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Berck
Berck Reader
3/5/22 8:50 p.m.

Fire suppression finally installed.  Stroud did, in fact, send the right bracket/clamps.  It's just the bracket looks short and the clamps didn't reach because the car is bent.  Some massaging with a sledge hammer and it fits fine now.  I hope to be done bending and flaring tubing for awhile.  The steel stuff is rough.

 

Driver side nozzle is under the steering column:

 

Codriver nozzle is under the soon-to-be-removed Terratrip.

 

Next up: I need to do something about the driver position.  Actually, the driver position is mostly fine.  Maybe a little higher than I'd like, but that gives me enough pedal clearance.  I can barely reach the steering wheel, which is easily fixed with the steering wheel spacer the car came with.  I think the original builder was taller than the previous owner.  Unfortunately, that does nothing for the shifter.  It's pretty hard to reach in 1,3,5.  I'm thinking I should buy some cheap ebay shifter and bend it.  Open to advice from Josh or any other E30 people reading.  (I don't really care whether it's a "short" shifter or not, except that short will probably also make it easier to reach).

irish44j (Forum Supporter)
irish44j (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
3/5/22 9:04 p.m.

I feel you pain on the tubing. I just bent the entire new brake and fuel lines for my other project e30 (all rusted out), which was a ton of work. IIRC the fire system I have has flexible hose not steel lines, which made things a lot easier. 

As to the shifter, hmm. I don't have any problem reaching mine (currently I have a Z3 shifter with the "tall" Condor Speed Shop knob, but I'm about to change to a very tall ebay short shifter setup that I've used before.  It's hard to give real advice here since we are all different sized people out there, so it's usually about messign with things until you can get it all right. 

I set up my seat to be good with the pedals since I can't change that distance. For the steering wheel I have the NRG quick release with the "short hub" plus a spacer (1" as I recall) which is about right for me. I like my elbows to have about a 45-degree bend when I have them at 10 and 2. Some guys like their arms straighter or more bent, it's all personal preference. I also have the steering column bolts drilled out and have about 3/4" of spacers in there to tilt the steering column down closer to my lap than stock (I just did it on my new e30 thread, in case it's not done on yours and you want to try it. It's easily reversible). 

Shouldn't be an problem bending the shifter, but if you can barely reach the wheel and can barely reach the shifter, maybe you're sitting too far back? How tall are you? I'm about 6'.  Also make sure you put your helmet on so you are sure it clears the cage. My car is a tight fit in headroom with the big Stilo helmet and my seat is practically on the floor. My codriver is about 6'2 and his seat is max low/max back and he rides with no cushion on the seat. Your roof bars may be tighter to the roof skin than mine....mine are not nearly as close as I'd like.

Berck
Berck Reader
3/6/22 1:30 a.m.

In reply to irish44j (Forum Supporter) :

I'm 6'2".  I initially had the seat the correct distance from the wheel/shifter and pretty low, but that left me really cramped in the pedal area.  I moved the seat up and kicked it back a bit, which made the pedal situation great, but made the wheel/shifter too far away.  Wheel is easy to fix, but the shifter is a bit trickier.  I could also fix it by just moving the seat higher up which would put me closer to the stock seating position, but my helmet would probably hit the roof.  Definitely thinking one of the tall ebay short shifters bent backwards a bit would end up being about right.

adam525i
adam525i GRM+ Memberand Dork
3/6/22 8:56 a.m.

In my E28 5 Series I had the Z3 shifter that Irisih44J talks about and didn't like how short it was so I changed it out for an X53 X5 3.0 shifter (part# 25117543190) that I bought through Schmiedmann. It gives a very similar throw to the Z3 but at stockish height and angled back towards the driver. For a race car like you have something like he mentions might be the better way to go from ebay etc, stock shifters have a rubber damper to take away some of the vibrations but that's not as important here.

The other spot you can adjust is the linkage from shifter to transmission, if you shorten that you will angle the shifter rearwards. Obviously you can only go so far but a small change there can make a big difference where your hand needs to be. I've built my own DSSR (dual shear selector rod) inpsired by this thread, I didn't bother with the threaded adjustable section in the middle and instead just used the square tube for the full linkage with holes drilled at both ends. For the hardware I used McMaster Carr 10 mm shoulder screws with the stock BMW nylon washers as bushings (the yellow ones, I had these already otherwise McMaster Carr likely has something) and self locking nuts to adjust the play. It's a really tight setup without any crappy clips involved and to make a new linkage just needs another length of the square tube, I did grind flats into the forward should screw so I can use an open end wrench on it as it's a bit tight to get an allen key up in there.

