Has anybody used Porterfield R4S for mild track use?

Looking for brake pads for the MR2 and I'm in a hurry, as usual. My go-to pads (Hawk HP+) doesn't appear to be listed for rear brakes anymore and in general, if you don't want EBC, there's a distinct shortage of pads.

Internet Wizdom has it that R4 and R4-E compounds don't work that well on the street, so the question is, how well do R4-S work on the track? Or do I now have to expect to change pads at the track and before I drive home again?

As much as I like this MR2, the parts situation for the 2nd gens isn't getting any better.

I used the R4s for an hpde track day once, glazed them over pretty good. Used the R4 for the next one and they worked well, noisey as heck when cold but not bad when hot but you aren't gonna get them up to temp on the street. No experience with the R4e though.

R4s are great for autocross though. On a light car you might not have a problem with them or on a track that doesn't have a lot of hard braking zones.

Well, not sure how much this'll help you. I never use Hawk HP+ pads on the track. IMO, they flash melt, giving you no braking ability at all. They're not meant as true track pads and I can easily overwhelm them. They're ok for novices, but from what I've gathered, that's not you.

The R4S is much the same temp range as the HP+, as such, I wouldn't use it.

For my cars I use Hawk DTC70's all the way round and I've had good luck with the PFC race compounds from their 01 up to the 06. Haven't tried the 08 or 11's yet...

Tried R4S at the track with my FD on summer tires years ago. They glazed the rotors pretty quickly. You can get to/from the track just fine on R4 pads though I probably wouldn't drive them daily. If you can source them for your car I'm very happy with the Hawk DTC line of pads. I put them on at home and drive to the track, so they are streetable, but very noisy and hard on the rotors when cold.

I used to use them on my CRX for track stuff. They worked great, were very easy on rotors, but don't expect to get a ton of life out of them.

What's your experience level? You should be fine for a day or two on R4-S if you're a beginner. Otherwise you will crystallize and disintegrate them in one session. They will literally crumble to pieces when they get too hot.

I have used R4 on the street. They work fine. That's in SoCal though. If it actually gets cold where you live, it's probably not a good idea.

I tried them a long time ago when I was still trying to take a street car to the track. They might be fine on a very light car or if treated daintily knowing they cannot take any real abuse... but on a 3100lb car (E36M3) at the Glen they were closer to the garbage end of the spectrum.

Project Mu?

Your MR... before or after 12/91?

http://www.project-mu.co.jp/matching/usa/TOYOTA_application.pdf

US importer/distributor: http://www.mackin-ind.com/

http://www.project-mu.co.jp/usa/products/index.html - pad descriptions

This is relevant to my interests.

I'm planning on taking the AW11 to a track day here soon and I need new pads BADLY. It's around 2300lb, 100hp (crank, if I'm lucky), and doesn't get driven on the street that much anymore. However, I do take it out occasionally. I always thought I'd need to run two sets of pads, but I'm willing to put up with some noise, dust, and diminished rotor life if I can run the same set in both environments.

So... R4 sounds ok as long as it's not winter?

<--- ATLien here.

Porterfield does not recommend R4 for street use so I can't either. I have gotten away with it though and never noticed any problems with the brakes. It was never below 60*F though.

I ran them on my Miata. At the track, sometimes the pad material would transfer to the rotor creating a nasty pulsing through the pedal with nifty grinding sound. Eventually the transferred material would wear off, but it was not fun.

oldeskewltoy wrote: Project Mu? Your MR... before or after 12/91?

93 turbo, so it should have the bigger brakes.

Yes...don't. I had them to the backing plates on one track day on a relatively light, low-powered (by modern standards) car.

Hint: It was an MR2.

PS: Carbotech XP12 front, XP10 rear is what CT Brakes recommended. I went on to put about 4 track days on them and they weren't even half-used.

In reply to Tyler H:

Are these usable on the road as well or are these track-only pads like the R4/R4E?

I've run them on the track. 1.6 Miata with a 1.6 Voodoo turbo system and some 205/50-15 RA1s. Depends on the track, at Pueblo I could run 9/10ths but not 10/10ths without them getting smelly. No ill effects otherwise, but I do tend to drive with a fairly high level of mechanical empathy.

LuxInterior wrote: I ran them on my Miata. At the track, sometimes the pad material would transfer to the rotor creating a nasty pulsing through the pedal with nifty grinding sound. Eventually the transferred material would wear off, but it was not fun.

Exactly what happened to mine as well. Easy way to clean that crap off the rotors is to swap in a Hawk race pad and run it cold for a few miles ;P

Look into the Hawk DTC. I run DTC 60 on my Spec Miata. Love 'em. Have driven the car to the track on them w/o issue. Maybe look into the DTC 30s to make it a bit easier on the street if you plan to drive it alot on the street.

So far I seem to be drawing a blank - apart from Porterfield and Carbotech, most of the manufacturers only list front pads, if any.

So it looks like I might either have to swap pads between uses or drive one something that doesn't work that well in a DD environment.

What about EBC Yellowstuff? Those are a good streetable track pad.

For an AW11, front model is DP4453R, rear is DP4602R.

BoxheadTim wrote: So far I seem to be drawing a blank - apart from Porterfield and Carbotech, most of the manufacturers only list front pads, if any. So it looks like I might either have to swap pads between uses or drive one something that doesn't work that well in a DD environment.

In the title you mention "mild" track use. I honestly think the R4S's would be fine for that. I did driving schools with my turbo CRX using them and was running competitive IT times at Mid-Ohio for 1/2 hour sessions and didn't have any problem with them. I did use up the front pads over the course of the weekend, but they did make it, and my rotors were in great shape at the end.

amg_rx7 wrote: Look into the Hawk DTC. I run DTC 60 on my Spec Miata. Love 'em. Have driven the car to the track on them w/o issue. Maybe look into the DTC 30s to make it a bit easier on the street if you plan to drive it alot on the street.

I race on Hawk DTC-60/70s and or Performance Friction 01/11s. They are fantastic race pads that are very easy on rotors WHEN AT PROPER TEMPS.

You have to swap them out in the paddock if you are driving the car home a long way or doing a lot of street driving in general. They will eat themselves and rotors very quickly when cold and having to depend on their mechanical grip for braking. They need to be hot for the chemical "glue" to do it's job. There is no way you can get them hot enough to work properly on the street. They even struggle to maintain temps on cold track days in the northeast (40s in the AM) such that you have to drag the pedal on the straights to keep them lit. Obviously, you "could" drive them around a bit like to/from a hotel but I wouldn't leave them in for any longer than necessary. It is just wasting money.

GameboyRMH wrote: What about EBC Yellowstuff? Those are a good streetable track pad.

I don't like EBC stuff. Bad experience in the past.

GameboyRMH wrote: For an AW11, front model is DP4453R, rear is DP4602R.

Yebbut, I don't have an AW11 .

I ran them on the track for several years. They worked great with a naturally aspirated Miata, but once I put the turbo in they rolled over and cried uncle after 2 laps.

Tim, I think Gameboy might be referring to my AW11 threadjack. Sorry to muddy up yer thread!

Oh whoops I missed the "2nd gen" and assumed it was an AW11.