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alfadriver
alfadriver GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/22/21 3:13 p.m.

In reply to Advan046 :

The only reason Gasley would do that is to make up for the grid place penalty that Horner went out of his way to complain about the marshals about.

Streetwiseguy
Streetwiseguy MegaDork
11/22/21 3:23 p.m.

All things considered, whoever wins this year will have by God earned it.

We can count up engine penalties, or points left on the table  or whose fault a crash was  or who broke parts all day long, but either Max or Lewis is going to have a hard earned, well deserved championship...Unless one of them gets possessed by the mind of Michael Schumacher at the last race.

I'm fascinated by the whole deal.

Advan046
Advan046 UltraDork
11/22/21 4:36 p.m.

In reply to Streetwiseguy :

I have been excited about various seasons over the decades but this season reminds me of 2007 and 2008 with the teams and driver's having to keep pushing hard all season. With no clear advantage held at any point. 

z31maniac
z31maniac MegaDork
11/23/21 8:26 a.m.

My guy, Hamilton, basically has to win the next two races to seal the deal. Hoping he can do it! I've been a huge fan of his since he was a rookie....and nearly won if it weren't for that mishap at the Chinese GP on pit road. 

MrFancypants
MrFancypants Reader
11/23/21 8:57 a.m.
z31maniac said:

My guy, Hamilton, basically has to win the next two races to seal the deal. Hoping he can do it! I've been a huge fan of his since he was a rookie....and nearly won if it weren't for that mishap at the Chinese GP on pit road. 

If anybody can do it, it's Lewis.  Looking back at his record over the seasons the guy seems to compete on a whole different level for the last 1/4 of the season.

loosecannon
loosecannon SuperDork
11/23/21 8:07 p.m.

If Max and Lewis go into the last race tied on points, I have no doubt that Max would crash them both out intentionally if it looks like Lewis is going to get ahead.

759NRNG
759NRNG UberDork
11/23/21 9:14 p.m.
loosecannon said:

If Max and Lewis go into the last race tied on points, I have no doubt that Max would crash them both out intentionally if it looks like Lewis is going to get ahead.

I had a "heated"response to this quote....and almost pulled the trigger, but I will refrain .....the vitriol over this topic is so TOXIC that no semblance of  a measured, intelligent, respectful, discussion can be addressed on this topic in an adult frame of mind .....as I see it until perhaps it's all over??? 

cmcgregor (Forum Supporter)
cmcgregor (Forum Supporter) SuperDork
11/23/21 9:34 p.m.

For the record, I'm team Lewis but I'd be very surprised if either of them stooped to that level. They seem to have more respect for each other than their respective fanbases do. That said, it's a game of inches and they're definitely going to be pushing for every advantage they can get.

loosecannon
loosecannon SuperDork
11/23/21 10:12 p.m.
cmcgregor (Forum Supporter) said:

For the record, I'm team Lewis but I'd be very surprised if either of them stooped to that level. They seem to have more respect for each other than their respective fanbases do. That said, it's a game of inches and they're definitely going to be pushing for every advantage they can get.

Max has shown a willingness to drive dirty to win a race, he most certainly would do it to win a Championship. Lewis has very little history of such driving

alfadriver
alfadriver GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/24/21 6:28 a.m.

In reply to loosecannon :

That's how I have seen it, too- and not just this season.  Which is a shame, given how good a driver Max is- he certainly does not need to do that.  Nor does his dad need to be so inflammatory to everyone else- the mind games he tries to play on others is almost embarrassing.

alfadriver
alfadriver GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/24/21 6:31 a.m.
759NRNG said:
loosecannon said:

If Max and Lewis go into the last race tied on points, I have no doubt that Max would crash them both out intentionally if it looks like Lewis is going to get ahead.

I had a "heated"response to this quote....and almost pulled the trigger, but I will refrain .....the vitriol over this topic is so TOXIC that no semblance of  a measured, intelligent, respectful, discussion can be addressed on this topic in an adult frame of mind .....as I see it until perhaps it's all over??? 

If you can come up with counter examples, that would be a good way to change people's minds.  But so far, we have seen Max turn into Lewis more than once this season, let alone what he's done to other drivers in past seasons....

It's only toxic if you can't accept what Max had demonstrated on the road.

And don't mistake distaste for Max for being massive fans of Hamilton.  I didn't like Senna, and I didn't like Schumacher, and I don't like Vettel for the same reason.

Streetwiseguy
Streetwiseguy MegaDork
11/24/21 7:51 a.m.
alfadriver said:
759NRNG said:
loosecannon said:

If Max and Lewis go into the last race tied on points, I have no doubt that Max would crash them both out intentionally if it looks like Lewis is going to get ahead.

I had a "heated"response to this quote....and almost pulled the trigger, but I will refrain .....the vitriol over this topic is so TOXIC that no semblance of  a measured, intelligent, respectful, discussion can be addressed on this topic in an adult frame of mind .....as I see it until perhaps it's all over??? 

If you can come up with counter examples, that would be a good way to change people's minds.  But so far, we have seen Max turn into Lewis more than once this season, let alone what he's done to other drivers in past seasons....

It's only toxic if you can't accept what Max had demonstrated on the road.