I'm 6' 3" by the way and have the same struggle as you, getting the pedals far enough a way that my long legs have room to work and the wheel close enough to me. My steering wheel adapter gets me some extra distance but I also have an extra generic ebay spacer as well, a deep dish wheel would be a nicer solution but I already have a Momo Prototipo that I'd rather not replace.

Berck
Berck Reader
3/6/22 2:19 p.m.

Thanks!  For $30 I think I'll try out one of the ebay ones first.  No big loss if it doesn't work.  The X53 shifter looks quite promising though, and might be my next attempt.

The car came with like a 4" steering wheel spacer, plus the quick release, plus it's a pretty deep dish wheel, so I should be able to put the wheel in my lap.  Which is good, because in its current position, it looks like the additional windshield bar might get in the way.  Probably going to have to relocate the light switch, too.

irish44j (Forum Supporter)
irish44j (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
3/6/22 4:04 p.m.

My headlight switch is pretty much hidden behind the a pillar support bar. There's literally just enough clearance to actually pull the light switch to the on position with about 5 mm to spare lol.

Berck
Berck Reader
3/6/22 8:58 p.m.

Some stickers make it seem real.

Haven't done the doors yet as I need to spend some time buffing the remnants of the 2017 Mt. Washington Hillclimb off first.

Berck
Berck Reader
3/13/22 10:03 p.m.

It's legal!  I think this weekend I've managed to accomplish everything necessary to call the car legal.  Still plenty to do, but the major welding hurdles have been accomplished thanks to my codriver and fellow Vee people.

Bending:

Notching:

 

 

Welding:

 

Top of the brace bars done:

Cutting:

 

Cursing:

Overall, great success!  I didn't get a photo of the finished bars yet, but they came out reasonably well considering the retrofit.  The must-do list is shrinking.  I need to paint the new bars, install a modern rally computer and intercom and sort out the shifter and I should be good to rally.

I went ahead and ordered a Bell Mag Rally because a Stilo L/59 was way too small even though I normally wear an L/60.  I exchanged it for an XL/61, which fits the top of my head but is astonishingly uncomfortable on my fat face.   There aren't a lot of rally helmets with coms available, so here's hoping the Bell works for me.

iansane
iansane GRM+ Memberand Dork
3/14/22 11:02 a.m.

Did that bar get continued down to that front node?

Berck
Berck Reader
3/14/22 11:40 a.m.
iansane said:

Did that bar get continued down to that front node?

Yup.  Rules say within 4" of the front foot, and this does that.  

iansane
iansane GRM+ Memberand Dork
3/14/22 11:52 a.m.

Noice!

Berck
Berck Reader
4/11/22 11:47 a.m.

Went for a bit of a shake-down drive yesterday, and got some pretty wicked lifter noise about halfway through.  Sounds not unlike it does before oil pressure comes up on start.  I still haven't pulled the valve cover or replaced the timing chain tensioner, which I plan to do.  Still, my experience with HLAs (mostly Miatas) is that they clatter when cold, not hot, so this is weird.  Also, not sure if the tach is off or what, but I got pretty close to 7,000rpm with no sign of a rev limiter.  These things do have a rev limiter, right?  It has a coil-on-plug conversion, I'm assuming that wouldn't change anything?

I will not be winning awards for my roll cage painting, unless there are extra points for runs/drips.

 

Motorsports season must be near:

irish44j (Forum Supporter)
irish44j (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
4/11/22 2:46 p.m.

It's possible that the ECU is chipped with a Conforti chip or similar. My recollection is that chip set my rev limiter to like 7,200 or 7,300 with the M42. 

But there is definitely a rev limiter cuz I used to hit it all the time lol

Berck
Berck Reader
4/11/22 2:54 p.m.

Good to know--I really don't want to have to worry about staring a tach to avoid popping an engine.  I should probably see how accurate the tach is.  I'm not used to driving things without a rev limiter except my Vee, and thanks to weird rocky mountain rules I have an engine that's pretty much impossible to over-rev as it just runs out of power before bad things happen.

So, I started it cold this afternoon and the lifter noise went away as soon as the oil pressure came up.  Note that it seems to take a lot longer than I'd like for oil pressure when cold.  Between 5-10 seconds before the gauge shows anything.  It's at about 55PSI when cold, and 25PSI when hot.  25PSI seems low-ish.  I'm running 0W-40.  All this makes me wonder if the lifter noise when hot is an oil pressure relief valve allowing the oil pressure to drop too much once the oil thins out?  I could try a -50 oil, but that seems like a lot?

r3vhappy
r3vhappy New Reader
4/12/22 10:55 a.m.

