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SEADave
SEADave Reader
10/10/13 11:37 a.m.

I was going to add that the 2.8 (or 3.1 or 3.4) and T5 out of the F-bodies is a nice swap for MG's, but it appears Mr. Spohn beat me to it.

What is a somewhat dissapointing drivetrain in the heavier F-body is apparently really nice in a 2200-2400 lb MG. Supposedly drops in like it was meant to go there, and even though you can't brag about your V8 it still has more power than the MGB's the factory raced at Lemans. I have no immediate plans for my BGT, but I still keep my eyes out for decent donors when I'm at the junkyard or looking at cheap F-bodies.

Blitzed306
Blitzed306 Reader
10/10/13 11:51 a.m.

I have always wanted to turbo a 3800SII Fbody, But since i've had a bolt on LS1 TA I think I would be disappointed. I know my friends GTP with headers and a slightly smaller pully runs mid 13's with street tires, I'm impressed with it, AVGs 27 mpg on the highway

HiTempguy
HiTempguy UltraDork
10/10/13 1:20 p.m.

I have nothing to add to this thread beyond I always read the title as "GM 60 derpgree V6" (I am following with interest though).

Toyman01
Toyman01 UltimaDork
10/10/13 2:05 p.m.

Well, I'm all hooked up and ready to go get it...and...the lady isn't answering the phone.

If it happens, it happens. If not, I'll keep looking.

Jaxmadine
Jaxmadine HalfDork
10/10/13 2:06 p.m.
novaderrik wrote:
Jaxmadine wrote: Its a decent motor. Id go with a 3.8 as stated. Always get the turbo setup from the older ones.
the old 3.8 that was in the Grand Nationals and T Types in the 80's is a totally different engine than the 3800 that was put in the 96-02 F bodies and in all those millions upon millions of fwd GM cars.. the only similarities are the displacement and bore centers... i can't think of one instance where GM put a turbo on the newer "Series X" 3800, but they have built a LOT of supercharged versions since the early 90's. the blown 3800 in my '01 GTP moves it around really good and i've been known to average 30mpg on long interstate drives with it.. regarding the 60 degree V6 engine family: why not get a 3900 out of a newer minivan and build off that? the one in my mom's '08 Uplander does ok for something that's dragging around 5000 pounds of power sliding doors and built in dvd player... i've seen pages on teh internets where people have swapped them into engine bays that used to have 2.8 and 3.1 engines in them with good results...

I mwnt the turbo off the old 60 degree motor. Not the 3.8.

Curmudgeon
Curmudgeon MegaDork
10/10/13 3:52 p.m.

Well, if the Camaro deal falls through I know that a nice N/A 13B with transmission will be up for grabs soon...

AquaHusky
AquaHusky Reader
10/10/13 4:25 p.m.

From everything Ive seen from modders of these engines, 7k RPM is about the most the stock blocks can handle. To get there, you will need to ditch GM mechanical rev limiters with the valve springs from a LS engine. The stock 60 deg springs love to float valves at around 5k RPMs. Also, dont forget about this version of the 60 deg engine family that has no swappable parts.

bigdaddylee82
bigdaddylee82 Reader
10/10/13 4:36 p.m.

In reply to AquaHusky:

This thread got me reminiscing my old Pontiacs, I had two 3100s back in the day, a '90 and a '94. When I used to lurk on 60degreeV6 I always had a fondness for the LQ1, on paper I always thought it seemed awesome, but from everything I've read about them they appeared to be a maintenance nightmare. Just anecdotal, I have no real world experience with them.

  • Lee
novaderrik
novaderrik PowerDork
10/10/13 5:06 p.m.
AquaHusky wrote: From everything Ive seen from modders of these engines, 7k RPM is about the most the stock blocks can handle. To get there, you will need to ditch GM mechanical rev limiters with the valve springs from a LS engine. The stock 60 deg springs love to float valves at around 5k RPMs. Also, dont forget about this version of the 60 deg engine family that has no swappable parts.

ahh, yes... the DOHC 3.4. i had one in a 94 Lumina 4 door that was pretty quick... but i didn't want to ever have to replace the alternator if it went out, and it was due for a timing belt change soon... also, it only got 26mpg on a good day... it also had a bad solenoid or something in the trans that caused it to blow the fuse and only have 2nd and 3rd gears... so i put a fuse in it and traded it even up for a 94 9C1 Caprice at a junkyard...

Strike_Zero
Strike_Zero SuperDork
10/10/13 6:10 p.m.

In reply to novaderrik:

The great and terrible (depends who you ask) LQ1.

Edit:

Interesting note . . . LQ1 weighs something like 460-490lbs

carbon
carbon Reader
10/10/13 6:18 p.m.

Isn't there a Lt1/t56 combo in the classifieds section on here for $1200bo right now? Just sayin. Mild boost that and you've got somethin. Probably worth a e36m3load more when you go to sell it too.

