

Derp fitment


 

Derp fitment dos

 

AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter)
AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
6/20/20 9:05 a.m.

Panasports look way better, IMO.

i have a pair of 6mm spacers I no longer need, they're yours for the taking.

wawazat
wawazat Dork
6/20/20 10:05 a.m.

I agree on the looks of the wheels.  18” are too big too.  That’s OK as these will be for hooning and other dumb auto stuff then sold off.  

Thanks for the offer on the spacers.  I’ll take them on loan only until the tires are done.  

wawazat
wawazat Dork
6/20/20 6:30 p.m.

For a day that should have been easy it’s been full of challenges for me.  I got up early and took a 2.5 mile walk then suited up for a ride and blasted around for a while.   Local Cars & Coffee was in full swing so I stopped in for a quick walk around.  Great mix of cars as always. Came home and made waffles and scrambled eggs for the family.

After breakfast I removed the passenger side motor mount assembly and went the install the new assembly but noticed pieces were missing.  Damn.  Called NPD and they had no more of the brand I wanted for the small block engine.  They had the other imported mount pedestal but it looked worse and used metric fasteners (WTH)?   So they broke open a set of those and gave me the pieces I was missing so I kept the first set I bought and went home with the pieces I was missing.   There goes an hour of road trip time.  Came home and wife was sick so I ran the kids around for a bit then got back on it.  Finished passenger side after some slight carbide burr clearancing.  Since I took the 1” tall spacers out the motor mount bolts I used were too long. Also, the OEM bolts that attach the motor mount to the pedestal were pretty tore up-threads missing and damaged, nuts had major burrs from lock washers so bought those too.  Barber had open seats so dashed in for a socially distant cut then back home.  Few more bolts lower the car then a shower so I can start making dinner.  

wawazat
wawazat Dork
6/22/20 4:25 p.m.

Good Fathers Day meant no work on the car until after kids were in bed.  Between the rear motor support and one of my car support jack stands I was able to muscle the motor mount on her passenger side in to position to fit the final bolt.  I rolled back to admire my work and noticed the drivers side mount looked odd.  The rubber had completely and cleanly separated from the steel structure.   Brand new Anchor, made in the USA, mount where the cleaner and adhesive had not been applied to the steel plate.  Another hour road trip and tonight the mounts should (???) be done.  

wawazat
wawazat Dork
6/23/20 9:04 a.m.

Frack.  Motor mounts, on the surface a simple bolt in set of parts, have mid-aligned themselves to confound me at every turn.   Three parts made at three separate factories in two different parts of the world, when stirred together with 50 year old American steel that may have been bounced off solid structure at some point in the past, just aren’t playing nice together.  

wawazat
wawazat Dork
6/24/20 9:54 p.m.

Creative use of ratchet strap and motor mounts are finally wrapped up.  

With the changes I made the engine is now 3/4” lower than when I started.  The header won’t clear the steering shaft now so tomorrow I’ll drop the rack and hopefully gain the clearance I need to get the header back in place.  

Norma66-Brent
Norma66-Brent Reader
6/24/20 10:15 p.m.

I feel your pain on this. One small change starts a waterfall effect. Then your just angry with were you are at

wawazat
wawazat Dork
6/25/20 5:04 a.m.

Work now becomes a sequence of events now that things are tighter.  No longer just throw it in.  

AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter)
AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
6/25/20 6:21 a.m.
Norma66-Brent said:

Then your just angry

not that there's anything wrong with that.

Norma66-Brent
Norma66-Brent Reader
6/30/20 7:40 a.m.

What's the depth on your derale electric fan?

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