For what its worth, I've found that anything BMW with hydraulic lifters will have wicked valve tick once hot. Legitimately unsettling amounts of noise from the valve train when you pull off the track/autox/rally/whatever and I have never had any issues. 

Berck
Berck Reader
4/12/22 1:26 p.m.

In reply to r3vhappy :

Hey, that's a useful data point.  "Ignore the noise, it's not really a problem," is absolutely the kind of advice I like to hear!  I have zero BMW experience, so this is much appreciated.  I have read that stuck oil bypass valves are an M42 thing, to the point that BMW redesigned the part, but it looks like a real pain to replace it, and my oil pressure numbers don't seem that bad...

golfduke
golfduke Dork
4/12/22 2:06 p.m.
r3vhappy said:

For what its worth, I've found that anything BMW with hydraulic lifters will have wicked valve tick once hot. Legitimately unsettling amounts of noise from the valve train when you pull off the track/autox/rally/whatever and I have never had any issues. 

Your mileage may vary, but that's one reason why I run 50wt oil in my track car... it seemed to like the higher viscosity oil in heavy-duty use cycles. 

 

Crenshaw
Crenshaw New Reader
5/4/22 9:07 p.m.

Yo Berck, nice to meet you the other day!  Stoked to see another e30 to clog the paddock at CHCA events.  The car looks great!

 

Berck
Berck Reader
5/20/22 11:00 a.m.

Thanks, nice to meet you as well!  I think I'm ready for the hill climb this weekend.  Here's the car with gravel tires and proper rally wheels, finally.

But given the forecast for the weekend, I'm thinking maybe I should take the snow tires with me too.

Minor preparation updates... I switched to 5W-50 oil, and that gets me maybe 5PSI more pressure hot, but it'll still go into full crazy lifter clatter mode when hot.  My codriver said nope to the vintage Terratrip and gave me a Monit to install instead.

I had an instance where the starter didn't want to work for a few minutes.  Good battery voltage, but nothing other than a click from the starter.  Not sure what that's about, but I have acquired a replacement starter.  I haven't installed it yet because the old one is currently working and I'm worried about taking things apart the day before an event.  I'll take it with me as hopeful insurance that I won't need it.

I still haven't fully sorted the driving position.  I fixed my ability to shift into 1-3-5 by raising the rear of the seat a little.  This gets me higher than I'd like to be, and my helmet easily hits the cage above the door.  If I lower both the front and rear of the seat for better head clearance, my legs are way too cramped.  I would like to play with a really tall ebay shifter, but the shift linkage appears to be some custom threaded rod with nuts welded in place, and that looks like a mess I'm not ready to get into yet. 

Berck
Berck Reader
5/22/22 6:10 p.m.

Unloaded the car on Friday, woke up to Saturday morning to this:

Might have been fine rally weather, but the hillclimb folks were having none of it.  They postponed, then eventually canceled the event Saturday afternoon.  Nothing like doing all the hard/annoying parts of an event without getting to any of the fun stuff.

Crenshaw
Crenshaw New Reader
5/22/22 9:07 p.m.

Dude that was brutal.  My codriver and I were joking this morning about how exhausted we both were considering we basically just stood around in a snowy parking lot all day....

Berck
Berck Reader
7/10/22 12:34 a.m.

Ugh.  So... how bad is 1/2" total toe in on the front?

The starter has on several occasions taken 30 seconds before it decided to do anything.  Good voltage, just a bunch of nothing when I press the button.  Then, magically, it would work.  Figured the problem is most likely the starter, and it's only 2 bolts, so I decided to replace it before it gets worse.  One of those bolts is just inaccessible enough that I spent a couple hours on it.  I probably should have removed the entire intake manifold again, but I think I managed it without that.  I'm remembering how much I prefer to work on Japanese cars.  Anyway, starter replaced.  I'd take a picture or something, but I'm too annoyed and sore.  Seriously, I spent about as much time on that bolt as it takes me to remove the entire transmission from a Miata.

I had planned on taking the car to an alignment shop, but my favorite shop currently has no alignment tech.  Given that the rear isn't adjustable anyway, I figured I'd just do it myself.  There's camber plates in the front, so I could theoretically adjust the camber somewhat.  I measured -1.5 degrees on one side, and -1.8 degrees on the other in my garage without going through the bother of leveling the car.  Decided that was close enough, and checked the front toe.  1/2" of toe in seems like a stupid amount.  That's when I discovered that both tie rods are completely seized and there will be no adjusting either of them.