Jaxmadine
Jaxmadine HalfDork
10/10/13 10:55 p.m.
Strike_Zero wrote: In reply to novaderrik: The great and terrible (depends who you ask) LQ1. Edit: Interesting note . . . LQ1 weighs something like 460-490lbs

I believe it. Friggin cams are captured in a case tje size of the heads. They arnt terrible to work on. Just as bad as any other early 90s gm product. I drilled a hole im the cylinder wall of one and fixed it once. wasnt too bad...

novaderrik
novaderrik PowerDork
10/11/13 12:10 a.m.
Jaxmadine wrote:
novaderrik wrote:
Jaxmadine wrote: Its a decent motor. Id go with a 3.8 as stated. Always get the turbo setup from the older ones.
the old 3.8 that was in the Grand Nationals and T Types in the 80's is a totally different engine than the 3800 that was put in the 96-02 F bodies and in all those millions upon millions of fwd GM cars.. the only similarities are the displacement and bore centers... i can't think of one instance where GM put a turbo on the newer "Series X" 3800, but they have built a LOT of supercharged versions since the early 90's. the blown 3800 in my '01 GTP moves it around really good and i've been known to average 30mpg on long interstate drives with it.. regarding the 60 degree V6 engine family: why not get a 3900 out of a newer minivan and build off that? the one in my mom's '08 Uplander does ok for something that's dragging around 5000 pounds of power sliding doors and built in dvd player... i've seen pages on teh internets where people have swapped them into engine bays that used to have 2.8 and 3.1 engines in them with good results...
I mwnt the turbo off the old 60 degree motor. Not the 3.8.

the turbo they put in the 3.1's in some Grand Prixs for a couple of years? good luck finding that setup...

kanaric
kanaric Reader
10/11/13 4:50 a.m.

cool, different idea.

Toyman01
Toyman01 UltimaDork
10/11/13 5:56 a.m.

Well, I never got a call back from the lady, so I might be looking for another car.

Such is life.

Blitzed306
Blitzed306 Reader
10/11/13 6:42 a.m.

I had no idea the 60 degree v6 was such a polarizing engine

Dusterbd13
Dusterbd13 Dork
10/11/13 8:11 a.m.

i love them, myself. used a camar 3.4 in my old s10. porting/cleaning up the intake and headers really woke the old girl up.

always wanted to use this engine in a track-t with 3500 aluminum heads and intake and a good cam.

also always wanted to try boost.

great little motors. the tbi 2.8 in teh s10 did 200k woth of daily driver, plus close to 600 miles at cmp before i yanked it, with no issues. also got 30mpg with a little light tweaking and a 5 spped/3.42 gears.

michael

AngryCorvair
AngryCorvair GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
10/11/13 8:14 a.m.
carbon wrote: Isn't there a Lt1/t56 combo in the classifieds section on here for $1200bo right now? Just sayin. Mild boost that and you've got somethin. Probably worth a e36m3load more when you go to sell it too.

nope, it's only the trans stuff, that once lived behind an LT1.

Toyman01
Toyman01 UltimaDork
10/11/13 8:50 p.m.

Well, I guess she sold it out from under me. Not answering the phone and now the add is gone.

Oh well, back on the hunt for a Camaro.

patgizz
patgizz GRM+ Memberand UberDork
10/11/13 9:10 p.m.

i love LQ1 like nobody's business. one day i'm going to rwd one with a t5.

i prefer 60* over a 3800.

back in the day my 94 lumina started with a 3.1/auto. then it got a LQ1, then a 3400 pushrod.

Toyman01
Toyman01 UltimaDork
10/11/13 9:13 p.m.

Car-Part says a local yard has a 3.4 and MT on the yard. We'll see what they say Monday about pricing.

Vigo
Vigo UberDork
10/11/13 11:55 p.m.

Shouldn't be hard to fine one. Every time im on CL clicking a camaro or firebird hoping it's a 3.8 it turns out to be a 3.4. EVERY TIME. So they must be common.

Toyman01
Toyman01 UltimaDork
10/12/13 2:14 p.m.

They are common as dirt around here, but 95% of them are automatics. Finding a 5 speed is tough.

Toyman01
Toyman01 UltimaDork
10/12/13 9:21 p.m.

I might have solved my problem for no money.

I technically own a 95 Camaro with a 5 speed and a 3.4L V6 that my daughter drives. I bought it for her when she graduated HS. It's in my name, but it's her car.

I have a 89 Thunderbird SC. I've been thinking about selling it since I bought the E24. It's been sitting for the most part.

I proposed a trade to my daughter. My SC for her Camaro. The SC is in better shape than the Camaro, so it would put her in a better car. The Camaro isn't too bad off, but it is starting to show it's miles.

The only hold up would be, she likes her car. She likes that it's different. She's the only girl at the school that doesn't drive some boring econobox. I did point out that she would probably be the only female in the country that drives a SC and probably the only person under the age of 40.

We'll see if she takes the deal. She's probably going to take it back to school tomorrow to try it out. If she is lucky her Camaro with still have an engine when she gets back.

I just had another thought. I've got a T56 in storage for a LT1 engine. I happen to know where a LT1 engine is sitting with wiring harness and ECU. A little mix and match, I end up with the engine and transmission I want for the RX-7 and a V8, 6 speed F-body.

Things are looking up.

novaderrik
novaderrik PowerDork
10/12/13 10:02 p.m.
Blitzed306 wrote: I have always wanted to turbo a 3800SII Fbody, But since i've had a bolt on LS1 TA I think I would be disappointed. I know my friends GTP with headers and a slightly smaller pully runs mid 13's with street tires, I'm impressed with it, AVGs 27 mpg on the highway

just scanning thru the thread again and this post caught my eye...

there's a few GN guys that swapped unopened junkyard fresh F body 3800's with big turbos that are claiming 9 second 1/4 miles times and getting mpg numbers in the mid 20's on the way to the track with the AC blowing cold... is that faster than the bolt on LS1 you used to own?

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