Formula 1-2021 Season

I think there still would have been complaints if both had gone out, just not a piling on with his celebration.  Apparently, Hamilton had a cracked wheel that the team was able to replace because of the red flag.  If they hadn't replaced it, who knows how it would have affected Hamilton's race.

I agree with the theory that Hamilton hasn't had to fight for a position in a long time.  He was usually able to take the safer route and back off if a pass wasn't 101% perfect because he was far enough ahead in the points that he didn't need to take the risk.  Verstappen has had to fight much more often than Hamilton over the past number of years, so it's almost commonplace to see him be aggressive.  Now that Hamilton needs to fight, I think some people are being much more harsh on him because they're not use to it.  Going back through his career, Hamilton can be aggressive when he needs to be and is usually clean about it (but has stepped over the line on occasion). 

Sadly, the whole thing taints a hell of a drive and weekend.  Hamilton was wringing everything he could from that car this weekend.  His Tokyo drift through Vale on his qualifying lap showed just how hard he was pushing it and how good he is to do that and still qualify first.

I respect RedBull for what they have accomplished in the sport and Newey's ability to design an incredible car.  Especially considering they're not a manufacturer based team and are still relatively young.  (In comparison to McLaren or Williams) However, I kinda feel like they can be the "Karen" of the F1 teams with their seemingly constant complaining, finger pointing and "everyone's out to get us" mentality.  Then again, they have a huge fan base, so their "new rich" mentality of shaking things up in the paddock against the stalwart, stoic "gentlemanly" traditions of F1 is probably good for F1 overall.  Everyone loves drama......

-Rob

AFAIK we haven't heard anything from Max on this, but I'd be very surprised if he thought that it was Lewis's intention to crash him out.  And yes, Horner/Marko's positions on the matter were pretty unreasonable, but they also had a brutal weekend that may cost them the whole season, and saw their top driver ride off in an ambulance.  I can't say I blame them for being emotional about it.

And once again, we see that Lewis luck.  Coming out almost unharmed from contact that could have easily been as bad for him as it was for Max, AND getting the red flag for car repairs to put him right back in the race.

Everyone talking about Lewis luck needs to think back to Baku just a month or two ago when he blew the chance to take a big lead in the championship. Or remember that he lost a tire - all by himself - at Silverstone just last year and had to counterbalance a three-wheeled F1 car at speed by using nothing but his giant testicles while the rest of the field was thundering up behind him. He's been lucky a few times, he's been unlucky a few times.

We have heard from Max, he's the one who tweeted that it was unsportsmanlike for Hamilton to be celebrating a win. But he was probably shaken up and all of his information would be coming through the Horner Filter, so I'm chalking that up under "maybe just don't tweet right away".

trigun7469 said:

In reply to rob_lewis :

I found it funny they nobody cared that Vettel spun, can you imagine if he was still at Ferrari....

Vettel may have shown his weakness in wheel to wheel racing again but I give him big respect for....

Vettel cool

In reply to Advan046 :

How many British fans still feeling the rivalry with Vettel would have made a bigger mess knowing he had volunteered to clean up?

He's still the driver I'd most like to hangout with away from F1, I think he is pretty down to earth and I bet his garage is one of the better/interesting ones.

In reply to ShinnyGroove (Forum Supporter) :

Had Horner and Marko not been talking smack for much of this season, especially attacking Hamilton for pointing out questions that people have- sure, it could be raw emotion.

But they have been the only ones who have been heating up the war of words between the two drivers.  

The irony of Hamilton pointing out questions are the whining that Red BullE36 M3 put on Ferrari when they found speed.  Horner and Marko are good at spreading blame and accusations, but horrible at taking it.  Sucks to be them.

Press conference 2 years ago.

In reply to AaronT :

Easy. The photo on the left it shows the result of Max running too tight a line mid corner after forcing both himself and Hamilton too far right at corner entry. Ridiculous as most every other battle into Copse shows the outside car go left. But Max screwed up and went too far right. Hamilton was just off the apex and they were aiming for the same mm of road. Hamilton had the inside line and was alongside thus it was his corner. But being just off the apex resulted in a penalty.

The Photo on the right shows how Leclerc went left to try and hold off the pass by Hamilton thus allowing them to make the apex and have room at the track out point. Both left room but Leclerc couldn't hang on at the speed he entered the corner and went wide. 

Clear now I hope. We need to get on with other business Lewis fans don't like wasting time on redbulle36 m3 like this.

In reply to AaronT :

WRT Horner's comment that you don't pass into Copes, they are the same photo.  This isn't rocket science to show that you can pass into that corner.

(in addition to the points Advan show)

One of my F1 friends said something interesting, I will have to rewatch to see what I think.

He said, "If Max did give enough room for he and Hamilton to enter Copse on the right side of the track both of them were probably going to be so slow out of the corner that they would be passed by Leclerc before Maggots and Beckets."

In reply to Advan046 :

You obviously missed the car width gap on the inside of Lewis' car in the pic with Max that doesn't exist in the photo with Leclerc.