I've ordered replacement tie rods and boots and stuff which may or may not get here in time for me to work on it next weekend.  Rally Colorado is the weekend after, so I may just be driving with 1/2" toe in.  I figure it's probably better than 1/2" toe out:)  Otherwise, the car is pretty much ready to go.  I need to figure out how to secure a jack and impact gun in the trunk, and reposition one of the triangles so it's driver-accessible.  And re-read the rules to see what else I might have missed.  But I'm signed up and should be pretty much ready!

irish44j (Forum Supporter)
irish44j (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
7/10/22 8:15 a.m.

Toe in should be okay if Colorado is a high speed event, since that setup will add a lot of stability at speed, at the cost of some turn-in response. In any case changing out your tie rods is a fairly easy task.

Yeah everybody hates that starter bolt, which is an issue in all E30 engines! 

Why do you need the triangle to be reachable by the driver? Maybe I haven't read the rules recently but as long as it's reachable by the codriver you're fine. Ours It strapped to the door bars next to the co-driver seat.

Good luck at Rally Colorado!

Berck
Berck Reader
7/10/22 1:24 p.m.

Thanks!  If the parts arrive in time, I'll change tie rods and aim for 1/8" toe-in, otherwise I'll just drive it as-is.

Triangles--I was lazy when I said driver-accessible.  Should have said (co)driver-accessible.  "Three self-supporting, light-reflecting, daylight-visible triangular warning devices of a minimum size of 12 inches per side shall be carried in the vehicle. One of these must be located within easy reach of the driver or co-driver when seated."

All 3 of mine are in a box bolted behind the seats.  Need to move one of them.  Door-bar next to the co-driver sounds like a great choice.  Sorting the stuff in the trunk is going to take some time too, made more complicated by the fact that most of the trunk is occupied with a fuel cell.

 

Berck
Berck Reader
7/25/22 3:08 p.m.

I rallied!

The prep for Rally Colorado was complicated by the fact that the Race Against Kids’ Cancer in the Vee is the very next weekend. That meant I had to prepare two race cars before the event. Rally Colorado was a 5.5 hour tow away.  There are some pretty intense mountain passes between here and there with some first-gear switchbacks.

The service park for Rally Colorado was in a very green park in the middle of town. It takes a lot of watering to get grass like this on the western slope.


We checked in Thursday afternoon and spent 4 hours doing first pass recce for the first 3 stages. Rally Colorado is nice and simple with a single service park, 3 stages run twice on Saturday and another 3 stages twice on Sunday. We headed to our AirBNB in Utah and got some pizza and beer for dinner in Vernal.


Our scrutineering time block was 9:45 – 11:00am on Friday morning. We hoped it wouldn’t take much time, but boy were we wrong. It took about a half an hour wait for them to get to us, and it took us another 2 hours to get through. We needed to fix 3 things: a hole in my seat cover exposed some foam. They were happy with us patching it with gaffer’s tape. They couldn’t see the date on my fire bottle, so I needed to remove one of the metal straps that was covering it. In retrospect, I don’t understand why they wanted to see the date on the fire bottle–nothing in the rules says anything about the date on the SFI-certified onboard fire suppression systems. There is a note that says dry powder systems must be serviced annually (and my two handheld systems were), but nothing about the gas-filled on-board system. Finally, they complained about gaps in the rear firewall where the cage tubes penetrate. We “fixed” the latter with a bunch of speed tape. It took at least 3 attempts with more speed tape before they were finally happy with it.

Recce on Friday was long, hot and dusty. Probably extra frustrating for Jack since I basically had no idea what I was doing.


We managed a second pass through all of Saturday’s stages, but only a first pass through Sunday’s before we needed to be at Parc Expose. Which was also long, hot and dusty.

After that, we were instructed to parade up and down the main street of Rangely. A bunch of kids were there to watch, and some of the better-prepared crews even had candy to throw.

Sunday morning, all ready to go. We managed an off-by-one error where our start position of #27 meant that we were out at 10:26, not 10:27. Fortunately, I also simultaneously made the error of pulling up to the time control a couple of seconds early, and even though Jack handed them the card at 10:27:00, they gave it to us.