And don't mistake distaste for Max for being massive fans of Hamilton.  I didn't like Senna, and I didn't like Schumacher, and I don't like Vettel for the same reason.

I came across a Formula 1 season wrap up video from 2009 or 10, and I was really struck by how much the Lewis highlights reminded me of Max currently.

Lewis did not spring forth from the forehead of Zeus as a fully developed racing driver...

alfadriver
alfadriver GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/24/21 8:39 a.m.

In reply to Streetwiseguy :

Even looking back, I can't recall that the same kind of driving Max does that makes people upset.  Can you link to some of those?  I remember him complaining a lot, but I don't see that the same as turning in on someone that is taking an appropriate line.  

I understand he was not a fully developed driver, but I just can't recall him being dirty, either.  More struggling mentally than that.

codrus (Forum Supporter)
codrus (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
11/24/21 11:54 a.m.

Heh, I just noticed that if Bottas scores podiums in the last two races of the season, he will then be tied with Barichello for the most podiums by a driver who isn't a world champion. :)

 

Streetwiseguy
Streetwiseguy MegaDork
11/24/21 12:17 p.m.

In reply to alfadriver :

Just go on YouTube and search for BBC season wrapup.  There's lots of them, and they bring back a lot of memories.

alfadriver
alfadriver GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/24/21 1:10 p.m.

In reply to Streetwiseguy :

I saw one, but didn't think something was terrible wheel to wheel.  Even searched why people hate Hamilton,  and the closest thing I could find is when Hamilton and Maldonado came together.  

Aggressive passes, that's fine.  Whining- check.  But driving into a car next to you?  Or barely trying to make a corner- not so much.  The event in Brazil showed that Lewis learned from the altercation with Nico where Lewis waited to turn the corner, and hit Nico who waited even longer.

And Lewis never cut off another driver going into a corner, like Max did with his teammate.

Sorry, I just don't see it.

codrus (Forum Supporter)
codrus (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
11/24/21 2:36 p.m.
alfadriver said:

I saw one, but didn't think something was terrible wheel to wheel.  Even searched why people hate Hamilton,  and the closest thing I could find is when Hamilton and Maldonado came

Back in 2008/2009 his car and Massa's seemed to be magnetically attracted to each other and they had a fair number of collisions, some of which were ruled to be Hamilton's fault.  Even then, though, there weren't allegations of intent the way there are now with Verstappen.

 

Advan046
Advan046 UltraDork
11/24/21 6:38 p.m.
codrus (Forum Supporter) said:
alfadriver said:

I saw one, but didn't think something was terrible wheel to wheel.  Even searched why people hate Hamilton,  and the closest thing I could find is when Hamilton and Maldonado came

Back in 2008/2009 his car and Massa's seemed to be magnetically attracted to each other and they had a fair number of collisions, some of which were ruled to be Hamilton's fault.  Even then, though, there weren't allegations of intent the way there are now with Verstappen.

 

You must be referencing 2008 mostly as in 2009 Massa was out most of the season. 

Also, am I to understand that you think Max, in his 7th year of F1,is is only now getting close to being as clean and formed a race driver as Lewis Hamilton was in his 2nd and 3rd year? 

Finally I think the point I would make is that in those instances (2007-2009), blame and penalties were given for far less that what Max has been doing and the championships were exciting. So this let them race off the track nonsense is just that, nonsense. 

loosecannon
loosecannon SuperDork
11/24/21 7:30 p.m.

Hamilton talks about how he want to be remembered as the purest of F1 drivers Autosport Interview with Hamilton

codrus (Forum Supporter)
codrus (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
11/24/21 7:34 p.m.
Advan046 said:

Also, am I to understand that you think Max, in his 7th year of F1,is is only now getting close to being as clean and formed a race driver as Lewis Hamilton was in his 2nd and 3rd year? 

I think "clean" in this case refers more to attitude and intentions, rather than to skills.  I think Hamilton was a cleaner driver in his rookie year than Schumacher was in his 15th (La Rascasse), for example.

 

Streetwiseguy
Streetwiseguy MegaDork
11/24/21 7:53 p.m.

I don't think Max is a dirty driver ( that wasn't my implication), but he is sure enthusiastic.  Lewis and Felipe  seemed to bounce off each other a lot, I think in 08. The video I linked really doesn't show much of Lewis, because the Mclaren sucked that year.  There was a controversy, and some political infighting, and RedBulls first win, and Jensens championship...  It's worth the hour to watch.

I'd forgotten all the stuff that happened in 09.

adam525i
adam525i GRM+ Memberand Dork
11/28/21 8:36 a.m.
New York Nick
New York Nick GRM+ Memberand HalfDork
11/28/21 9:07 a.m.

That's is too bad. He was an F1 power house. 16 championships is an amazing feat. 

Tom_Spangler (Forum Supporter)
Tom_Spangler (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
11/28/21 9:29 a.m.

A true legend of the sport, though not always the best guy to work for.

RIP, Sir Frank.

newold_m (Forum Supporter)
newold_m (Forum Supporter) Reader
11/28/21 11:44 a.m.

RIP indeed... This was a good video for Lewis taking him around Silverstone a few years ago:

https://youtu.be/rT5S8sV9ppY

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