Advan046 said:

In reply to AaronT :

We need to get on with other business Lewis fans don't like wasting time on redbulle36 m3 like this.

If it's such a burden to discuss the happenings of a Grand Prix on the internet you could choose to say nothing.

AaronT said:

In reply to Advan046 :

You obviously missed the car width gap on the inside of Lewis' car in the pic with Max that doesn't exist in the photo with Leclerc.

 

Yea, Hamilton apexed WAY to early with Charles.  The actual corner apex is way down from there.  Had Charles not missed the corner, he would have had a much better exit, probably.

Still, Hamilton DID get penalized, didn't he?  

Keith Tanner said:

Everyone talking about Lewis luck .... He's been lucky a few times, he's been unlucky a few times.

Hamilton could very well be sitting on 9 DWC, going for 10, if it wasn't for the mental error in China way back in 2007 on the pit lane entrance , and losing the engine in Malaysia in 2016.

So yeah, he's certainly not immune to misfortune.

In reply to AaronT :

Just responding to the meme format of management asking staff in an office setting. My response was along that same line as I experienced in the rougher offices I have worked. 

Actually the more likely response at that particular job would have been everyone looking at you for a solid 20seconds and if you didn't have anything else to say we would all walk out the meeting ignoring you. 

And I did see the space and even made mention of it. 

Let me repeat for you. 

• Max foolishly pushed Lewis and himself too far right approaching Copse. 
• Lewis owned the corner per the rules being on the inside and alongside.
• Lewis made a mistake by not making the apex.
• Max made mistakes before turn in, then trying to pinch Hamilton with his classic, "Let me go or we crash move"
• Result is a perfect pass by Hamilton per Horner's standards. 

In reply to AaronT :

If that last reply wasn't clear...I wasn't trying to attack you. I was responding aggressively, as others would in a prior workplace that games like the meme showed would be played.. and that would be what a staff person would say there regardless of gender.. to the fictional meme situation you posted. 

I mean you posted the meme to be silly right?

He could also be sitting on 7 if not for the Timo Glock last lap last curve spin. 

JimS said:

He could also be sitting on 7 if not for the Timo Glock last lap last curve spin. 

Glock didn't spin, he could not drive in the rain.  Much like how bald tires on a wet pit entry didn't work well the year prior.

JimS said:

He could also be sitting on 7 if not for the Timo Glock last lap last curve spin. 

Who can forget world champion Felipe Massa? 

Advan046 said:

In reply to AaronT :

If that last reply wasn't clear...I wasn't trying to attack you. I was responding aggressively, as others would in a prior workplace that games like the meme showed would be played.. and that would be what a staff person would say there regardless of gender.. to the fictional meme situation you posted. 

I mean you posted the meme to be silly right?

 

Yeah, posted the meme to be cheeky. I'm obviously team Max in the scenario, but ultimately it's not hugwly important to me. F1 doesn't pay my bills. Also, I'd be deemed partially responsible were I piloting either car in IRacing.

But I'm not privy to the the subculture you were playing on and thought the response unnecessarily pompous. Given context, I get it now though. No big deal.

alfadriver said:

JimS said:

He could also be sitting on 7 if not for the Timo Glock last lap last curve spin. 

Glock didn't spin, he could not drive in the rain.  Much like how bald tires on a wet pit entry didn't work well the year prior.

He could drive fine in the rain, it's just that he stayed out on "slicks" (actually the grooved dry tires they were using at the time) while everyone else pitted for wets.  That put him ahead, but vastly slower.

In reply to codrus (Forum Supporter) :

Just a matter of interpretation.  He didn't spin.

rob_lewis said:

I agree with the theory that Hamilton hasn't had to fight for a position in a long time.  He was usually able to take the safer route and back off if a pass wasn't 101% perfect because he was far enough ahead in the points that he didn't need to take the risk.  Verstappen has had to fight much more often than Hamilton over the past number of years, so it's almost commonplace to see him be aggressive.  Now that Hamilton needs to fight, I think some people are being much more harsh on him because they're not use to it.  Going back through his career, Hamilton can be aggressive when he needs to be and is usually clean about it (but has stepped over the line on occasion). 

100%. Hamilton has always taken the long view. He'd give up a corner if it let him win the championship. And now, he needs to take the corner to win the championship so the elbows are out. The risk/reward calculation has changed.

Max, on the other hand, had to win every corner even if it cost him places. We've seen this in the past, but he's matured in the past couple of years. Still, he's relied on scaring other drivers to give him extra room and, well, sometimes those drivers don't scare as easily as they used to.

Lewis is pretty darn good at wheel to wheel and Max is apparently unflappable when he's got a bunch of Mercedes in his mirrors. These two are in a class of their own, this year is far from over.

Yeah, he drove fine until last lap last turn. Has always smelled fishy to me. 

JimS said:

Yeah, he drove fine until last lap last turn. Has always smelled fishy to me. 

If you are talking about Glock, he wasn't the only driver crawling around on slicks- just the only one that mattered when Hamilton was driving around.