The first stage went fine despite my having absolutely no idea what to do. I started to get the hang of the notes by the end rather than just driving what I could see. It’s incredibly satisfying to be able to trust “right 6 over crest” when all I can see is the crest. We got close enough to the novice crew in front of us that the last 30 seconds were pretty scary with completely unpredictable moments of zero visibility.

At some point the voltage meter pegged at 17 volts, which seemed bad, but not bad enough that I was going to do anything about it. When we got the ATC for the second stage, I killed the car, but left the master switch on to run the cooling fan. Only, everything died with exactly no electrical power. I frantically examined the fuse for the signal wire to the solenoid, but it was good. The problem was more obvious: the negative battery terminal had become disconnected. Easy enough to put it back on to get the car running, but I didn’t have a wrench to tighten it down more.

The only other minor gripe about the car in the first couple of stages was the shift knob kept coming off. I have no idea why BMW makes everything so complicated, but I couldn’t figure out how the shift knob was supposed to work. What’s wrong with a threaded-on knob?

The second stage went even better. Where the first stage was fairly tight and slow, the second one had some long stretches of fast, open bits. I’m sure that with some confidence it could be taken close to flat out in this car, but as it was, our maximum speed of 82mph was plenty terrifying.

The third stage included a truly scary section with a crest, which if taken straight-on, would lead to a jump off a mountain. It was marked with caution signs, and we’d decided early on that we’d just slow to a crawl for that section. No problems there. A HAM-licensed (but still suspenderless) friend was working the radio checkpoint at a T-intersection where we turn right through a cattle guard. A perfect opportunity for a handbrake turn, but also a perfect opportunity slight right into the uprights on the cattle guard. I attempted the handbrake turn while Jack hit the horn, but didn’t commit hard enough. The car only rotated about 45 degrees then started pushing. Lame. Fortunately, I was also going slow enough that I didn’t hit anything.

After that the road opened up a bit, and I sped up and shifted into third. The HLA noise the car makes when the oil gets hot seemed to be getting even louder, and the car seemed low on power. I downshifted, but the car wouldn’t accelerate at all, even at 5,500rpm on mostly flat ground. The oil pressure was the same crappy 25psi it always is when it gets hot. I shifted back into 3rd and the power loss continued over the next 30 seconds until there was just nothing. I put the clutch in and the engine died immediately. So, I pulled off the side of the road and our rally was over.

It would crank fine, but something sounded off. Oil level was still at the top of the dip stick. I figured we spun a bearing, given the low oil pressure.

There had been some weird reshuffling of order after ATC but before start that no one explained or consulted us about. We were moved to last place, even though our times were faster than a couple of the other novices. Fortunately they also switched to 2-minute starts, so we were no longer in any danger of catching anyone. And it meant that we only had to wait for sweep to come pick us up. There was also another competitor who’d been stopped on stage that managed to get going again.

Amazingly, we actually had mobile phone service and I was able to get the wife and service crew to come pick us up with the trailer at the end of the stage. Sweep also towed us at a terrifying 40mph, which was problematic given that there was enough dust that we couldn’t even see the tow vehicle at times. Fortunately we survived.

We got back to service after the other cars headed back out on stage. The other service crews were all anxious to discover what had happened.

Dan pulled the spark plugs, and one of them really didn’t want to come out. Once it did, it became obvious that the problem wasn’t a bearing.


The cylinder was just full of mangled/melted metal. I’m guessing there was some kind of detonation event. Not really sure what would cause it in one cylinder–maybe a clogged injector that caused that cylinder to go lean?

I’ve now done what seems like an insane amount of work to get to drive about 40 minutes on stage, and I’m faced with a lot more. I do, at least, have a vague idea of what it’s actually like to drive in a rally now, and the taste was enough that I want more.

Someone in the service park inexplicably had kittens and offered one up for cuddles, suggesting that makes everything better.  It didn't hurt.

 

I’m not really sure what to do next. I’ll pull the M42 and see if it’s rebuildable. I wouldn’t be surprised if both the head and the block are beyond repair. People keep saying that M42s are easy to come by, but I’m not exactly seeing a bunch of them available for good prices. M20s seem much easier to come by, but if I’m going to go through the trouble of a 6 cylinder swap, should I pick something more modern like an M52?

Biggest factors are: I don’t want to spend the rest of my life getting this thing running again. I don’t know anything about BMW’s, which makes me wonder if diving right into a engine swap is the best plan. Dropping another M42 in there seems like the easiest thing, but will I regret not having taken the time to do the swap once I actually figure out how to drive it? There’s absolutely no chance of my ever placing in L2WD, so it’s not like switching to O2WD would be a big deal.

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